Req: SPS database improvements

alexh · 03 March 2014, 11:54

I am sure that everyone here truly respects the work of the whole of the SPS team and we understand that everything that you guys do you do in your spare time without commercial incentive.

We realise that IPF analysis and scripting can take a long time to process and get finalised.

But it throws up a small problem for SPS contributors, the lack of transparency when they contribute.

Quite often I have read about people who have contributed SPS dumps (for various platforms) and never heard anything again. Similarly new contributors offering to dump their games which currently have no IPF image only to be told by other contributors that they dumped the same disk years ago.

It would be amazing if when each new game is dumped and submitted to SPS that it's progress is available. Some database similar to Bugzilla/Mantis. Where SPS contributors can see which games have already been dumped, if a non-modified dump is still required and see the progress of that game.

This level of openness would I believe win you a lot of kudos points for a very small amount of work.

Thanks for reading.

IFW · 03 March 2014, 12:42

Hi Alexh,

Yes, this is planned - in fact it is a part of our planned "next-generation" preservation solution.
One of the biggest problems we have is our own success combined with the fact of being a hobby project and that SPS toolchain and ecosystem was originally meant to be for a single platform, namely the Amiga.
So the practices we've had have been perfect for that (I am sure you can remember tons of releases), but as soon as more platform entered the mix, it is not that suitable anymore...
SPS now practically deals with tons of platforms, so a vastly different approach is needed.
1, Make hardware and software capable of dealing with any platforms
2, Make a toolchain capable of dealing with the needs of sometimes vastly different platforms.
3, Make an ecosystem and framework that is transparent for its users and allows collaboration - as well as keeping data private (this is a requirement for professional users). This would include the possibility of comparing dumps against existing ones and so on... but I certainly can't call this a very small amount of work, as it's not

Additionally, this requires certain roadblocks to be removed in relation to (2)

Spending a significant amount of time on each and every platform is simply not a viable solution anymore - we could do with hundreds of people working in the field and still not enough...

So we could either continue as is, or make a radical change, and focus on making the next-generation framework possible - which in turn would save a huge amount of time being spent on work otherwise needed, since it's not automated in any way currently.
We opted for investing into development; user-generated scripts etc. will be all an important part, and based on that collaboration and preservation framework.
There are dependencies which need to be resolved, so what gives the most benefit for the project and users is always the focus.

In the meantime, I could imagine a system that would at least build a database of submitted dumps, but it's not something we could allocate any manpower to - so if there are volunteers that would do that, keeping in mind that it will not have much use after the transition to the framework, then it could be done.

We all do have day jobs; I wish it was preservation, but it's not.
Please keep in mind we are in no way receiving any kind of support (other than moral, which does not pay wages or bills) from any organization or government - unlike many which do for the exact same work, but do absolutely nothing, other than producing white papers, think tanks and other ways of self-justification just enough to make sure they receive their funding further.

Cheers,
IFW

haynor666 · 17 May 2016, 11:23

Maybe we could use redump site as a template?

ascp · 15 August 2016, 21:56

IFW, two years later, how is the status of SPS/CAPS projects? From the outside it looks very quit with preservation and the dumps db not being updated. Are anyone still working on submitted dumps and the backlog of tickets?

dlfrsilver · 16 August 2016, 01:22

Quote:

Originally Posted by jonathan

IFW, two years later, how is the status of SPS/CAPS projects? From the outside it looks very quit with preservation and the dumps db not being updated. Are anyone still working on submitted dumps and the backlog of tickets?

Hello Jonathan, if you have submitted some games, and if those are in the official SPS list, please PM me.

I'll sort things out for you

fryguy · 16 August 2016, 11:26

I think i uploaded the swedish 8disk version of Hugo but it doesn't seem to be in the database.

dlfrsilver · 16 August 2016, 16:19

Quote:

Originally Posted by fryguy

I think i uploaded the swedish 8disk version of Hugo but it doesn't seem to be in the database.

Fryguy, upgrading the database is something i can't do. Please PM me

03 March 2014, 11:54	#1
alexh Thalion Webshrine Join Date: Jan 2004 Location: Oxford Posts: 14,331	Req: SPS database improvements I am sure that everyone here truly respects the work of the whole of the SPS team and we understand that everything that you guys do you do in your spare time without commercial incentive. We realise that IPF analysis and scripting can take a long time to process and get finalised. But it throws up a small problem for SPS contributors, the lack of transparency when they contribute. Quite often I have read about people who have contributed SPS dumps (for various platforms) and never heard anything again. Similarly new contributors offering to dump their games which currently have no IPF image only to be told by other contributors that they dumped the same disk years ago. It would be amazing if when each new game is dumped and submitted to SPS that it's progress is available. Some database similar to Bugzilla/Mantis. Where SPS contributors can see which games have already been dumped, if a non-modified dump is still required and see the progress of that game. This level of openness would I believe win you a lot of kudos points for a very small amount of work. Thanks for reading.

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03 March 2014, 12:42	#2
IFW Moderator Join Date: Jan 2003 Location: ... Age: 52 Posts: 1,838	Hi Alexh, Yes, this is planned - in fact it is a part of our planned "next-generation" preservation solution. One of the biggest problems we have is our own success combined with the fact of being a hobby project and that SPS toolchain and ecosystem was originally meant to be for a single platform, namely the Amiga. So the practices we've had have been perfect for that (I am sure you can remember tons of releases), but as soon as more platform entered the mix, it is not that suitable anymore... SPS now practically deals with tons of platforms, so a vastly different approach is needed. 1, Make hardware and software capable of dealing with any platforms 2, Make a toolchain capable of dealing with the needs of sometimes vastly different platforms. 3, Make an ecosystem and framework that is transparent for its users and allows collaboration - as well as keeping data private (this is a requirement for professional users). This would include the possibility of comparing dumps against existing ones and so on... but I certainly can't call this a very small amount of work, as it's not Additionally, this requires certain roadblocks to be removed in relation to (2) Spending a significant amount of time on each and every platform is simply not a viable solution anymore - we could do with hundreds of people working in the field and still not enough... So we could either continue as is, or make a radical change, and focus on making the next-generation framework possible - which in turn would save a huge amount of time being spent on work otherwise needed, since it's not automated in any way currently. We opted for investing into development; user-generated scripts etc. will be all an important part, and based on that collaboration and preservation framework. There are dependencies which need to be resolved, so what gives the most benefit for the project and users is always the focus. In the meantime, I could imagine a system that would at least build a database of submitted dumps, but it's not something we could allocate any manpower to - so if there are volunteers that would do that, keeping in mind that it will not have much use after the transition to the framework, then it could be done. We all do have day jobs; I wish it was preservation, but it's not. Please keep in mind we are in no way receiving any kind of support (other than moral, which does not pay wages or bills) from any organization or government - unlike many which do for the exact same work, but do absolutely nothing, other than producing white papers, think tanks and other ways of self-justification just enough to make sure they receive their funding further. Cheers, IFW

17 May 2016, 11:23	#3
haynor666 retro maniac Join Date: May 2002 Location: Tarnobrzeg/Poland Age: 45 Posts: 1,748	Maybe we could use redump site as a template?

15 August 2016, 21:56	#4
ascp Pastafarian Join Date: Sep 2010 Location: Uppsala/Sweden Posts: 290	IFW, two years later, how is the status of SPS/CAPS projects? From the outside it looks very quit with preservation and the dumps db not being updated. Are anyone still working on submitted dumps and the backlog of tickets?

16 August 2016, 11:26	#6
fryguy Registered User Join Date: Aug 2005 Location: Skarabörg, Sweden Age: 44 Posts: 1,019	I think i uploaded the swedish 8disk version of Hugo but it doesn't seem to be in the database.

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