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Old 21 June 2018, 17:22   #1
mc68060
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Why the fuss about IPF images?

So EAB has some very strict rules concerning IPF images. Of course I'm adhering to them but still I'm wondering why asking for IPF images is considered such a no-go here?

I mean, people on here will happily provide ADF images of old games but providing IPF images of the very same games seems to be completely taboo (even though those IPFs are widely available on other sites).

To me this doesn't really make sense so I'd like to ask why asking for cracks as ADFs is acceptable and asking for the same games as IPFs isn't? I don't really get the logic here...
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Old 21 June 2018, 17:25   #2
DamienD
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Old rule that is still enforced... personally I think we should change this though.

The SPS team used to frequent these boards but haven't been active in many, many years. They don't even get back to people who submit dumps / give updates etc...

In January this year I ranted about this when being annoyed, see here.
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Old 21 June 2018, 17:44   #3
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So the software preservation society vanished into oblivion and therefore did not preserve anything at all ?
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Old 21 June 2018, 17:45   #4
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Couldn't agree more, additionally, any a-hole that has a game and is personally not releasing it also needs a slap.
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Old 21 June 2018, 17:52   #5
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Quote:
Originally Posted by meynaf View Post
So the software preservation society vanished into oblivion and therefore did not preserve anything at all ?
I'm not saying that they haven't ever preserved any games, of course they have... but not in many, many, many years.

Like I said in my rant:

Quote:
Originally Posted by DamienD View Post
When's the last time any SPS / IPF member actually visited EAB, let alone answered various questions from numerous people who've submitted dumps / heard nothing back / not received files???
Also, let's not forget that the SPS team aren't actually purchasing these rare / hard to find games themselves... they are getting dumps free from people who's spend good money in order to have them preserved.
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Old 21 June 2018, 18:00   #6
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There does appear to be some activity in Facebook and Twitter. I guess forums are too old fashioned even for a retro software preservation group, these days
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Old 21 June 2018, 18:30   #7
meynaf
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Quote:
Originally Posted by DamienD View Post
I'm not saying that they haven't ever preserved any games, of course they have... but not in many, many, many years.
Yes but what happens to what they are supposed to have done ?
It's not available to anyone but them, which equals to not being preserved at all.
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Old 21 June 2018, 18:40   #8
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Quote:
Originally Posted by meynaf View Post
Yes but what happens to what they are supposed to have done ?
It's not available to anyone but them, which equals to not being preserved at all.
Well, somebody must have leaked something because you can easily find an archive with over 3000 IPF images on the net but of course some are missing.
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Old 21 June 2018, 18:51   #9
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Quote:
Originally Posted by meynaf View Post
It's not available to anyone but them, which equals to not being preserved at all.
...which is exactly the point of my rant

Quote:
Originally Posted by mc68060 View Post
Well, somebody must have leaked something because you can easily find an archive with over 3000 IPF images on the net but of course some are missing.
Those have been available for many, many years now.... unfortunately nothing new really over the past 3 or so years though...
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Old 21 June 2018, 19:01   #10
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To be fair, they behaved like cocks towards emulator authors when we asked for a file format specification - they allowed us to use their library code or GTFO. We got the feck out and made our own format instead, which worked just fine for our needs.

Just raise the restriction on IPF images - these people no longer matter. Their project was laudable at one point in time, but it is no longer.
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Old 21 June 2018, 19:02   #11
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Wasn't the point that they would give the images to whoever sent in raw images and then they could do with them as they wished. Obviously most released them for us all to enjoy. Other didnt.

Still sps stopped being important when they stopped preserving everything including the boxes etc.

Now it's just another format. Really makes no difference for emulation, and I dare say the real world any more.
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Old 21 June 2018, 19:31   #12
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514 disk images are still missing in action and will most likely continue to be so, i.e lost forever.
Fortunately some of those are available as non SPS ipfs.

I'm with Ian & DamienD here, maybe it's about time that old rule got revised.
If it's an original adf, extadf or raw dump doesn't make any difference if you ask me, contents are the same regardless format.
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Old 21 June 2018, 20:11   #13
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Why were these rules there at first place ? If the reasons are no longer valid, then the rules are obsolete as well and need to be removed.
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Old 21 June 2018, 20:47   #14
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I think it was a gentleman's agreement so the project didn't gain the reputation of just being there to facilitate breaking any copyrights.

I was around at the time but cannot remember.
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Old 24 June 2018, 01:35   #15
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Yeah, out of literally hundreds and hundreds of games on various formats I've submitted over the years I only ever got back about 4 Amiga games in IPF format, the last stuff I submitted to their ftp was back in 2016!

Even the chap I gave my Kryoflux and Flippy drive to (quite a few months back) has given up submitting his dumps and gave me my Kryoflux and Flippy drive back as he didn't get anything back either.

Originally Kryoflux was a 'read only' device purely intended for preservation, not writing, but at least they listened and added write support for IPF, G64, ADF and now raw streams but pity no one has been sent any IPFs to write back! Only Amiga, Atari ST and Spectrum +3 I believe exist in IPF format, not even C64 has IPFs unless that's changed?

You could also argue it's illegal to be obtaining dumps of games that they don't actually own a copy of, copyright etc!!
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Old 24 June 2018, 02:55   #16
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Quote:
Originally Posted by BarryB View Post
Only Amiga, Atari ST and Spectrum +3 I believe exist in IPF format, not even C64 has IPFs unless that's changed?

for the C64 exists original tape files (.tap)
but for floppy games I never found originals in the web, just cracked .D64 files , some of them uncracked anyways



btw,


for IPF files you can go to <snip> and download the IPF games you want

there is the most complete Amiga stuff in the web

Last edited by DamienD; 24 June 2018 at 11:44. Reason: Edited by DamienD...
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Old 24 June 2018, 03:31   #17
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I already have all the available 'leaked' IPFs, Amiga, Atari ST and Spectrum +3.

The nearest to C64 and IPF is the G64 format. If you have nibtools you can make your own G64 files from your original disks or use a Kryoflux (like I do) to dump and convert the streams to G64 that has mastering info so you can write most copy protected games back to a C64 disk. Drawbacks are it can't do some weak bit protections and can't write both sides of the disk in one pass so you are stuffed if you want to write to the flipside of disk that only has one index hole and no write notch on the flip side!!
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Old 24 June 2018, 11:45   #18
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@Mrz, I too could probably list 4 websites where .IPFs are easily obtainable from but EAB rules regarding .IPFs haven't been altered as yet...

So until this happens, please don't post them.
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Old 24 June 2018, 22:20   #19
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So who has the power here to change the rule ?
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Old 24 June 2018, 23:19   #20
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That's the million dollar question

RCK ultimately but all GMods and Mods would probably discussing with him. I'm sure there's a few spiders in the closet, so to speak.
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