Defrag a Compact Flash Card

Nibbler · 05 February 2015, 15:58

Hi Folks.

I wonder, if a "Defrag for a Compact Flash Card" is Good or Bad.

Some say, its not necessary, because it has no moving parts.

Other´s say, it destroys the CF Card.

Some say, it speed things up, even on an CF card.
Quiet Confusing

I try´d it with a test Partition and it worked just fine.

So what do you think about that?

Defrag a CF Card ? YES or NO ? More speed ? Yes or No ?
and what do you think of that programm. ( it was faster then Reorg )

http://aminet.net/package/disk/optim/DiskOptimizer

I fount no Thread about this,
so i hope it helps others to END this CONFUSION

thanks, dear Amiga Board Members.

lesta_smsc · 05 February 2015, 16:13

From my knowledge, there is no need to defrag flash devices. Equally, by doing so, you increase the read/write on them and this can reduce the lifespan of the drive.

bdb · 05 February 2015, 16:41

If you notice thrashing of the CF card's read/write heads during operation, then by all means defragment it

Amiga1992 · 05 February 2015, 16:45

Quote:

Originally Posted by bdb

If you notice thrashing of the CF card's read/write heads during operation,

Solid state media has no "heads".
Seriously doubt defragging would make any difference, as a CF card has no seek time.

Nibbler · 05 February 2015, 16:55

Thanks

So, NO DEFRAG on COMPACT FLASH CARDS , right ?
Now we know

lesta_smsc · 05 February 2015, 17:28

No defrag for any flash drives/SSD

Nibbler · 05 February 2015, 17:35

Quote:

Originally Posted by lesta_smsc

No defrag for any flash drives/SSD

Now its official

Zippy Zapp · 05 February 2015, 18:20

Quote:

Originally Posted by bdb

If you notice thrashing of the CF card's read/write heads during operation, then by all means defragment it

No, that means you need to do a head alignment.

pandy71 · 05 February 2015, 18:36

FLASH can be defragmented and sometimes it is recommended - with time files fragmentation occurs and combining may improve data recovery in case of problem related with storage.
On PC some software is equipped with special option to defrag FLASH.

http://www.mydefrag.com/faqgeneralin...emorydisk.html
http://www.pcworld.com/article/20475...-your-ssd.html

So performance improvement - not likely especially for Amiga where there is no DMA transfer for CF, data safety - probably yes.

Yakumo9275 · 05 February 2015, 19:19

flash has an internal map for wear leveling and bad cells, defrag will make things worse. dont do it.

Nibbler · 05 February 2015, 19:25

Quote:

Originally Posted by Yakumo9275

flash has an internal map for wear leveling and bad cells, defrag will make things worse. dont do it.

Ok, DON´T DEFRAG a CF CARD

Thanks guys, you´re the best !!

rikbliz · 05 February 2015, 21:24

Fragmentation is a by product of filesystem design. The whole concept of defragging largely came about with MS-DOS and their File Allocation Table (FAT, FAT32 etc) file system. Other file system such as ext on Linux don't require defragmentation because they don't spread individual files across non contiguous sections of the disk.

Fragmented filesystems slow down when the heads on a mechanical drive have to seek around the physical media more than would otherwise be necessary to read/write files. When it comes to flash media, whether it's a CF card or an SSD, defragmentation of file systems is unnecessary because there are no physical heads moving around, so the fragmentation has a no significant effect on performance. Plus as mentioned above, the sectors in flash media have a limited life span so defragmentation for the most part is just wearing out your flash media with no purpose.

I'm not knowledgeable about SFS, PFS and FFS on Amiga, but I wouldn't be half surprised if their designers made these filesystems so that fragmentation was either a non-issue or silently dealt with in the background... However if someone knows of a defrag tool for SFS or PFS (for HDDs) I'd like to know about it.

bdb · 05 February 2015, 23:10

Quote:

Originally Posted by Akira

Solid state media has no "heads".
Seriously doubt defragging would make any difference, as a CF card has no seek time.

Really?

Quote:

Originally Posted by Zippy Zapp

No, that means you need to do a head alignment.

Only those with so sense of sarcasm require that.

lesta_smsc · 05 February 2015, 23:41

I think the discussion is settled... let's not wage war over this people!

Jope · 06 February 2015, 08:02

Thank you for the discussion, gentlemen. Let's leave it at this. :-)

05 February 2015, 15:58	#1
Nibbler namm namm AMIGA Join Date: Jan 2015 Location: Austria Age: 44 Posts: 734	Defrag a Compact Flash Card Hi Folks. I wonder, if a "Defrag for a Compact Flash Card" is Good or Bad. Some say, its not necessary, because it has no moving parts. Other´s say, it destroys the CF Card. Some say, it speed things up, even on an CF card. Quiet Confusing I try´d it with a test Partition and it worked just fine. So what do you think about that? Defrag a CF Card ? YES or NO ? More speed ? Yes or No ? and what do you think of that programm. ( it was faster then Reorg ) http://aminet.net/package/disk/optim/DiskOptimizer I fount no Thread about this, so i hope it helps others to END this CONFUSION thanks, dear Amiga Board Members.

05 February 2015, 21:24	#12
rikbliz Registered User Join Date: Aug 2012 Location: Trenton, Ohio Posts: 113	Fragmentation is a by product of filesystem design. The whole concept of defragging largely came about with MS-DOS and their File Allocation Table (FAT, FAT32 etc) file system. Other file system such as ext on Linux don't require defragmentation because they don't spread individual files across non contiguous sections of the disk. Fragmented filesystems slow down when the heads on a mechanical drive have to seek around the physical media more than would otherwise be necessary to read/write files. When it comes to flash media, whether it's a CF card or an SSD, defragmentation of file systems is unnecessary because there are no physical heads moving around, so the fragmentation has a no significant effect on performance. Plus as mentioned above, the sectors in flash media have a limited life span so defragmentation for the most part is just wearing out your flash media with no purpose. I'm not knowledgeable about SFS, PFS and FFS on Amiga, but I wouldn't be half surprised if their designers made these filesystems so that fragmentation was either a non-issue or silently dealt with in the background... However if someone knows of a defrag tool for SFS or PFS (for HDDs) I'd like to know about it. Last edited by rikbliz; 05 February 2015 at 21:43.

Similar Threads
Thread	Thread Starter	Forum	Replies	Last Post
8 GB Compact Flash card	Kenan	support.Hardware	6	07 June 2013 20:54
selling a compact flash card? anyone	steve_uktv	MarketPlace	14	07 February 2010 01:03
Compact Flash Card as a Disk in WinUAE?	Tempest 2084	support.WinUAE	36	30 May 2009 19:35
Compact Flash card as floppy drive?	Fingerlickin_B	support.Hardware	4	31 July 2007 18:27
How To Get A600 To Read Compact Flash Card ?	Rich M	Amiga scene	5	02 May 2005 06:56

05 February 2015, 16:13	#2
lesta_smsc Registered User Join Date: Feb 2012 Location: United Kingdom Posts: 3,173	From my knowledge, there is no need to defrag flash devices. Equally, by doing so, you increase the read/write on them and this can reduce the lifespan of the drive.

05 February 2015, 16:41	#3
bdb Registered User Join Date: Jul 2012 Location: USA Posts: 239	If you notice thrashing of the CF card's read/write heads during operation, then by all means defragment it

05 February 2015, 16:55	#5
Nibbler namm namm AMIGA Join Date: Jan 2015 Location: Austria Age: 44 Posts: 734	Thanks So, NO DEFRAG on COMPACT FLASH CARDS , right ? Now we know

05 February 2015, 17:28	#6
lesta_smsc Registered User Join Date: Feb 2012 Location: United Kingdom Posts: 3,173	No defrag for any flash drives/SSD

05 February 2015, 18:36	#9
pandy71 Registered User Join Date: Jun 2010 Location: PL? Posts: 2,746	FLASH can be defragmented and sometimes it is recommended - with time files fragmentation occurs and combining may improve data recovery in case of problem related with storage. On PC some software is equipped with special option to defrag FLASH. http://www.mydefrag.com/faqgeneralin...emorydisk.html http://www.pcworld.com/article/20475...-your-ssd.html So performance improvement - not likely especially for Amiga where there is no DMA transfer for CF, data safety - probably yes.

05 February 2015, 19:19	#10
Yakumo9275 Registered User Join Date: Jan 2013 Location: Lexington VA Posts: 94	flash has an internal map for wear leveling and bad cells, defrag will make things worse. dont do it.

05 February 2015, 23:41	#14
lesta_smsc Registered User Join Date: Feb 2012 Location: United Kingdom Posts: 3,173	I think the discussion is settled... let's not wage war over this people!

06 February 2015, 08:02	#15
Jope - Join Date: Jul 2003 Location: Helsinki / Finland Age: 43 Posts: 9,861	Thank you for the discussion, gentlemen. Let's leave it at this. :-)

Currently Active Users Viewing This Thread: 1 (0 members and 1 guests)