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| View Poll Results: How do you feel about some of the recent pricing for Amiga games? | |||
| PHYSICAL - €34.95 - YES, this price is justified and I'm ok with it. |
   
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2 | 40.00% |
| PHYSICAL - €34.95 - NO, I believe this price is too much. |
  
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1 | 20.00% |
| DIGITAL - €29.95 - YES, this price is justified and I'm ok with it. |
  
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0 | 0% |
| DIGITAL - €29.95 - NO, I believe this price is too much. |
  
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4 | 80.00% |
| Multiple Choice Poll. Voters: 5. You may not vote on this poll | |||
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Thread Tools |
18 January 2020, 19:25
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#1 |
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Amigaholic
Join Date: Dec 2009
Location: UK
Posts: 4,678
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Discussion about the cost and value of new Amiga games and whether they are overcharged or not!
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18 January 2020, 19:40
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#2 |
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Banned
Join Date: Aug 2005
Location: London / Sydney
Age: 47
Posts: 20,420
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...not at £39.99 £35.99; that's absolutely mental
 We're not talking new PC / PS4 / Xbox One quality games here... and it's really just a slightly more polished version of the unreleased 1992 game. I hope the digital download will not be as extortionate; otherwise I'll definitely not bother. |
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18 January 2020, 21:43
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#3 |
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Amigaholic
Join Date: Dec 2009
Location: UK
Posts: 4,678
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I know, pre-orders used to be £29.99, but now they're £35.99. I think this maybe my last physical order from them due to the prices, I know I like collecting boxes but I can't see them lowering the prices unless they just sell the box with disk/tape/cart and manual!
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18 January 2020, 21:57
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#4 | |
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Banned
Join Date: Aug 2005
Location: London / Sydney
Age: 47
Posts: 20,420
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Quote:
 I felt exactly the same way when I saw the news related to this game a month or so ago: Matchic. I mean; it's a poor man's Puzznic or any of these... and you want to charge how much exactly? I wouldn't pay more than a fiver  You know me, I'm all for supporting Amiga developers / authors etc... but it seems that some of them over the past year or so are absolutely taking the biscuit when it comes to ludicrous pricing for mediocre games  Another thing that really annoys me, and is definitely taking the mickey; is when the digital download price is virtually the same price as the physical copy... Reshoot R anyone  I'm sure the same thing will occur with Reshoot Proxima III as it's been gotten away with / somehow accepted before; mark my words!!!
Last edited by DamienD; 18 January 2020 at 22:07. |
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18 January 2020, 23:13
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#5 |
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Amigaholic
Join Date: Dec 2009
Location: UK
Posts: 4,678
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Pity they don't do an Amiga version of the Premium+ (£13.99) or Budget (£6.99) release like the do for the C64!
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18 January 2020, 23:23
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#6 |
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Global Moderator
Join Date: Nov 2001
Location: Derby, UK
Age: 48
Posts: 9,355
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I have to agree, these prices are ludicrous, but good luck..
Sorry I'd rather pay for a indi title off steam for a fraction of the price.. In fact I'll go buy qwak for a fiver! |
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18 January 2020, 23:35
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#7 |
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Registered User
Join Date: Dec 2014
Location: Netherlands
Posts: 1,406
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Agree, with these prices I'm not really motivated to buy these games anymore.
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18 January 2020, 23:50
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#8 |
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Banned
Join Date: Aug 2005
Location: London / Sydney
Age: 47
Posts: 20,420
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Exactly guys.
Best way to discourage this type of behaviour from greedy devs massively overvaluing their products, is to not purchase at all; be it physical or digital release!!! Eventually they'll realise that they need to be realistic about pricing on a hobby / 30 year old computer; otherwise... It just stinks; especially when there are so many free games way above the level of these so called "commercial" games... to name a few, but there are many others; Rygar, Trap Runner, Celtic Heart, River Raid Reloaded and the up coming Scourge of the Underkind. Again, I'd like to reiterate that charging money for a game that you've worked hard on is totally fine It's the dreaming up of stupid / unjustified prices which are in parallel with new "PC / PS4 / Xbox One" quality games which is immoral... this is what the Amiga community doesn't need, or want to have set as "the norm" (which is how I feel it's been going due to the rise in everything "Retro")
Last edited by DamienD; 19 January 2020 at 02:15. |
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19 January 2020, 01:32
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#9 | |
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Amigaholic
Join Date: Dec 2009
Location: UK
Posts: 4,678
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Quote:
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19 January 2020, 02:38
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#10 |
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Registered User
Join Date: Oct 2015
Location: Landsberg / Germany
Posts: 526
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I notice a certain smell in this thread, one which poisons several other threads in this great forum already. The smell of trolls poison.
@timeslip1974: Don´t be put off by comments of some guys who have never learned to filter their thoughts before putting them online, and so are destroying the community. They are loud and noisy, but they still are the crying minority. Glad you guys are so determined and finally release your game. |
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19 January 2020, 09:43
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#11 |
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Ex nihilo nihil
Join Date: Oct 2017
Location: CH
Posts: 4,857
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The law of supply and demand is one thing.
However, selling a physical version (box + manual + data carrier (floppy/CD/etc.) + other...) and a dematerialized version at a similar price sends a strange message to potential customers. Nobody likes to be taken for a "cash cow". Some people would do well to think about it... The frankness that emanates here regarding the price is a subject that has been discussed many times in other threads in the past (on EAB and elsewhere). Not wanting to take it into account seems strange to me, especially since everybody agree to pay a price for a new production. My two cents. |
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19 January 2020, 11:25
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#12 | |
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Registered User
Join Date: Oct 2015
Location: Landsberg / Germany
Posts: 526
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Quote:
This is very common practice within the whole media industry (games, magazines, audio,movies) and for a good reason: The costs for selling digitally rather than physically are kind of comparable. The human factors (development time etc.) are exactly the same, and digital distribution is not free either. Digistore24 for example gets about 20 - 45 percent of the asking price for providing servers, handling of files and money transaction, handling invoices, customer servicer etc. |
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19 January 2020, 11:25
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#13 |
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Puttymoon inhabitant
Join Date: Mar 2007
Location: Tromaville
Age: 46
Posts: 7,540
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I was really looking forward to Rotator, but I am afraid I can not afford it.
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19 January 2020, 11:51
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#14 | |||
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Banned
Join Date: Aug 2005
Location: London / Sydney
Age: 47
Posts: 20,420
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Quote:
As for "destroying the community"; I suggest you take a long hard look at yourself in the mirror, your pricing and your "marketing practices" across forums. You're not creating games for the love of the Amiga or the community as many others are... you are totally in it for the money; it's so blatantly obvious!!! I mean, you seem to think it's ok to tell people that we really need to read your text / explanation to accompany a 15 second video, but knowing full well that the only way to do so is by subscribing to your Patreon Quote:
Quote:
Here's some recent examples of Amiga games for sale in regards to physical versus digital price: Black Dawn Rebirth: Oh wow, look at that... for all 9 of the above games listed; the digital download price is usually less than half the price of the physical, and sometimes only a quarter or even free. I have no issue with the physical or digital pricing of any games listed above. These are fair prices Now let's have a closer look at your pricing for Reshoot R shall we? Physical: https://www.amigashop.org/product_in...roducts_id=293 €34.95 ...or even Reshoot? Physical: https://www.amigashop.org/product_in...roducts_id=273 €23.95 I don't know about you guys, but something here sticks out like a sore thumb... You can try to pull the wool over peoples' eyes in order to suit your own agenda Richard, but the figures don't lie... you also can't scrub out people's opinions / feelings on this, no matter what BS justification you try to conjure up
Last edited by DamienD; 19 January 2020 at 14:51. |
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19 January 2020, 13:19
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#15 |
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Amigaholic
Join Date: Dec 2009
Location: UK
Posts: 4,678
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It would be interesting to see the cost breakdown for the development of these games, the marketing/publishing/packaging costs and how the final physical/digital selling price is determined to justify the pricing. But, that all depends *IF* devs/pubs want to share that information and how transparent/honest they want to be if they do!
Maybe this would be a good project for some of the Amiga/Retro news/game sites, to investigate the costs involved to make these games, excluding 'crowd funding' like Kickstarter, Indiegogo, Patreon etc? |
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19 January 2020, 14:35
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#16 | |
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Global Moderator
Join Date: Nov 2001
Location: Derby, UK
Age: 48
Posts: 9,355
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Quote:
I give a shit about your attitude towards anyone who questions you, anyone who doesn't agree with you. Nobody can say anything about your products unless it is glowing with praise. Let's face some home truths here. If you post on this forum, which is a public forum then you leave yourself open to people having an opinion. I suggest if you don't like it, you know where the door is. I don't see you contribute anything to this community unless it is for your own financial gain! Now i really don't care about your feelings on this matter.. Accept that people will havr an opinion on everything. Accept that crying will do you no good and craxk on.. Do your game, make it great and accept we all have our opinions! |
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19 January 2020, 15:29
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#17 |
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Banned
Join Date: Aug 2005
Location: London / Sydney
Age: 47
Posts: 20,420
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Thread now moved out of the News section... we don't need this type of discussion broadcast across all of the http://abime.net/ network...
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19 January 2020, 16:30
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#18 | |
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Banned
Join Date: Aug 2005
Location: London / Sydney
Age: 47
Posts: 20,420
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Quote:
You seem to be implying that I'm a troll and a destroyer of the Amiga community... nothing could be further from the truth Ok yes, I'm opinionated and won't just sit back and say nothing when something is wrong... but you really need to do your research before you make such allegations towards me. Everything I do is in order to progress the Amiga community and absolutely free; not for personal, financial gain; unlike yourself... Let's see, here's a quick list, but by no means exhaustive:
Last edited by DamienD; 19 January 2020 at 17:50. |
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19 January 2020, 16:31
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#19 | |
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Registered User
Join Date: Oct 2017
Location: Sunderland, England
Posts: 2,702
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Quote:
The first thing you have to take into account is Inflation, in 1992 £14 is the equivalent to £25 in today's prices, and £25 in 1992 is £45. https://www.inflationtool.com/britis...e?amount=25.00 Here's the forecasts I did for the Rygar boxes: Product (inc. VAT) £5.21 50 £260.50 Shipping and CIF £101.59 1 £101.59 Total £362.09 Duty @11% £46.00 Foam £1.00 £50.00 Envelopes £0.36 £18.00 Total Delivered Cost £476.09 Price per box £9.52 Now that doesn't include a manual, the floppy disks or the labels. So you can safely add about £4.00 to the price per game box. £13.50 to produce a Frontier 2 sized box which if I'm honest, anything else just won't do as there's no point. Now what is the real kicker is the delivery and distribution costs, unless you use a distributor who'll take a hefty cut, delivering into Europe is about £6 un-tracked, £10 tracked, outside of Europe costs more... like £13. So before you even start you're looking at £15-£20 just to get the box delivered to the customer based on small numbers (50). Now to code a game takes a long time, it took me a year to do Rygar and it's well documented, 6 months to do Bomb Jack, but did I do for the money? ... if I did I would be completely skint. So what do I think is fair...? If a game is good people will buy it/support the devs/community, if it's bad people won't buy it (Iron Gate/Amiten shite)...or at least they won't buy it in decent numbers (At least 100+) For me I would be well happy if I made £1,000 a year from making Amiga games, any money I made from Rygar I fed back into the Amiga and the community. So I think for a well made game that took 6-9 months to create then on digital download people should be paying around £5 to £10, if they want a shiny box delivered around the World then it should be circa £30. Don't forget - games is not just about the coder...the entire team should be paid depending on the circumstances. Geezer |
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19 January 2020, 16:44
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#20 | |
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Going nowhere
Join Date: Oct 2001
Location: United Kingdom
Age: 50
Posts: 8,987
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Quote:
Let's be clear here, 45% is nearly HALF of the selling price. You could do all the hosting and selling yourself, there are plenty of budget alternatives than literally giving away half of your efforts to someone else. Steam PROVES that not all digital sales are the same. That the likes of Sony think they can get away with charging the same on Playstation Network for a digital download as they could for the physical version is one reason why I will NEVER pay for a Sony digital download. Steam however shows what is possible, and shows that the cost isn't always the same, no box, no artwork charge, no instruction manual, no disks, no badge etc, etc, these items all come at a cost the digital one doesn't. I'm not going to jump on any angry bandwagons here, but you have CUSTOMERS telling you you're charging too much and you appear to be dismissing them. You could do that when the Amiga was king and selling software in the hundreds of the thousands, but those days are long gone. I appreciate the efforts of ANYONE, no matter whether its a tour de force in programming, or its a simple effort, but you have something called history that isn't on your side. I can probably count on one hand the amount of Amiga titles back in its golden years that attracted a pricepoint of £35. Shadow of the Beast is one, the edition with the Roger Dean T-Shirt. But it wasn't the norm. If anyone is under the illusion that they are going to get rewarded handsomely for their Amiga game efforts today in 2020, they are in it for the wrong reasons. Frankly no amount of money is going to adequately compensate ANYONE for anything done on the Amiga in the past 20 years, because the Amiga is no longer financially viable where you could quit your job and just do Amiga games, so if your price point of £35 is to try and rectify that, I can assure you, it NEVER will. You are most welcome to charge whatever you like for the games you make, but coincidentally, customers are also welcome to pass up on your games and buy something else, because the market seems to have settled on prices most people are happy to pay, yours seem to be quite a bit higher. Me personally? I'd rather have hundreds of happy customers waiting eagerly with their money for my next release, rather than maybe 40 people. You'll make the choice thats right for you 
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