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Old 14 April 2017, 10:54   #1
TheFoxSoft
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Floppy disk Power Disc [new Amiga game] discussion

Hi guys,
recently I opened a poll in order to understand if there is enough interest in a new amiga game.
From the discussions I realized people are available to buy a new game only if it is AAA game, that means only if the quality is top.

I am a game developer and I released some console titles in the last 10 years including Active Soccer 2 DX (in which I collaborated with Chris Huelsbeck) that brings the spirit of Kick Off 2 and SWOS on modern consoles.
I am a retro game addicted, I grew up with my Amiga 2000 and then with my Amiga 1200 until 1997, when I switched to a Pentium (sad).
I also won 3 Kick Off 2 world cups, just to mention my love for the Amiga.

To cut the long story short I have an idea that is to develop a top quality Amiga game because Amiga deserves a new one.
I would like to port an old game I developed few years ago and adapt it to Amiga, including take advantage of the joysticks accuracy and increase the pace of the game and difficulty like the old good days.

The game would be written for standard Amiga OCS with 1 MB ram. Why not AGA support? Because OCS has a wider audience and I want to push my Amiga knowledge limits further.
Of course I forgot almost all my ASM 68K knowledge so I need to study again all the registers and other stuff, but I will gladly do it.

The game would be a reinterpretation of WindJammers, an arcade 1 vs 1 pong like game with individual characters and power ups.
The idea is to capture 3D models and their animations in all 8 directions in order to create the "sprites" (blitted). This technique will provide a different way to produce characters, instead of relying on pixel art I will provide a step by step 3D models screenshots. This will allow me to speed up the development and at the same time it will provide smoother animations.
I would not exclude to repaint manually the gfx (like the rotoscope technique used in Prince of Persia) but in case the amount of work increases.

As you know OCS can support easily 32 colors but I would like to apply the technique used in Universe (http://hol.abime.net/1815) in which at each row the palette is changed dynamically in order to show about 200 colors on screen.

I attach you some drafts, artificially created via PC in order to get a rough idea on the gfx style and quality.
The first row is a classic 32 colors mode while the second row should simulate the extended colors mode I mentioned before.
I repeat, this is only a reference picture; the final quality may vary. Especially because manual drawing will be necessary to correct some aspects (especially crowd, transparency effect, shadows).



I repeat, at the moment is just an idea.
Please I would like to listen your opinions, both negative or positive but I need your feedback.


Cheers,
Gianluca
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Old 14 April 2017, 11:30   #2
ransom1122
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Winning 3 Kick off 2 World cups. Well done!!!

Are you thinking of a game similar to Disc Jam but horizontal instead of vertical playfield?
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Old 14 April 2017, 11:33   #3
TheFoxSoft
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Disc Jam is a WindJammers remake so yes, a horizontal version of Disc Jam
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Old 14 April 2017, 11:52   #4
nobody
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Good idea but you need pixel graphics. 3D models will look crap, usually.
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Old 14 April 2017, 12:02   #5
TheFoxSoft
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Quote:
Originally Posted by nobody View Post
Good idea but you need pixel graphics. 3D models will look crap, usually.
You can evaluate yourself watching the screenshots.
Do you think they are good enough?
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Old 14 April 2017, 12:05   #6
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Screenshots look nice.
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Old 14 April 2017, 12:14   #7
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They can be improved. Now they are just ok.
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Old 14 April 2017, 12:56   #8
DamienD
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Sounds very cool to me TheFoxSoft and I like the mock screenshots
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Old 14 April 2017, 12:59   #9
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Single-screen games don't count as AAA quality on Amiga, mind you.
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Old 14 April 2017, 13:25   #10
TheFoxSoft
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Quote:
Originally Posted by idrougge View Post
Single-screen games don't count as AAA quality on Amiga, mind you.
Original WindJammers is AAA game if converted on Amiga, to me
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Old 14 April 2017, 14:02   #11
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I love Windjammers, so any game of this ilk I would love to play, of course gfx help a lot when playing, you could always team up with people on that front, but go for it sounds good!
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Old 14 April 2017, 14:15   #12
DamienD
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Heya TheFoxSoft,

I've moved your thread from the Amiga scene section to a more suitable one; the project.Amiga Game Factory section
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Old 14 April 2017, 14:24   #13
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I love Windjammers and a clone would be amazing to have. I was actually thinking recently, when playing it at an arcade, why there isn't any Windjammers clone for Amiga!

But I am afraid your graphics look weird, "too realistic" in a way that doesn't really apply to a Windjammers-type game. IS that supposed to be like a real sports field? At first look, without reading your text, I thought you wanted to make a 1 on 1 ice hockey game like the (fantastic) Hat Trick on C64. So clearly the idea with them isn't just right.

What I love about Windjammers is that it's complete fantasy, with the crazy power moves and whatnot. Graphics do a LOT to help with this. The size of everything, too. The game "field" is actually pretty small because the player sprites are big. Yours look like they are in a HUGE field. This will affect gameplay/feeling.

For those who never heard/seen the game:


[ Show youtube player ]

Here's the point where things make or break: why are you doing this alone? Clearly you could use the hand of a talented pixel artist. I would ask you to get one for this project. It would make your project many orders of magnitude better I can think. There's no need to do it all alone, and that is one of the things we discussed in that thread, if you read it through completely.

This level of graphics can be achieved by the way. Fightin' Spirit showed the Amiga world Neo Geo-type graphics are possible on Amiga.
http://hol.abime.net/530/screenshot

So yeah, if you can pull off a game with this gameplay, graphic and audio quality, you've got my purchase. But please also offer a digital download system

Last edited by Akira; 14 April 2017 at 16:24.
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Old 14 April 2017, 14:26   #14
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Good luck with this project

I'd agree with @nobody. The pics are ok but you definitely need heavy pixel art intervention to clean those up (if your goal is for an AAA result that is). Plus some better palette usage. If done properly even 32 colors are perfectly fine (you could also use EHB mode which could offer you an extra 32 color shadows palette with little performance overhead).

Some tips for converting 3d gfx:
-For backgrounds/tiles make sure all your exports have zero dithering. Clean, unified and single color surfaces are hugely much preffered than a dither fest. After the first exports, if you still want dithering you can add some manually (but as a rule of thumb it's better not to overdo this imho).

-Same for bobs/sprites, export with zero dithering. Apply manually later where needed. Also make sure anti-aliasing around your shapes is off (if possible). This will definitely require some manual work later to fix the details.

Having said that, I also agree with Akira on his points.
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Old 14 April 2017, 20:04   #15
TheFoxSoft
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Working to get rid of the dither effect
This is a new 32 colors picture

Click image for larger version

Name:	Untitled.png
Views:	88
Size:	178.1 KB
ID:	52808

Now the quality is much better in my opinion
Please download the file to open it in full screen.

Last edited by TheFoxSoft; 14 April 2017 at 20:15.
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Old 14 April 2017, 20:32   #16
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I just don't think it fits. That screen looks like an ice hockey game.
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Old 14 April 2017, 20:45   #17
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Akira View Post
I just don't think it fits. That screen looks like an ice hockey game.
Akira, whilst I do agree with you regarding this actual screenshot; remember it's just a mock up.

The first post showed 2 other different arenas and I'm sure TheFoxSoft will create many others like say a beach setting once he has the concept worked out.

Chill a bit man; this is just his initial ideas.

...saying that; @TheFoxSoft, you should look at the backgrounds for the unreleased "Basket Island". They were quite cool
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Old 14 April 2017, 21:04   #18
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In order to save you from trying to source what I'm talking about... I've extracted .IFF images from an old archive, converted to .PNG and uploaded to an image hosting website























These look way cool and is what you should possibly aim for IMHO
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Old 14 April 2017, 21:51   #19
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Quote:
Originally Posted by DamienD View Post
The first post showed 2 other different arenas
OK so this one looks like an ice hockey field, the second one looks like an indoors volleyball court and the third one looks like a wrestling ring. It's not that one needs to look like a beach, it's the fantastic aspect of i that I am talking about. The screenshots you posted even though the game is basketball clearly play with the notion of fantasy, and they look really fitting for the vibe of a game like Windjammers too.

We're just saying the same. But somehow I am "not chill"
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Old 14 April 2017, 23:11   #20
TheFoxSoft
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I try to explain better the game.
My initial idea was to port the GFX of an already released 3D game.
The game has 6 characters:
- volleyball girl
- footballer (lookalike Balotelli)
- boxer
- hockey player
- tennis player
- fencer girl

and 6 arenas:
- volleyball stadium: default one with 2 obstacles on sides
- football stadium: 3 and 5 points are inverted
- boxe ring: the ball have random bounces strength
- hockey arena: players have some kind of slippery on the ice
- tennis arena: default one
- fencing stadium: quite narrow pitch with central obstacles

There is no beach stadium because the game has been designed in this way.
The game got inspiration by Windjammers but the art style was different.
The main difference between that basketball court pictures and the one I provided you is huge. The former is a true pixel art, the latter is a screen captured from a 3D game.

What am I going to achieve?
1. Take advantage of the GFX already done for my previous game
2. Find a way to capture a screen from a 3D model that looks good
3. Take advantage of rigged 3D models and animated character in order to provide smooth animations
4. Develop a game that fits Amiga standards (fast paced, responsive, hard)
5. Push my limits (overscan, more than 32 colors on screen, 50 Hz)

At the moment I am testing different visual solutions.
Another option would be for example capture a screen and the paint it manually
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