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Old 06 May 2018, 23:09   #121
rodpulsar
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guest.r : what you just did is incredible.

I know I may sound a bit hysterical on this, but I'm searching for a way to play these Amiga games on my rotated screen since weeks now, I tried tons of solutions, emulators, obscure old programs, quite frankly I gave up. I'm really glad I finally found that thread, what you just created is enough already

I'll finish my project and take some videos / screens so you understand better what I wanted to achieve, perhaps it'll give some ideas to other ppl as well.

My thanks again guest.r , you work is great an you're very kind !

EDIT : I didn't think that masks were applied "after" the shader so in fact the horizontal ones are ok : no need to create new ones

As you can see all is ok :

[IMG][/IMG]

I'm positionned on the right, so I see the image perfectly, and scanlines are horizontal

Last edited by rodpulsar; 06 May 2018 at 23:15.
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Old 06 May 2018, 23:55   #122
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Hey, i'm glad it's working well and looking good.

If you want some more special shaders adapted, just tell...
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Old 15 May 2018, 14:12   #123
Leandro Jardim
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Dunny View Post
These shaders are all very nice, but they look much cleaner and sharper than my 14" TV ever did. I wish someone would make a shader that recreated those, that would rock.
I wish even less, that someone with Photoshop/GIMP skills would make a fullscreen "glare" overlay for using with the GuestCRT shaders and masks, but I think this could be hard to make, because no one have this idea.
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Old 15 May 2018, 15:34   #124
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You mean something like this?



more blur:




This one looks nice: Grab it from the media fire link.


Last edited by Retro-Nerd; 15 May 2018 at 18:57.
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Old 15 May 2018, 18:55   #125
Leandro Jardim
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Yes, similar to that but with two differences: something without a photo of an ancient TV/Monitor (ie. only the "glare" part) but at the same time trying simulate a "rounded" CRT screen look.
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Old 15 May 2018, 19:02   #126
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The rounded look comes from the shader, i.e. CRT Geom. I don't use them anyway, hate the rounded look. Just posted some overlays i've found. Maybe a skilled EAB user can create something better for you.
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Old 15 May 2018, 19:14   #127
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Oh no, Retro-Nerd, I didn't want to ignore, to depreciate your valuable help! Was my fault, I only wanted to give thanks at the thread end, because I thought it was more logical.

Thank you for your help and comprehension, always.
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Old 24 May 2018, 10:56   #128
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Quote:
Originally Posted by guest.r View Post
It uses phosphor mask, is the most neutral one.

I can add a seperate nomask shader and then another dotmask shader which contains 5 mask types (0, 1, 2, 3, 4 - 0 is phosphor, other are lottes masks).

I also fixed the RA glsl dotmask shader for 0 mask.

Speed should stay acceptable i guess.

(unpack crt-guest-nomask in crt\shaders, the preset in crt folder).

The masks can get a decent tweak also.
Sorry for the late reply.

This version is absolutely fantastic, I'm loving it . It's amazing how well it can be configured to look like my Sony Trinitron CRT on just the 720p screen of my portable.

I've settled on using the CGWG dot mask. Speed wise this version is OK.

As always some questions..

It would be great if you could make a rotated version for this shader too, such that it mimics a "TATE" monitor for arcade games. Would be wonderful to try that on the likes of Donkey Kong, Bombjack etc in the MAME core.

With regards to curvature, do you know by any chance how CRT-Geom achieves it's curvature to appear without any moire effect? I think it's one of the only shaders that doesn't have the ugly moire with curvature, it must be using some "trick" to achieve that? Personally the moire is what keeps me from using any curvature on shaders (the moire is so not like a real CRT, it's really distracting).
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Old 24 May 2018, 11:23   #129
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It's not so much the glare or the curvature (I had a perfectly flat screen for my Amiga) but rather the RF/PAL colour bleed, which is a completely different beast to the colour bloom we're seeing in other shaders. I have yet to see any shaders that look correct for a PAL TV, they all look like arcade CRT monitors.
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Old 24 May 2018, 11:57   #130
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It's not so much the glare or the curvature (I had a perfectly flat screen for my Amiga) but rather the RF/PAL colour bleed, which is a completely different beast to the colour bloom we're seeing in other shaders. I have yet to see any shaders that look correct for a PAL TV, they all look like arcade CRT monitors.
I never used RF for my Amiga or consoles, always used RGB input (mostly via SCART) so the RF/PAL color bleed wasn't really a factor for me personally.

I do have several different CRT monitors and TV's, but even those all look different because of their different mask technologies, then add in the possibility of using RF instead of RGB, then add gamma, contrast, brightness etc configuration and you have a million different possible looks to one and the same input signal.

So yeah, there's a good reason why so many people have a different opinion of what looks "correct" for them when it comes to CRT.. Queue the long list of configurable parameters in shaders
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Old 24 May 2018, 16:41   #131
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Originally Posted by Dr.Venom View Post
Sorry for the late reply.

This version is absolutely fantastic, I'm loving it . It's amazing how well it can be configured to look like my Sony Trinitron CRT on just the 720p screen of my portable.

I've settled on using the CGWG dot mask. Speed wise this version is OK.

As always some questions..

It would be great if you could make a rotated version for this shader too, such that it mimics a "TATE" monitor for arcade games. Would be wonderful to try that on the likes of Donkey Kong, Bombjack etc in the MAME core.

With regards to curvature, do you know by any chance how CRT-Geom achieves it's curvature to appear without any moire effect? I think it's one of the only shaders that doesn't have the ugly moire with curvature, it must be using some "trick" to achieve that? Personally the moire is what keeps me from using any curvature on shaders (the moire is so not like a real CRT, it's really distracting).
I can add rotation to it, np. Hope it can find a decent use. The aspect is corrected also, otherwise the image gets a streched look.

Unfortunately i don't get any moire with crt-geom, but afaik it has been reported at libretro forums also. It might have something to do with display resolution / scale factor also since i noticed it when using hi-res (like 640x480) resolutions with lottes on PSX.
Moment...yep, the moire is also here with lottes/geom on a hi-res game in RA. I don't also use much curvature othervise.

PS: Those shaders work under Retroarch, not WinUAE.
Attached Files
File Type: zip crt-guest-nomask-vertical.zip (3.6 KB, 7 views)
File Type: zip crt-guest-dotmask-vertical-preset.zip (305 Bytes, 7 views)

Last edited by guest.r; 25 May 2018 at 16:03. Reason: Shader update.
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Old 24 May 2018, 21:03   #132
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Dunny View Post
It's not so much the glare or the curvature (I had a perfectly flat screen for my Amiga) but rather the RF/PAL colour bleed, which is a completely different beast to the colour bloom we're seeing in other shaders. I have yet to see any shaders that look correct for a PAL TV, they all look like arcade CRT monitors.
I posted a pal shader in the FS-UAE thread.

http://eab.abime.net/showthread.php?t=87030&page=10

Unfortunately it's a multipass shader and depends on calculated masks, so i'm not able to create one for WinUAE. Maybe you like it.
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Old 25 May 2018, 09:01   #133
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I can add rotation to it, np. Hope it can find a decent use. The aspect is corrected also, otherwise the image gets a streched look.
Thanks, I gave it a go, but unfortunately it's not working out of the box correctly for my use case.

I want to use it mainly for the vertical Arcade games when using the mame core in retroarch. The thing is that MAME (and the core in RA) already rotates the screen for vertical games, so with your shader rotation added the screen is rotated to upside down. Also the aspect is incorrect as the RA core does provide the correct aspect by itself, so I don't think adjustment would be needed?

Could you possibly set up the mame libretro core for yourself too such that we can compare from same base and settings? It's a little bit finnicky to get working, but once you do it works quite nice. You need to copy your main mame installation folder to the retroarch system folder and make sure the path to the roms in system/mame.ini is correct. It could be that the mame.ini needs to be inside the ini folder for RA to pick it up, I'm not sure. Also set the core option to "read configuration = on".

If it would be possible could you do any developments with the CRT-Guest that has the different configurable masks (the one with the two passes) as I'm loving that version..

Quote:
Originally Posted by guest.r View Post

Unfortunately i don't get any moire with crt-geom
Ah, I may have worded my original message wrongly, but that is exactly what I was getting at . CRT-Geom does not have any moire when applying the curvature on low res screens. So I wondered how it achieves that? Does CRT-Geom use some "trick" in the code to prevent the moire from appearing?

For the record, CRT-Guest is my go to shader for RA now, so I was just thinking whether a CRT-Geom like curvature feature (i.e one that does not produce any moire) could be added as an option for a CRT-Guest version to use on "higher-end" / desktop setups (as it will probably be a lot slower)..
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Old 25 May 2018, 12:45   #134
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Ah, it might not be rotated shader but vertical shader. I tested this version with MAME 2003 core and donkey kong / pengo and it worked fine. All masks and curvature included.

I guess lottes moire is depending on other features too, didn't notice any here. Anyway, i replaced the old shaders so they don't litter the place.
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Old 25 May 2018, 15:01   #135
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Thanks for this, I meant vertical shader indeed

Now I'm going to be a bit nitpicky I guess, but I've spent some fair time adjusting the two pass horizontal "dotmask" shader from post #113, see here, and found a personal optimum with that one that I'm really pleased with (I never achieved that with any other shader before) and this vertical shader has a different set of parameters / some left out . I'd rather not go through the whole tweaking proces again, possibly to find out I can't match my previous optimum because of the different parameter set.

Would it be too much to ask whether you could create the vertical version based on the two-pass dotmask version from post #113? That way I can apply my same parameters.

What I saw shortly of the curvature does make me (very) curious how it would look with the horizontal version from post #113! Since using the same set of parameters it will also be easier for me to judge what (possible moire) effect the curvature will have.

Hopefully this is not too much to ask...
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Old 25 May 2018, 16:02   #136
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Np., i'm glad we're getting there.
Should be authentic now. I updated the post above.
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Old 25 May 2018, 18:47   #137
Dr.Venom
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Np., i'm glad we're getting there.
Should be authentic now. I updated the post above.

Thanks, I tried the updated version but there's something wonkey happening.

Please see two attached snapshots of the bombjack test / startup screen, with 4x4 integer scaling applied from within RA.

The first picture is with the original (non-vertical) shader. I've exaggerated some settings to make the mask (nr 1) clearly visible. As you can see the mask is correct and clearly distuingishable (as are the scanlines). This can be seen especially in the white squares.

Compare this to screenshot two of the exact same but now with the vertical shader. I would have expected the scanlines and mask to look like the horizontal version but only vertically orientated, but instead the image looks quite different from that. The mask isn't as cleanly distuingishable and neither the scanlines seem evenly spaced.

If you look in the white squares you'll also see vertical lines of red and green appearing, which suggests something may be off with the dotmask orientation?

Does this look the same on your side? (I gather you also have "rotate" set to 1 in mame.ini?)
Attached Thumbnails
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Name:	crt-guest-dotmask.png
Views:	32
Size:	51.1 KB
ID:	58360   Click image for larger version

Name:	crt-guest-dotmask-vertical.png
Views:	31
Size:	88.8 KB
ID:	58361  
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Old 25 May 2018, 20:01   #138
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Yep, it's normal for this to happen. With my config (MAME 2003) vertical games use shaders differently and are rotated. There is no mechanism withing the shader framework to tell if this happens, so we must use different shaders, which means no auto setup, unfortunately.

In the second screenie the scanlines are vertical, but mask is horizontal and the result isn't good.

Maybe you could try a rotated dotmask too and see if it fits your config.

Edit: i'll rather create a new preset, so things don't get mixed up.
If somebody already downloaded previous dotmask, the original is posted above.
Attached Files
File Type: zip dotmask-vertical.zip (1.6 KB, 9 views)
File Type: zip crt-guest-dotmask-vertical2-preset.zip (305 Bytes, 9 views)

Last edited by guest.r; 25 May 2018 at 21:42.
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Old 26 May 2018, 09:44   #139
Dr.Venom
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Edit: i'll rather create a new preset, so things don't get mixed up.
If somebody already downloaded previous dotmask, the original is posted above.
Thanks, works like a charm now

The curvature looks quite nice too, there is some little banding / moire with some games / settings, but I'll just have to experience whether in use that's disturbing or not.

With regards to the curvature, could you possibly add that to the horizontal shader also (from post #113)? I'm curious how the curvature will fare with some of the horizontal games I'm used to. Hopefully it'll work mostly without the banding / moire effect.
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Old 26 May 2018, 12:25   #140
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With regards to the curvature, could you possibly add that to the horizontal shader also (from post #113)? I'm curious how the curvature will fare with some of the horizontal games I'm used to. Hopefully it'll work mostly without the banding / moire effect.
Np, here you have it.
Cgwg and mask 2 (aperture) should cause least artifacts, but other masks should look decent to, but are a bit wider, which could interact with bent scanlines.
Attached Files
File Type: zip crt-guest-nomask-curvature.zip (3.7 KB, 16 views)
File Type: zip crt-guest-dotmask-curvature.preset.zip (307 Bytes, 14 views)

Last edited by guest.r; 26 May 2018 at 13:04. Reason: Shader update.
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