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Old 16 June 2017, 18:00   #1
guibrush
 
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AGA integration in Apollo core : work in progress

Hi
I just want to show you the nice progress made by the team on the integration of the AGA chipset into the Apollo core. There is still a lot of work to do, but I'm pleased to show you 8 games, included an AGA one, running right now on the Vampire. On the video, you can see that we only use the HDMI cable to carry the chipset picture and sound to the monitor, therefore we are all digital ! The display is done in true 50Hz, so there is no tearing and no frame droping while displaying. It's as smooth as the original PAL displayed version. No configuration, don't need to tune up the prefs : it's just work out of the box. But we don't stop there : we have a nice complex scanline effect that simulate the rendering of the old beloved CRT monitor. So, best of both world : smoth without tearing, scanlined, but displayed without flickering on a modern display via the Digital plug.
Enjoy !

[ Show youtube player ]
 
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Old 16 June 2017, 19:47   #2
Magic
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Amazing work!
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Old 16 June 2017, 20:40   #3
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Nice. Shame that LCDs still introduce stuff like ghosting, slightly evident in your video. They just never will be just like CRTs :/
Will the AGA display only work through HDMI or can you still use the regular video port to connect to an old CRT?
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Old 16 June 2017, 20:50   #4
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Originally Posted by Akira View Post
Nice. Shame that LCDs still introduce stuff like ghosting, slightly evident in your video. They just never will be just like CRTs :/
Will the AGA display only work through HDMI or can you still use the regular video port to connect to an old CRT?
HDMI only. But that HDMI signal you can convert to analog of course (with something like this: https://www.amazon.com/ViewHD-Compos.../dp/B00LK95VNQ)
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Old 16 June 2017, 21:31   #5
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Akira View Post
Nice. Shame that LCDs still introduce stuff like ghosting, slightly evident in your video. They just never will be just like CRTs :/
Please note this video is done with a camera, recording a LCD and uploaded to YouTube. What you see as LCD ghosting might not be.

Testing those cores and being also picky with those things, it works very well at 50Hz on my Philips 144Hz screen.

Last edited by TuKo; 16 June 2017 at 22:23.
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Old 16 June 2017, 23:28   #6
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Amazing work
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Old 16 June 2017, 23:38   #7
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@ Akira :
Trust me, there is no noticeable ghosting. What you see on this vid is because I recorded it with a camera on a stative. In reality there is no ghosting at all. And the scanline effect is from far the best I ever had on a TFT for an Amiga system, far better than the Minimig or other add on product for Amiga. I will try to make a better capture for the second video that we plan to do soon (I will borrow a better camera).
 
Old 16 June 2017, 23:40   #8
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My observation has nothing to do with the Apollo core. It's just a fact of LCD screens.
Sure, newer ones will reduce that greatly, especially if you support black frame insertion on 100Hz+ displays, but not everyone has one of those, so mileage may vary depending on your display.
There's also the matter of certain displays trying to interpolate the image when it's moving.

For most people, LCD displays will introduce ghosting and artifaction. Nothing to do about that except changing the display.
Now going through a converter again back to analog seems a bit silly, if one wants to display in an oldschool monitor. But then again since the Vampire is gearing towards becoming standalone, it "makes sense" in that view that more and more you detach from the host computer.
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Old 17 June 2017, 00:25   #9
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Very excited about this. Just curious about a few things I hope you can answer or clarify.

Does the pre-boot screen work via HDMI also?
What about booting off of floppy (or GoTek)?
If yes to the floppy question, what if the game is OCS or ECS not AGA specific?

In other words, is the HDMI out active for everything from the moment the Amiga is powered on?
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Old 17 June 2017, 01:29   #10
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Great work and +1 for running 50Hz smoothscroll
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Old 17 June 2017, 01:35   #11
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@akira
Well, sure the LCD technology has more ghosting effect than a CRT. But the CRT has a big flickering problem especialy when used in 50Hz. So, I prefer by far having a good LCD than a good CRT. I own a lacie blue electron, wich is a reference model in the CRT range, but I simply can't accept anymore a 50Hz refresh rate. My eyes are no more young. And there are acceptable LCD. For exemple, I personnaly use a Eizo EV2450. It's pretty expensive, but I really don't notice any ghosting on it. But I understand your statement.

@ sinphaltimus :
"does the pre-boot screen work via HDMI also?"
Yes, the early startup menu is displayed via the HDMI. In fact, all the chipset video is redirected.


"in other words, is the HDMI out active for everything from the moment the Amiga is powered on?"
Yes, absolutely.
 
Old 17 June 2017, 01:42   #12
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Originally Posted by guibrush View Post
@akira
@ sinphaltimus :
"does the pre-boot screen work via HDMI also?"
Yes, the early startup menu is displayed via the HDMI. In fact, all the chipset video is redirected.
Wow. Awesome. So stoked. So freaking amazing. *CLAP*CLAP*CLAP*..etc...
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Old 17 June 2017, 01:46   #13
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Quote:
Originally Posted by guibrush View Post
..."in other words, is the HDMI out active for everything from the moment the Amiga is powered on?"
Yes, absolutely.
Wonderful. What remains then, just the scanline effect (an extra)?
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Old 17 June 2017, 02:39   #14
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I wonder if this is configurable so certain things that would normally be clock limited by the amiga on the original chipset can be set to run at ludicrous speed? Some of those games in the video looked like they were running much faster than they normally would but that could just be the CPU running fast.
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Old 17 June 2017, 14:46   #15
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What about those of us who still wish to use the Amiga's RGB output?
Will the Amiga chipset still work, or does the Vampire completely take over?
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Old 17 June 2017, 15:19   #16
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i'd like to see real 256 colors AGA PAL.
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Old 17 June 2017, 19:33   #17
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Originally Posted by UberFreak View Post
What about those of us who still wish to use the Amiga's RGB output?
Will the Amiga chipset still work, or does the Vampire completely take over?
Not 100% sure but I think that will not work. That's the main "issue" I find here.
But I am also guessing here, that you can turn the AGA implementation on or off so you can use the computer's original chipset (I am only guessing here, will let someone on the team respond).
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Old 17 June 2017, 19:56   #18
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@ retrofan
The scanline effect is already there and activated.

@ UberFreak :
the chipset on the motherboard is totally desactivated, therefore the output of the Vampire can only be achieved on the HDMI plug. We can't run both chipset in parallel, because they are not the same (AGA in the Vampire, ECS on the MoBo).

@ Seiya
I will do more videos in a couple of days with more working AGA games. Be patient, this is a work in progress :-)
 
Old 18 June 2017, 18:07   #19
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@ UberFreak :
the chipset on the motherboard is totally deactivated, ......
Dear Apollo team,

Whatever the future may bring, Please don't do anything that will take away midi capabilities for the I/O ports.

Thank you.
Sinphaltimus
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Old 18 June 2017, 18:42   #20
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I will do more videos in a couple of days with more working AGA games. Be patient, this is a work in progress :-)
when you make a new video try to run the games Aladdin, putty squad, Alien breed 3d2 AGA,Lemmings 3,slam tilt and skeleton krew
thanks,
if the vampire can run these in a perfect way I'm gonna sell my A1200 and I will purchase an Amiga500+vampire500
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