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Old 20 September 2011, 17:28   #41
mfletcher
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Happy to say reseating it fixed it.
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Old 20 September 2011, 20:16   #42
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Excellent mfletcher

A few months apart is no real trouble, and mine is still fine after reseating so perhaps it only takes one. But I would like to find out why they're needed - and why it fixes everything right up (which is even more of a mystery really!)
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Old 21 September 2011, 02:49   #43
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Excellent mfletcher

A few months apart is no real trouble, and mine is still fine after reseating so perhaps it only takes one. But I would like to find out why they're needed - and why it fixes everything right up (which is even more of a mystery really!)
I had to retension the pins on an A500 so that an A501 would work reliably, it's just old hardware Photon, go read about antique radios and valve socket retensioning.
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Old 22 September 2011, 21:16   #44
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I don't quite feel at ease with that comparison Loedown, since the A600 is not really antique for a few decades yet, and the ACA630 is brand new. But if reseating fixes every such issue, it's obviously the pins not making proper contact. The socket pins are already springy and should make good contact. But the 68000 chip wasn't really made for piggyback rides.

Personally I think it stops working because the heat changes the socket to a point where it's pressure isn't enough for good electrical contact anymore, and that it starts working again because now the socket is stress-stretched and is less affected by the heat, while when reseating it you make tiny scratches on the 68000 pins, which provide better contact (along the lines of wirewrap).

You seem more certain than I am at this point actually. Let's see whether it comes back in a few months.
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Old 22 September 2011, 21:42   #45
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maybe its expansion and contraction over time.?

im not an expert but that sounds reasonable to me.as an explanation as to why it needs re-seating.
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Old 24 September 2011, 03:21   #46
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Well, obviously the 68000 or the socket "changes enough" to at one point no longer make proper contact (IF re-seating always fixes it). Could you elaborate?

It takes about one minute to re-seat it. I wonder what changes then. Certainly neither part has been retensioned as Loedown suggests, and heat doesn't have time to change in that minute much. If it has expanded or contracted over time, how could it "go back to normal" in just one minute? (I mean, if it takes months to make it loose or tight, why doesn't it take a long time to tighten or loosen it back?)

Basically you're screwing the exact same socket to the mobo in the exact same position, at least if you don't screw too tightly.
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Old 24 September 2011, 09:38   #47
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Well, obviously the 68000 or the socket "changes enough" to at one point no longer make proper contact (IF re-seating always fixes it). Could you elaborate?

It takes about one minute to re-seat it. I wonder what changes then. Certainly neither part has been retensioned as Loedown suggests, and heat doesn't have time to change in that minute much. If it has expanded or contracted over time, how could it "go back to normal" in just one minute? (I mean, if it takes months to make it loose or tight, why doesn't it take a long time to tighten or loosen it back?)

Basically you're screwing the exact same socket to the mobo in the exact same position, at least if you don't screw too tightly.
yes i agree it is very strange.but what i was thinking was the expansion and contractraction could still happen under the screws horizontaly not verticly,i wont go into this too much.

but saying that, logicly,a re-seat shouldent fix it, even when taking into account the pins in the plcc socket are spring loaded as to say.but then again stranger things have happened.wouldent you agree?

but maybe just maybe,while the plcc socket is under pressure,the pins in the socket.and the socket itself. relax just enough for it to loose contact.of course this is pure conjector,as this would happen over a long period of time.and like you photon i myself would want to know how on earth this was possible.

by the way i have seen this problem,but not with a aca but with a much older apollo 630.and like you i was why would it move?
well at least the aca is screwed down
lets just say my final solution was a harness/cradle to hold the apollo down.and it never happend again.

regards roy
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Old 24 September 2011, 21:24   #48
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It's a mystery. Anyone that ever have to re-seat their ACA630 twice are welcome to post here when/if it happens!
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Old 19 October 2011, 23:23   #49
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I spoke too soon. My A600 has started acting up. At first it was when I was copying files to and from my compact flash pc card adapter. Then it was red and yellow screens on boot.

Today I opened it up and took out the ACA630. Turned it back on and it works like a charm. Its been running the same demo now for about 5 hours without hangs.

So I take it periodic reseatting of the ACA630 is preventative maintenance :roll eyes:
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Old 20 October 2011, 20:28   #50
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When did you reseat it the last time?
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Old 21 October 2011, 12:54   #51
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Photon,

Reseated it back in September. My desk was pretty cluttered so a couple of weeks ago I moved it five feet along to another part of my desk. Then this week, I moved it back. Now its started acting up again.

Of course, removing the ACA630, the A600 is rock solid again
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Old 01 November 2011, 16:57   #52
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Just back from holidays. Im going to try reseating it again. I ran my A600 continuously last night with no crashes with the ACA630 removed, so Im at a loss to understand why the A600 would be at fault and not the ACA630.
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Old 01 November 2011, 17:17   #53
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Just back from holidays. Im going to try reseating it again. I ran my A600 continuously last night with no crashes with the ACA630 removed, so Im at a loss to understand why the A600 would be at fault and not the ACA630.
Probably the micro cracks in CPU legs, but don't forget the ACA 630 pushes the A600 very hard, could even be PSU/Capacitor related.

Try another PSU/A600 Motherboard if you have them available, also not a 25w brick you want decent converted ATX like Amigakit sell.
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Old 01 November 2011, 21:54   #54
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I doubt it would be sold requiring a non-standard PSU without mentioning it anywhere, also doubt Jens would make a product requiring it. Besides, it's already tested by me with a 34W and a 120W PSU.

Capacitors/motherboard fixing themselves right up just by removing the accelerator also seems farfetched.

Microcracks could be proven/disproven by someone having had the issue and resoldered the CPU and either seeing or not seeing the problems come back.

I know I've sworn not to reopen my A600, but if I get the problem again I might as well try that. If that fixes it, there's only the accelerator left to search for causes.
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Old 02 November 2011, 03:32   #55
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@fitzsteve,

Im actually using one of Mechy's APower PSU's (http://eab.abime.net/showthread.php?p=777625), and I havent had any problems at all. Ive got an AmigaKit PSU as well. I guess I could give that a try.
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Old 02 November 2011, 10:35   #56
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As photon said the only true way to see if its dry joints, is to either;

1)See them visually (maybe use a small screwdriver to push them, see if they move).
2) Just resolder 68k and try again (stab in the dark method).
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Old 02 November 2011, 12:22   #57
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Again, ran the A600 last night for four hours without ACA630 -> no crashes.
Ran A600 + ACA630 -> crashed in an hour.

When applying the ACA630 I removed the board from the case and placed it on a flat surface so there was no flexing of the mobo when adding the ACA630.

Im going to try using the Amigakit PSU next, see if its something with the APower one, but Im not sure...
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Old 02 November 2011, 16:25   #58
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Couldnt find my AmigaKit PSU. But as an experiment, dug out my A1200 with Indy + 060 Accelerator from storage and powered it up using the same APower PSU.

Running for two hours now, no problems whatsoever. So I think I can discount the PSU. Its clearly able to handle something more powerful than a stock A1200/A600.
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Old 02 November 2011, 20:03   #59
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2) Just resolder 68k and try again (stab in the dark method).
It's less of a stab in the dark if it's done right when problems appear and they go away immediately after... but you'd have to wait a few months without reseating to be sure. But it would be better with some other method of finding the root of the problem rather than trying like this, I give you that.
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Old 02 November 2011, 21:09   #60
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It's less of a stab in the dark if it's done right.
Hmmm, not what I ment at all.
If you can see a pin move then you can say it is something.
Its not seeing something that is a pain, hence "stab in the dark" comment.

You cant say 100%, as say you dislodge something and it starts working fine.
So its better to visually see something, in my opinion.

Blanket resoldered was always an absolute last resort for me in my previous job.
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