Amiga Accelerator?

Amiga Forever · 20 November 2010, 01:16

I know some of you have Bought Amiga accelerator 56MHZ and 28MHZ but my questions would be....

What would you used 56MHZ for? Playing Doom?

What would you used 28MHZ for?

It would be nice for me to learn somethings ....not just for playing games....but somethings that i never know that you know

Allen1 · 20 November 2010, 02:14

Although I haven't as yet bought either of them, I would say that my reason for getting one would be to see how much faster and smoother things would load and run.

The whole experience would be more for self indulgence rather that any practical use other than games and WHDload loading times, something like these would have been great for programs like Electrocad all those years ago when I made/designed my first blocky CAD circuit boards on my Amiga 1200. Nowadays both CAD, internet browsing and document writing has evolved way past anything that our old friend the Amiga could handle.

Therefore I would say that these cards are going to mainly be used for games and maybe by some coders who wish to speed up their efforts and test game coding routines which is way past my abilities. Either board is a definite must have for any curious Amiga owner who wants to see what their computer can really do without breaking the bank.

Graham Humphrey · 20 November 2010, 10:42

Bear in mind it's not purely about Mhz but the actual processor - for instance a 33Mhz 68040 is quicker than a 50Mhz 68030.

I own an Apollo 040 card and it runs jolly quick (relatively speaking of course) - Doom runs great on it, and a lot of later games require them, or at the very least take great advantage of them. Of course, processor-intensive applications like 3D rendering software benefit too (particularly with an FPU present), if that floats your boat.

The only problem for me is that it seems less compatible with WHDLoad than my old '030 card (although I must stress the majority of games still run perfectly, but errors and glitches do crop up).

Basically if you want one then what one you get really depends on what you want to use it for. I guess an '030 is more than enough for your average user who primarily wants to play WHDLoad games.

Twiggy · 20 November 2010, 10:44

Mainly for WHDload (the ACA630). Lemon Amiga suggests that DooM can run on ECS, is this true? I'm pretty sure a 030 is enough to run it.

Out of curiosity I'd probably try Debian Linux out, which needs an MMU (which the ACA630 has), but I don't think it needs a FPU.

Loedown · 20 November 2010, 11:43

Quote:

Originally Posted by Amiga Forever

I know some of you have Bought Amiga accelerator 56MHZ and 28MHZ but my questions would be....

What would you used 56MHZ for? Playing Doom?

What would you used 28MHZ for?

It would be nice for me to learn somethings ....not just for playing games....but somethings that i never know that you know

All is relative, what do you need your Amiga for?

I have an A2000 with a GVP '030 Accelerator in it which is faster than my stock A3640 A4000 at LHA operations, awesome yes, useful not really.

Accelerators are very desirable pieces of kit but you have to decide if their worth is equal to their use.

AmigaFun · 20 November 2010, 11:43

Personally, I bought one because I have a Blizzard IV, it's at least 10 years old, so who knows how much time it has left or if it goes bang due to some 'act of God'. Well, I would be in a situation of having a 1200 with WHD on it, but no 030 card to do it all justice. So for me it's an insurance policy, to extend the life of the 1200.
Also, I don't really like the prices of 2nd or 3rd hand cards of equal age on the auction sites. So £160 for a new card with 64MB ram seems a no brainer.

edit: 56Mhz for me, again an insurance policy as I may kick myself in the coming years if I did not go for that and I found a piece of software that really needed it...demo's for example.

lambrettadave · 20 November 2010, 17:42

in my mind the faster card (56mhz) would be better for the likes of Doom

I have a 1230 mk2 with 32mb ram on it clocked at 40mhz and plays doom 1 ok but the others require it to be played on a postage stamp size.

Where as me 1240 card plays all versions of doom no problems at a much larger screen size.

I think the 28mhz version is a very good buy as just second hand ram cards which only have a max of 8 mb of ram on them are way over priced against the 28mhz card which would improve the a1200 a helva lot more and have more ram as well

Dave

Predseda · 20 November 2010, 18:50

Running jabber and iBrowse, so internet connection (ACA630 in my case). And WHD of course.

orange · 20 November 2010, 20:42

i think there are games that could use all MHz you can throw at them.
for eg. vactor games, like 4D sports driving.
and one of my all time favorites: The Killing Cloud

oh, and I don't consider doom to be particularly interesting or important. that is simply 'pc style game'..

about those accelerators, you don't mention what cpu and for which amiga?

kriz · 20 November 2010, 21:03

For all the old classic demos a 030 56Mhz would be good aswell...

DDNI · 21 November 2010, 00:09

@orange, I used to think that a faster CPU would make a big improvement in classic chipset dependent games. Sadly it is usually the case that either the game is not coded to utilise a faster CPU or the chipset itself becomes a bottleneck.
Later Amiga games are better as the coders anticipated faster CPUs...

dabone · 21 November 2010, 04:40

I'm now playing with a a500 with a 030/25mhz accelerator and a add on 8meg and ide interface (dataflyer).

For the most part the whdload games run the same as my 1200 with a Apollo 1240/40Mhz. To me it seems for just playing the classic games, make sure you have enough ram to preload. So the ram portion of the accelerators is much more important than raw speed for the majority of the users.

The sad part is that the a500 has slightly higher datatransfer than the 1200.

later,
dabone

mihcael · 21 November 2010, 06:41

Quote:

Originally Posted by kriz

For all the old classic demos a 030 56Mhz would be good aswell...

shit, i was thinking i would save some cash on the 28 which would be enough for whd, but will definitely go for the 56 now you have reminded me of that potential use.

Eclipse · 21 November 2010, 16:10

I noticed a massive improvement when plaing 3d games in general.

desiv · 29 November 2010, 18:35

Quote:

Originally Posted by dabone

The sad part is that the a500 has slightly higher datatransfer than the 1200.

Wondering what you mean by the above?

desiv

dabone · 30 November 2010, 12:59

Quote:

Wondering what you mean by the above?

desiv

I meant that my kick butt 40mhz 68040 is hobbled by a slow data transfer. And my little 25mhz 030 has better speed.

(And this is using the same cf card between them).

Why they couldn't design a decent ide on the 600/1200 is beyond me. Of course they did alot of stupid design choices back then.

Later,
dabone

alexh · 30 November 2010, 15:28

Nobody in their right mind is going to buy an accelerator to play DOOM type games available in much better formats on other platforms.

I imagine they buy them for the same reason I would. To accelerate AmigaOS and Workbench.

Adding FAST RAM and adding a faster processor makes the loading of files faster (IDE on Amiga is PIO and somewhat CPU limited) it makes background screen drawing faster (especially with the right patches) and gives the whole experience a slicker feel.

Quote:

Originally Posted by dabone

Why they couldn't design a decent ide on the 600/1200 is beyond me.

Erm... because it was 1990/1 and "decent IDE" didn't exist?

The ATA standard wasn't finalised until 1994. The ECS and AGA Gayle chips pre-date EIDE and UDMA by many years.

pandy71 · 30 November 2010, 18:36

Quote:

Originally Posted by dabone

Why they couldn't design a decent ide on the 600/1200 is beyond me.

Accordingly to the my knowledge IDE is implemented in Amiga very similar to the PC (simple logic - adres decoder and bus buffer) - decent IDE means EIDE ie DMA - This is year 1996 in PC? I think that first time when DMA for IDE was used was PCI 486 integrated chipsets (first mobo for 486 used Vesa Local Bus and it was still non DMA solution) - On those times PC for HDD with DMA used SCSI - all IDE was for home use only.
Amiga performance is impacted by IDE itself (x86 byte organization) and by limitations of free cycles that can be used for data transfer - I can imagine DMA driven IDE but it will be big chip not fraction of Gayle with glue logic.

Adropac2 · 30 November 2010, 19:24

Some people will though Alex just because

Buy an accelerator purely to play doom for your Amiga when in fact you could play it better on PC?.Yeah you can certainly argue the point that it's a bit daft but the atmosphere generated will be an entirely different one because it's on the Amiga ie not those obvious visual differences but simply because it's running on Amiga.Personally i don't really see the point but that wont stop me loading up Doom on my new accelerator.It's not like these people don't know they can play a better version of the game

I sit down to the Amiga sometimes and do very little but open a few windows before maybe loading a game up to only it's title screen say.Bit pointless really but i still enjoy the time iv'e spent doing this such is my enjoyment of how the Amiga feels.To play Doom on Amiga may suit people better for these types of reason despite how ludicrous it may seem to someone else

Lots of things can be enjoyed in a more advanced way but it's not so entirely daft if you prefer another.People that listen to records still being a good example of this

orange · 30 November 2010, 21:36

I think the records are bad analogy, because most of them (if handled properly) should sound better than mp3 for various reasons.
that doom game will, however, look worse on Amiga than on cheap PC no matter how much money you throw.
but, yes, there are people who would like to run windows95 on zx spectrum.

20 November 2010, 01:16	#1
Amiga Forever Registered User Join Date: Jan 2010 Location: UK Posts: 228	Amiga Accelerator? I know some of you have Bought Amiga accelerator 56MHZ and 28MHZ but my questions would be.... What would you used 56MHZ for? Playing Doom? What would you used 28MHZ for? It would be nice for me to learn somethings ....not just for playing games....but somethings that i never know that you know

30 November 2010, 19:24	#19
Adropac2 Zone Friend Join Date: Jan 2006 Location: Kent Age: 51 Posts: 1,061	Some people will though Alex just because Buy an accelerator purely to play doom for your Amiga when in fact you could play it better on PC?.Yeah you can certainly argue the point that it's a bit daft but the atmosphere generated will be an entirely different one because it's on the Amiga ie not those obvious visual differences but simply because it's running on Amiga.Personally i don't really see the point but that wont stop me loading up Doom on my new accelerator.It's not like these people don't know they can play a better version of the game I sit down to the Amiga sometimes and do very little but open a few windows before maybe loading a game up to only it's title screen say.Bit pointless really but i still enjoy the time iv'e spent doing this such is my enjoyment of how the Amiga feels.To play Doom on Amiga may suit people better for these types of reason despite how ludicrous it may seem to someone else Lots of things can be enjoyed in a more advanced way but it's not so entirely daft if you prefer another.People that listen to records still being a good example of this Last edited by Adropac2; 01 December 2010 at 00:27.

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20 November 2010, 02:14	#2
Allen1 Registered User Join Date: Nov 2009 Location: Blyth England Age: 68 Posts: 786	Although I haven't as yet bought either of them, I would say that my reason for getting one would be to see how much faster and smoother things would load and run. The whole experience would be more for self indulgence rather that any practical use other than games and WHDload loading times, something like these would have been great for programs like Electrocad all those years ago when I made/designed my first blocky CAD circuit boards on my Amiga 1200. Nowadays both CAD, internet browsing and document writing has evolved way past anything that our old friend the Amiga could handle. Therefore I would say that these cards are going to mainly be used for games and maybe by some coders who wish to speed up their efforts and test game coding routines which is way past my abilities. Either board is a definite must have for any curious Amiga owner who wants to see what their computer can really do without breaking the bank.

20 November 2010, 10:42	#3
Graham Humphrey Moderator Join Date: Jul 2004 Location: Norwich, Norfolk, UK Age: 37 Posts: 11,167	Bear in mind it's not purely about Mhz but the actual processor - for instance a 33Mhz 68040 is quicker than a 50Mhz 68030. I own an Apollo 040 card and it runs jolly quick (relatively speaking of course) - Doom runs great on it, and a lot of later games require them, or at the very least take great advantage of them. Of course, processor-intensive applications like 3D rendering software benefit too (particularly with an FPU present), if that floats your boat. The only problem for me is that it seems less compatible with WHDLoad than my old '030 card (although I must stress the majority of games still run perfectly, but errors and glitches do crop up). Basically if you want one then what one you get really depends on what you want to use it for. I guess an '030 is more than enough for your average user who primarily wants to play WHDLoad games.

20 November 2010, 10:44	#4
Twiggy \m/ Join Date: Nov 2008 Location: Devon, U.K. Posts: 573	Mainly for WHDload (the ACA630). Lemon Amiga suggests that DooM can run on ECS, is this true? I'm pretty sure a 030 is enough to run it. Out of curiosity I'd probably try Debian Linux out, which needs an MMU (which the ACA630 has), but I don't think it needs a FPU.

20 November 2010, 11:43	#6
AmigaFun Registered User Join Date: May 2010 Location: UK Posts: 99	Personally, I bought one because I have a Blizzard IV, it's at least 10 years old, so who knows how much time it has left or if it goes bang due to some 'act of God'. Well, I would be in a situation of having a 1200 with WHD on it, but no 030 card to do it all justice. So for me it's an insurance policy, to extend the life of the 1200. Also, I don't really like the prices of 2nd or 3rd hand cards of equal age on the auction sites. So £160 for a new card with 64MB ram seems a no brainer. edit: 56Mhz for me, again an insurance policy as I may kick myself in the coming years if I did not go for that and I found a piece of software that really needed it...demo's for example.

20 November 2010, 17:42	#7
lambrettadave Registered User Join Date: Sep 2010 Location: south shields Posts: 140	in my mind the faster card (56mhz) would be better for the likes of Doom I have a 1230 mk2 with 32mb ram on it clocked at 40mhz and plays doom 1 ok but the others require it to be played on a postage stamp size. Where as me 1240 card plays all versions of doom no problems at a much larger screen size. I think the 28mhz version is a very good buy as just second hand ram cards which only have a max of 8 mb of ram on them are way over priced against the 28mhz card which would improve the a1200 a helva lot more and have more ram as well Dave

20 November 2010, 18:50	#8
Predseda Puttymoon inhabitant Join Date: Mar 2007 Location: Tromaville Age: 46 Posts: 7,546	Running jabber and iBrowse, so internet connection (ACA630 in my case). And WHD of course.

20 November 2010, 20:42	#9
orange Registered User Join Date: Apr 2007 Location: Belgrade Posts: 567	i think there are games that could use all MHz you can throw at them. for eg. vactor games, like 4D sports driving. and one of my all time favorites: The Killing Cloud oh, and I don't consider doom to be particularly interesting or important. that is simply 'pc style game'.. about those accelerators, you don't mention what cpu and for which amiga?

20 November 2010, 21:03	#10
kriz Junior Member Join Date: Sep 2001 Location: No(R)Way Age: 41 Posts: 3,200	For all the old classic demos a 030 56Mhz would be good aswell...

21 November 2010, 00:09	#11
DDNI Targ Explorer Join Date: Mar 2006 Location: Northern Ireland Posts: 5,432	@orange, I used to think that a faster CPU would make a big improvement in classic chipset dependent games. Sadly it is usually the case that either the game is not coded to utilise a faster CPU or the chipset itself becomes a bottleneck. Later Amiga games are better as the coders anticipated faster CPUs...

21 November 2010, 04:40	#12
dabone Registered User Join Date: Oct 2009 Location: Chattanooga TN, USA Posts: 109	I'm now playing with a a500 with a 030/25mhz accelerator and a add on 8meg and ide interface (dataflyer). For the most part the whdload games run the same as my 1200 with a Apollo 1240/40Mhz. To me it seems for just playing the classic games, make sure you have enough ram to preload. So the ram portion of the accelerators is much more important than raw speed for the majority of the users. The sad part is that the a500 has slightly higher datatransfer than the 1200. later, dabone

21 November 2010, 16:10	#14
Eclipse Turpentine Join Date: Oct 2007 Location: Kent, United Kingdom Posts: 744	I noticed a massive improvement when plaing 3d games in general.

30 November 2010, 21:36	#20
orange Registered User Join Date: Apr 2007 Location: Belgrade Posts: 567	I think the records are bad analogy, because most of them (if handled properly) should sound better than mp3 for various reasons. that doom game will, however, look worse on Amiga than on cheap PC no matter how much money you throw. but, yes, there are people who would like to run windows95 on zx spectrum.

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