Problematic AGA demos.

[amilo3438]

Picture Book/Axis seems now working in todays new test winuae version.

btw. I couldnt manage to repeat crashing winuae yesterday but have noticed in 2710b6 that the Windows Task Manager process winuae.exe eats lot of memory after the 2nd disk has been inserted in drive ... so maybe this was the reason for the crash (the winuae process was raised from some 95.000K to over 800.000K very quickly).

Vision Thing BBS & Endor BBS (Intro) by Infect -> http://janeway.exotica.org.uk/release.php?id=10259

A1200 ()(2710b6) ... stop working after it shows first screen !!!

[Toni Wilen]

Originally Posted by amilo3438

Vision Thing BBS & Endor BBS (Intro) by Infect -> http://janeway.exotica.org.uk/release.php?id=10259

A1200 ()(2710b6) ... stop working after it shows first screen !!!

A1200 confirmed. It is broken. But version included in Under the Surface 9 pack disk works fine.

EDIT: Data at offset $20d21 and later has been shifted by one byte. Someone broke it.

[amilo3438]

The Breath of the Muse (Demo) by Chryseis & Poseidon -> http://janeway.exotica.org.uk/release.php?id=10095 (DMS version)

The Breath Of The Muse (Final version) -> http://cyberpingui.free.fr/oldiesdmosaga.htm (ADF version)

A1200 (Basic no-expanded)(2710b6 test 2014-02-08) ... after loading got guru -> pic.1

p.s. It could happen that it only needs KS 3.0 rom instead of KS 3.1 ?! (because cant happen that both DMS and ADF version are broken)
p.s.2. But also, only testing the demo on an real A1200 with both KS versions can solve the dilemma, right ?

(Hm, does a newer versions of AmigaForever also comes only with KS 3.1 for an A1200 ... as I cant find KS 3.0 for A1200 in AF2008 version ?!)

-------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------
EDIT:
Quote from A1200 wiki -> http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Amiga_1200

"The first incarnation of the A1200 shipped with Workbench 3.0 and Kickstart 3.0 (revision 39.106), which together provide standard single-user operating system functionality and support for the built-in hardware. The later Amiga Technologies/Escom models shipped with Workbench 3.1 and Kickstart 3.1 (AmigaOS 3.1), though earlier A1200 models can be upgraded by installing compatible Kickstart 3.1 ROM chips."


So I am currently compatible only with AT/Escom A1200 model.
Ok, hope this should be then enough for A1200 demo testing ... but problem could come from those demos made before 2005/2006 (maybe).


EDIT2:
Have also found this:
Re: Amiga Technologies A1200 Vs. Commodore -> http://www.amiga.org/forums/showpost...7&postcount=12
--------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------

Now wondering, what version of an A1200 mb the WinUAE emulates ?! (or both, depending of what KS is inserted, right?)

[Toni Wilen]

Originally Posted by amilo3438

p.s. It could happen that it only needs KS 3.0 rom instead of KS 3.1 ?! (because cant happen that both DMS and ADF version are broken)
p.s.2. But also, only testing the demo on an real A1200 with both KS versions can solve the dilemma, right ?

It works in emulation with 3.0. You really need to use it (or at least use both). 3.0 vs 3.1 did introduce quite a bit under the hood differences, for example system vblank interrupt modifies more custom registers than 3.0 and 3.1 wasn't that common until later.

Now wondering, what version of an A1200 mb the WinUAE emulates ?! (or both, depending of what KS is inserted, right?)

Standard Amiga floppy drive of course. ESCOM (stupid) "drive setting" is available in floppy config panel if you really need it..

Version of MB makes no difference, except compatibility with expansion hardware and stability

[amilo3438]

Salt (Demo) by Void & The Star Alliance -> http://janeway.exotica.org.uk/release.php?id=70484

A1200 (4Mb-expanded)(2710b7) ... some glitches appear -> pic.1


Dusted (Intro) by Void -> http://janeway.exotica.org.uk/release.php?id=27914

A1200 (4Mb-expanded)(2710b7) ... got a guru meditation error after part -> see pic.2


(ps. @heavy ... you finally got something to check )

Originally Posted by Toni Wilen

It works in emulation with 3.0. You really need to use it (or at least use both). 3.0 vs 3.1 did introduce quite a bit under the hood differences, for example system vblank interrupt modifies more custom registers than 3.0 and 3.1 wasn't that common until later.

btw. also finally managed to get this KS 3.0 from C=/A1200
winuae.log -> 00F80000 512K/1 = 512K Kickstart ROM (6C9B07D2)

...and yes, the demo "The Breath of the Muse / Chryseis & Poseidon" works fine only with 3.0 in WinUAE ...

So now I have both versions and can continue the search for other A1200 demo problems.

p.s.
And also, you know what, there is a very high probability to I might get an used A1200 ...
so now I am in dilemma, to buy ACA500 for my old A500 or to buy an used A1200 and have both ?!

p.s.2
I finally got an ACA500!

[amilo3438]

Bjarne (40k Intro) by Stone Arts -> http://janeway.exotica.org.uk/release.php?id=10273

A1200 (no-expanded)(2710b7) ... some glitches on top of (overscan) screen, partly visible in filter Fullscreen (TV) also -> pic.1


Rush (40k Intro) by Stone Arts -> http://janeway.exotica.org.uk/release.php?id=10276

A1200 (no-expanded)(2710b7) ... some anomalies -> pic.2 & 3


Vidar! (Intro) by Stone Arts -> http://janeway.exotica.org.uk/release.php?id=10587

A1200 (no-expanded)(2710b7) ... very strange behaving -> pic.4 (p.s. on 4mb-expansion behaves better, but anyway !!!)

p.s. -> perhaps CPU timing issue !!! (it works fine if CE=OFF also on non-expanded A1200)


Cubic Dream (Demo) by TRSI -> http://janeway.exotica.org.uk/release.php?id=3406

A1200 (no-expanded)(2710b7) ... BLITTER: register modification during linedraw! -> happening on part (on disk2) -> see pic.5


Lethal Dose 2 (Trackmo) by Faculty -> http://janeway.exotica.org.uk/release.php?id=10296

A1200 (no-expanded)(2710b7) ... some glitches -> pic.6


Live in Himmerland (40k Intro) by Focus Design -> http://janeway.exotica.org.uk/release.php?id=818

A1200 (4Mb-expanded)(2710b7) ... some strange line (also partly visible on Full(TV) filter) -> pic.7


Blur (40k Intro) by Focus Design -> http://janeway.exotica.org.uk/release.php?id=10285

A1200 (no-expanded)(2710b7) ... leaking on left side -> pic.8


p.s.
I do not know why, but this testing A1200 AGA demos seems far less exciting than the A500 OCS / ECS ... whether it is a problem in demos itself, too boring, monotonous, or there has been a slight over-saturation of almost everyday testing ... honestly, no excitement anymore and very low motivation, so it's time to take a break for a while.

[amilo3438]

WinUAE crashed very badly, I even had to turn off my laptop as Ctrl+Alt+Del didnt work.

This happened while was testing the demo:
Real Fd (Demo) by Focus Design -> http://janeway.exotica.org.uk/release.php?id=819

and in one moment, after pressing F12, wanted to change the QS config from A1200 4Mb expanded to basic no-expanded to see does it work in this config, and probably after reset it crashed.

EDIT: Interesting, cant repeat that crash again ... probably for above mentioned crash, there were a few other demos tested before it crashed on the mentioned demo, perhaps all demo testing was done without closing the WinUAE.
Yeah, if I would close the emu before running every new demo, probably such crash will not happen ... but its so boring to close and open the emu every time.

Also, reset from WinUAE properties should prepare a memory to be clean as it is started from beginning, right ...?!

[Toni Wilen]

Originally Posted by amilo3438

Blur (40k Intro) by Focus Design -> http://janeway.exotica.org.uk/release.php?id=10285

A1200 (no-expanded)(2710b7) ... leaking on left side -> pic.8

This was bug introduced in recent betas. Fixed now.

p.s.
I do not know why, but this testing A1200 AGA demos seems far less exciting than the A500 OCS / ECS ... whether it is a problem in demos itself, too boring, monotonous, or there has been a slight over-saturation of almost everyday testing ... honestly, no excitement anymore and very low motivation, so it's time to take a break for a while.

Yes, I agree 100%. Most AGA demos are boring, nothing new compared to A500 demos (except slooooooowwww color fades). And pixel soup of course too.

[amilo3438]

Pandemonium (Demo) by Sepultura -> http://janeway.exotica.org.uk/release.php?id=17154

A1200 (no-expanded)(2710b7) ... This one is somehow strange, it doesnt say that its for AGA but got it to work only on AGA ... black screen (mostly) and some music play !!!

EDIT:
Another crash similar to post #28 ... attached below!

Originally Posted by Toni Wilen

Yes, I agree 100%. Most AGA demos are boring, nothing new compared to A500 demos (except slooooooowwww color fades). And pixel soup of course too.

Yes, because my approach to AGA demo testing was wrong from beginning ... as it needs to test demos by years and not by groups. So will start again but this time will check only years 1993, 1994 and probably 1995 - as those demos after seems to require a faster CPU, more memory and all what was already said ... appear to be boring.

[amilo3438]

First AGA Demo (Trackmo) by Access -> http://janeway.exotica.org.uk/release.php?id=25036

A1200 (no-expanded)(2710b8) ... seems music slows down on part with color circles -> pic.1 (perhaps CPU timing issue !!!)


Subliminal XTC (Trackmo) by Mirage Uk -> http://janeway.exotica.org.uk/release.php?id=26790

A1200 (no-expanded)(2710b8) ... very noticeable slowdown of music play on part with color changing -> pic.2 (perhaps CPU timing issue !!!)

(p.s. To quick access the problematic demo part can also press F2 after insertion of B-disk! -> http://kestra.exotica.org.uk/files/s...000/29223e.png)


Viewpoint 5 (Packdisk) by Lego -> http://janeway.exotica.org.uk/release.php?id=17499

A1200 (no-expanded)(2710b8) ... strange glitch on 1st (andromeda) demo - cube rotation part (it doesnt happen on 2.6.1) -> pic.3

in addition:
2nd demo (by complex) doesnt work...?!
4th demo (by genocide) has some glitches -> pic.4


Viewpoint 4 (Packdisk) by Lego -> http://janeway.exotica.org.uk/release.php?id=17498

A1200 (no-expanded)(2710b8) ... glitch on scrolling text on 4th (horizon) demo -> pic.5


Pipeline 10 (Packdisk) by Dreamdealers -> http://janeway.exotica.org.uk/release.php?id=15190

A1200 (no-expanded)(2710b8) ...

1st demo (Chaos/VD) doesnt work ...?! (also, if +4Mb fast -> black screen)
2nd demo (D/Essence) glitches on cube rotation part -> pic.6
6th demo (Contactro/Retire) doesnt work ...?! (also, if +4Mb fast -> black screen)

---------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------
p.s. It should now be all demo problems with regard to 1993!
p.s.2. Demo packs above contains also some non-AGA demos ... so it needs to be tested on a real A1200 1st.
---------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------

Amused To Death (Demo) by Flying Cows -> http://janeway.exotica.org.uk/release.php?id=10529

A1200 (no-expanded)(2710b8) ... some glitches on scolling text -> pic.7


BBS Intro (Intro) by X-Rayz -> http://janeway.exotica.org.uk/release.php?id=21351

A1200 (no-expanded)(2710b8) ... strange line in overscan -> pic.8


Born (Intro) by X-dream -> http://janeway.exotica.org.uk/release.php?id=5816

A1200 (no-expanded)(2710b8) ... glitches on cube rotation part (the 1st part)

p.s. -> perhaps CPU timing issue !!! (it works fine if CE=OFF)

[amilo3438]

Despair (Demo) by Insane -> http://janeway.exotica.org.uk/release.php?id=10420

A1200 (no-expanded)(2710b8) ... hm, very interesting ... it doesnt complete the text, than it just stops ... as shown on -> pic.1 (on 2.6.1 it shows normal text)

p.s. -> perhaps CPU timing issue !!! (it works fine if CE=OFF)


Dogtro (Intro) by Darkness -> http://janeway.exotica.org.uk/release.php?id=21930

A1200 (no-expanded)(2710b8) ... got gray screen after a few sec on dog rotation part, also lot of glitches on next part ...

... my crystal ball says -> perhaps CPU timing issue !!! (it seems to work normal if CE=OFF ... also if CE=ON but +4MB Fast looks to work fine)


Harre Krishna Homeboys (Intro) by Resolution 101 -> http://janeway.exotica.org.uk/release.php?id=10161

A1200 (no-expanded)(2710b8) ... black screen and music play on dots part screen (if 4Mb it works, but still unknown does it works on a plain real A1200)


Hate (Demo) by Fanatic -> http://janeway.exotica.org.uk/release.php?id=10510

A1200 (4Mb-expanded)(2710b8) ... hm, seems it wont work ?! (I tried with WB in DF0: and the file attached as HD)


Beyond Belief by noxious -> http://www.pouet.net/prod.php?which=10248 ... (Note: DL on mirrors link)

A1200 (no-expanded)(2710b8) ... some glitches on credits -> pic.2 (p.s. it works fine if CE=OFF, so perhaps CPU timing issue !!!)


Invention (40k Intro) by Triumph -> http://janeway.exotica.org.uk/release.php?id=10088

A1200 (no-expanded)(2710b8) ... some glitches -> pic.3 (p.s. it works fine if CE=OFF, so perhaps CPU timing issue !!!)


Mustard - X-Mas Intro (Intro) by C-lous -> http://janeway.exotica.org.uk/release.php?id=19512

A1200 (no-expanded)(2710b8) ... glitches on cube -> pic.4 (p.s. it works fine in 2.6.1, so perhaps CPU timing issue !!!)

[amilo3438]

Olympe (Trackmo) by Gods -> http://janeway.exotica.org.uk/release.php?id=10612

A1200 (no-expanded)(2710b8) ... seems it doesnt work !!! ... (but on 2.6.1 works fine !!!)

p.s. If disk inserted on WB boot screen the loader is black ... but if now press Ctrl+A+A, or the disk is inserted before WB boot screen, the loader has some rotation part on screen.


JFI ... My Mama Is a Vampire (Trackmo) by Duplo -> http://janeway.exotica.org.uk/release.php?id=3734

A1200 (no-expanded)(2710b8) ... for some reason the .DFS files from above link seems to doesnt work (a guru screen) !?

(p.s. But .ADF files from here works fine -> http://www.arabuusimiehet.com/break/...s.php?id=13773)


Revelation (Demo) by Shrimps Design -> http://janeway.exotica.org.uk/release.php?id=10496

A1200 (no-expanded)(2710b8) ... dots & dashes -> pic.1 (But if CE=OFF it doesnt happen, so perhaps it is CPU timing issue !!!)


Soho (Trackmo) by Nova -> http://janeway.exotica.org.uk/release.php?id=10317

A1200 (no-expanded)(2710b8) ... on credits screen the scrolls speed is not constant -> pic.2 (But if CE=OFF it is fine, so CPU timing issue !!!)

[amilo3438]

Statement (Demo) by Infection -> http://janeway.exotica.org.uk/release.php?id=30140

A1200 (no-expanded)(2710b8) ... file loading -> blue screen -> HALT1 !!! (F12 doesnt help but Alt F4 does )

p.s. From 5 times I tried got it only once to work, very weird ?! ... also use below attached config.

Swimming Pool (Demo) by Nova -> http://janeway.exotica.org.uk/release.php?id=4821

A1200 (no-expanded)(2710b8) ... some error when the 2nd time similar screen appear -> pic.1


Swing (Intro) by Polka Brothers -> http://janeway.exotica.org.uk/release.php?id=14784

A1200 (no-expanded)(2710b8) ... after screen -> pic.2 , and before the next screen, some glitches appear -> pic.3 (it last like a blink of an eye)


The Breath of the Muse (Demo) by Chryseis & Poseidon -> http://janeway.exotica.org.uk/release.php?id=10095

A1200 (no-expanded)(2710b8) ... some glitches -> pic.4 (perhaps CPU timing issue !!!)


Vector Dreams (Intro) by Ksylitol -> http://janeway.exotica.org.uk/release.php?id=9078

A1200 (no-expanded)(2710b8) ... hmm, not crunched but still refuse to work ?!


Vital (Demo) by Mystic -> http://janeway.exotica.org.uk/release.php?id=10283

A1200 (no-expanded)(2710b8) ... it stops at part shown on -> pic.5 (but if CE=OFF it works -> perhaps another CPU timing issue !!!)


Voices 2 (Diskmagazine) by Noise -> http://janeway.exotica.org.uk/release.php?id=10430

A1200 (no-expanded)(2710b8) ... upper line text issue -> pic.6 (if CE=OFF it looks different -> pic.7 ... perhaps something with CPU timing issue !!!)

Same apply also for:
Voices 3 (Diskmagazine) by Passion & Noise -> http://janeway.exotica.org.uk/release.php?id=10506
Voices 4 (Diskmagazine) by Edge -> http://janeway.exotica.org.uk/release.php?id=10568


Yul Brynner was a Skinhead (Demo) by Us -> http://janeway.exotica.org.uk/release.php?id=3299

A1200 (no-expanded)(2710b8) ... area marked on -> pic.8 is blinking !!! (yeah, perhaps CPU timing !!!)


Wat Een Gore Kop by Quartex -> http://www.pouet.net/prod.php?which=56592

A1200 (no-expanded)(2710b8) ... it stops on part -> see picture on link above ... (yeah, perhaps CPU timing !!!)


------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------
p.s. It should now be all demo problems with regard to 1994! (thus 1995 can wait for a while)

Hope that we now collected enough test cases for further improvement / development of "phase 2" 68020 CE emulation one day when it would start in a near / far future.
------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------

[amilo3438]

It seems there is more (Pouet has some A1200 demos not mentioned on exotica):

Uqulala by Damage -> http://www.pouet.net/prod.php?which=56797

Note: pouet seems to has damaged disk, so check one from here !

A1200 (no-expanded)(2710b8) ... some glitches -> pic.1

EDIT: If CE=OFF it doesnt happen ... yeah, perhaps something with CPU timing !!!

[Toni Wilen]

Originally Posted by amilo3438

It seems there is more (Pouet has some A1200 demos not mentioned on exotica):

Uqulala by Damage -> http://www.pouet.net/prod.php?which=56797

Note: DL link on pouet has damaged disk, so try one from here !

A1200 (no-expanded)(2710b8) ... some glitches -> pic.1

Backwards testing order.. Probably CPU (EDIT: not probably, yes it is!) (easy test: switch CE off, if glitch disappears or changes)

[amilo3438]

JOnboCken by candle -> http://www.pouet.net/prod.php?which=62418

A1200 (no-expanded)(2710b8) ... HALT1 !!!


Bliss-Out (Demo) by Ukonx -> http://janeway.exotica.org.uk/release.php?id=30529

A1200 (no-expanded)(2710b9) ... seems it doesnt work !!!

p.s. On above link is not mentioned that is for AGA, but on pouet.net it is: -> http://www.pouet.net/prod.php?which=51024


gimme alcohol by BONZAI BROS. -> http://www.pouet.net/prod.php?which=17945

A1200 (4Mb-expanded)(2710b9) ... seems it doesnt work !!!


Psychedelic (Demo) by Virtual Dreams -> http://janeway.exotica.org.uk/release.php?id=10583

A1200 (4Mb-expanded)(2710b9) ... seems it doesnt work !!!

Originally Posted by Toni Wilen

Yes, I agree 100%. Most AGA demos are boring, nothing new compared to A500 demos (except slooooooowwww color fades). And pixel soup of course too.

Yeah, but all those demo problem findings are done as test cases for further improvement of WinUAE AGA emulation accuracy and not only to make some uninteresting and boring demos to work correct.

[amilo3438]

Psylteflesk by Ephidrena -> http://www.pouet.net/prod.php?which=50125

A4000 (QS 040)(2710b12) ... Some strange behaving on top of the screen (pic.1) !!!

(Note: It doesnt exist on above link yt-video !)


Klone by Dual Crew & Shining -> http://www.pouet.net/prod.php?which=1562

A4000 (QS 040)(2710b12) ... With JIT-Fastest possible -> black screen and only music play after a while !!! (but works fine with JIT-Approximate)


Massive by skarla -> http://www.pouet.net/prod.php?which=56885

A4000 (QS 040)(2710b12) ... Strange top of the screen (pic.2) !!!

EDIT: Also, occasionally going on a short flash of color ! (Nothing of this problems happens on an old WinUAE 3.3.3 version !)

EDIT2: Pic.2 doesnt happen in WinUAE 2.7.1 b3 ... but it starts in b4 ! ... though flash of color still happens !)


Picnicbass by Ephidrena -> http://ada.untergrund.net/?p=demo&i=671

A4000 (QS 040)(2710b12) ... Some strange behaving on top of the screen (pic.3) !!!

[SaphirJD]

Shake off the dust from Elude: http://www.pouet.net/prod.php?which=56884

Some strange lines appear during that scene.


Config was A4000 (QS 040), Winuae is the current public beta 18

Some more glitches at Elude - Machinisthttp://www.pouet.net/prod.php?which=61214

Some strange yellow glitches to see on that scene at the right side a little bit below the middle.



Same config used here too.

[amilo3438]

@SaphirJD

Note: A4000 (QS 040) possible demo problems should be also tested with JIT-disabled in WinUAE !

So I checked both demos and found when JIT is disabled the demos seems to work without mentioned glitches.

It looks this will be for now only solution, as fixing such JIT problems can be annoying and IMHO maybe not worth the trouble.

(Btw. thanks for reporting demo problems.)

------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------
@SaphirJD & Toni

EDIT1:

I have noticed if after choosing QS4000 config and changing the "CPU Emulation speed" from "Fastest possible" to
"Approximate A500/A1200 or cycle-exact", the mentioned glitches gone ?! (a little weird as not sure does it is still
run in JIT mode or not ? ... even JIT is enabled ! -> see on pic.1 below)

Now wondering is it possible that "Fastest possible" produces such glitches and not JIT engine only ?!

p.s.
It seems to work fine also in "Fastest possible" if speed slider is set to -40% or lower (at least on my PC config.) !!! -> see pic.3

Hm, just wondering if on some faster PC config. than mine it might work fine with higher value f.e. -30%, -20%, -10% or default 0% without mentioned glitches ?!? (Can somebody confirm that ?)

(Note: Above apply for D3D and JIT=Indirect ... it seems on DirectDraw it still glitches until -60% ?!)
(...also, if JIT=Direct then D3D needs -60% and DirectDraw -70% to work w/o glitches ?)
------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------

Out of topic:

Toni, could you please check the demo "Olympe (Trackmo) by Gods" (link on 1st page)

-> why it stop/wait at track 77 in newer WinUAE versions when it worked fine on WinUAE 2.6.1. ?! (TIA)

Cheers

p.s. It seems to be broken from WinUAE2.7.0.b4 (2013.07.31)

winuae_2700b4 -> http://eab.abime.net/showpost.php?p=902679&postcount=88

- Rewritten 68020/030 cycle-exact emulation core. Emulates 68020 simultaneous bus controller and instruction execution more accurately. It still runs too fast, but at least it is less fast than previously, still lots of tweaking to do but at least now it should be possible to match real 68020 more closely than what was possible with old code.

- 68020/030 CPU emulation updates, prefetch emulation (also used in cycle-exact mode) should be much more compatible, "more compatible" checked without cycle-exact now also includes instruction cache emulation.

- Cycle-exact CPU accesses to AGA custom registers used 32-bit accesses, not 16-bit.

------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------
EDIT2:

Found temporary solution to run "Olympe (Trackmo) by Gods" on newer WinUAE versions -> see pic.2 !

After choosing QS1200 (Basic) config and changing the "CPU Emulation speed" to "Fastest possible" it runs fine.

(Weird, it refuse to run in "Approximate A500/A1200 or cycle-exact" mode even with CE=OFF ?!)

------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------

[amilo3438]

Previous post has been updated !!! (check EDIT 1 & 2)

EDIT: check p.s. under EDIT 1 !!!