Converted High Density Floppy

17 February 2003, 01:59

I recently had a Samsung HD floppy drive converted to DD. It boots to workbench with no problems but cannot load Jim Power. What are the best non-dos games to test the limits of this drive? I'm looking for a title that should work with a converted HD drive and another one that should not.

Overdoc · 18 February 2003, 01:37

All games which are using the standard Amigados loading routines ( like Workbench does ) will work ok.
All games that use loading routines which rely on the drives 'ready' signal will not work. Most times they will fail when the drive stops ( e.g. for playing the intro ), and then should continue loading, which it won't do because the routine will never get the ready signal from the converted drive

I once fiddled about with some converted PC drives and found out that e.g. Robocop wouldn't continue to load after the game's intro when loading from a PC drive. So I used this game for testing.
Btw. you can build some small electronic board which will come around this problem and let you use a PC drive like a normal Amiga one. You can find instructions for that on Aminet.

18 February 2003, 01:54

I found this on Aminet. I guess this is the fix I need, right? And it is made by....Retroman????

Overdoc · 19 February 2003, 00:36

No, unfortunately this is not the one I was thinking about. I think this fix is only for newer, Escom A-1200 models which also had PC drives in them, but had an additional small board attached to the drive so the drive works like an Amiga drive.
What you need would be exactly this small circuit board ! Then you can use a PC drive 100% like an Amiga drive ( for Escom A-1200 drive you need the additional diode fix, but maybe for an A-500 you needn't ? )
I cannot remember exactly how the title of the correct hack was on Aminet, but I remember there were 2:
One was just suggesting to swap some wires in the cable. This one doesn't work 100% with NDOS disks.
The other one suggests to build a more or less complicated board with some TTL chips. This one I think should work.

But I just remembered that I once asked someone who had an Escom A-1200 to make a drawing of the small floppy circuit for me

If I can find it I will send it to you ! Never built it myself, but I thnik it should work.
Another alternative would be to buy the Kylwaldia-Controller from an Amiga dealer. Doesn't cost much an you can always use PC drives then

19 February 2003, 02:10

I were planning to replace missing floppies of 1xA600 and 3xA500s. I can't afford or build four different floppy interfaces. : ((

Overdoc · 19 February 2003, 21:58

Well, the interface is always the same, no matter if it is a A-500 or 600 or 1200. But sure, buying 4 Kylwaldias wouldn't pay.
But you can also have a look for special PC drives which will just work on the Amiga when you change the drive's jumper setting

I only know the Chinon FZ-357 is such a drive. I see them from time to time at fleamarkets or used computer shops. Maybe you find some of these ? Then you don't need to buy or build any interface

19 February 2003, 22:23

All the chinons I encountered were already in amigas

Thanks again.

Amiga1992 · 19 February 2003, 23:30

Also look for Panasonic JU257 drives.

Overdoc · 21 February 2003, 01:03

Maybe also the TEAC 235-HF will work ? TEAC 235-F is an Amiga drive, so maybe the HF, too ? I once picked up one of these for 1 Euro on a fleamarket, but haven't checked whether it works, yet.

Btw, Burseg, why are all your miggys missing their drives ?

21 February 2003, 01:26

Two of the 500s did not have drives when I bought them. Two other amigas have drives that don't work. They might be repaired but the only person I knew that could do it said the drives were just too old and wouldn't work anyway.

21 February 2003, 01:29

I created a thread in the marketplace section. If you're sure these drives will work I'm looking for them

Overdoc · 22 February 2003, 02:22

Well, I know for sure that the FZ-357 works because I have 2 of them working in Amiga computers, and also some A-2000 models had them built in from factory

For the Panasonic there exist quite a large number of different drives, all starting with the number JU-257. Some of them can be converted to work with Amigas just by soldering two pads on the board, but I think some cannot be converted easily !

As for the Teac 235HF I haven't tested it 100%, yet, since I don't
have my Robocop disk any more, and also I haven't built a suited cable, yet. If I just hook the drive to the Amiga like it is then I can read Amiga disks, but I am not sure if it will read also NDOS disks ? Also, the diskchange will not work, which I think is because most PC drives have pins 2 & 34 swapped. But this can be done by modifying the cable.

I have repaired quite a few Amiga drives, but I also have 2 where I have no idea why they don't work ???
Common problems I repaired was misaligned upper heads, misaligned track-0 sensor, misaligned stepper motor, damaged or bad contact in disk-insertion sensor, broken wire in motor coil.

So if your drives have one of these problems then perhaps I could repair them, but I think you would pay more shipping them to me than it would be worth !

I think your best chance would be to look in used PC computer shops if you can find a FZ-357. You can easily identify them, because they have the eject button on the outer side of the drive and not a bit in the middle like other drives.

22 February 2003, 02:29

I think I'll wait for a while and collect dead hardware, including A590 bios chips so that I can send you all at once

Thanks for the offer, it isn't practically easy as you know

I'll keep looking for the floppies.

That different eject button is nice, it might fit into amigas better.

Amiga1992 · 24 February 2003, 15:33

The JU257 I had was not modified, I only flipped some dipswitches and it worked, HOWEVER, it did not have teh ready signal thing fixed, so a lot of games wouldn't work (I remember having to use teh changedisk command in workbench to make the Amiga recognize a new disk!

)

24 February 2003, 16:09

Hmm that's too bad.

25 February 2003, 17:38

I've found a Panasonic JU-253-033P now. It has some jumpers on the back. Can I convert it to amiga?

Amiga1992 · 25 February 2003, 20:07

Play around with the jumpers. Flick some, turn on the amiga, check. Flick some others, turn on the Amiga, check. Until it works.

Stick a bootable AmigaDOS disk in it so you check if it works.

As for the ready-signal thing I have no clue about how to mod it, but it is possible, i think.

Overdoc · 25 February 2003, 20:53

Well, I am not 100% sure and also a bit too lazy to open up about 15 A-500s

, but I think I have seen the JU257-033P in an Amiga

Usually, there should be either jumpers or small switches on the back of the drive. There is normally one for DS0/DS1, one for RY/DC ( or RD/DC - short for Ready/Diskchange ) and maybe another one or two others.
The DS0/DS1 has to be put to DS0 for internal use, and the RD/DC has to be put in RD mode to work on the Amiga.
If it doesn't recognise the Ready signal then I think I also have some instructions somewhere how to hack it so it will accpet the Ready signal, but I will have to search for that, and I don't know if it works with all JU257 drives ( there is a whole ass full of different JU257 ones )

@Akira:
You could try the hack ( when I find it

), or you can also try to swap wire #2 and #34 in the drive ribbon ! This will make the drive accpept at least the diskchange signal.

25 February 2003, 22:57

There are three jumpers
1/2/3/4
MD/MS
RY/DC

I guess 1/2/3/4 is the drive number and I need to set it to 1 for internal use as well as RY for amiga use. I'm trying now.

25 February 2003, 23:17

Strange sounds are coming from the drive. It might be dead. I'll try it with the PC

17 February 2003, 01:59	#1
oldpx Posts: n/a	Converted High Density Floppy I recently had a Samsung HD floppy drive converted to DD. It boots to workbench with no problems but cannot load Jim Power. What are the best non-dos games to test the limits of this drive? I'm looking for a title that should work with a converted HD drive and another one that should not.

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18 February 2003, 01:37	#2
Overdoc Commodore Collector Join Date: Aug 2001 Location: Austria Age: 53 Posts: 944	All games which are using the standard Amigados loading routines ( like Workbench does ) will work ok. All games that use loading routines which rely on the drives 'ready' signal will not work. Most times they will fail when the drive stops ( e.g. for playing the intro ), and then should continue loading, which it won't do because the routine will never get the ready signal from the converted drive I once fiddled about with some converted PC drives and found out that e.g. Robocop wouldn't continue to load after the game's intro when loading from a PC drive. So I used this game for testing. Btw. you can build some small electronic board which will come around this problem and let you use a PC drive like a normal Amiga one. You can find instructions for that on Aminet.

18 February 2003, 01:54	#3
oldpx Posts: n/a	I found this on Aminet. I guess this is the fix I need, right? And it is made by....Retroman???? Attached Thumbnails

19 February 2003, 00:36	#4
Overdoc Commodore Collector Join Date: Aug 2001 Location: Austria Age: 53 Posts: 944	No, unfortunately this is not the one I was thinking about. I think this fix is only for newer, Escom A-1200 models which also had PC drives in them, but had an additional small board attached to the drive so the drive works like an Amiga drive. What you need would be exactly this small circuit board ! Then you can use a PC drive 100% like an Amiga drive ( for Escom A-1200 drive you need the additional diode fix, but maybe for an A-500 you needn't ? ) I cannot remember exactly how the title of the correct hack was on Aminet, but I remember there were 2: One was just suggesting to swap some wires in the cable. This one doesn't work 100% with NDOS disks. The other one suggests to build a more or less complicated board with some TTL chips. This one I think should work. But I just remembered that I once asked someone who had an Escom A-1200 to make a drawing of the small floppy circuit for me If I can find it I will send it to you ! Never built it myself, but I thnik it should work. Another alternative would be to buy the Kylwaldia-Controller from an Amiga dealer. Doesn't cost much an you can always use PC drives then

19 February 2003, 02:10	#5
oldpx Posts: n/a	I were planning to replace missing floppies of 1xA600 and 3xA500s. I can't afford or build four different floppy interfaces. : ((

19 February 2003, 21:58	#6
Overdoc Commodore Collector Join Date: Aug 2001 Location: Austria Age: 53 Posts: 944	Well, the interface is always the same, no matter if it is a A-500 or 600 or 1200. But sure, buying 4 Kylwaldias wouldn't pay. But you can also have a look for special PC drives which will just work on the Amiga when you change the drive's jumper setting I only know the Chinon FZ-357 is such a drive. I see them from time to time at fleamarkets or used computer shops. Maybe you find some of these ? Then you don't need to buy or build any interface

19 February 2003, 22:23	#7
oldpx Posts: n/a	All the chinons I encountered were already in amigas Thanks again.

19 February 2003, 23:30	#8
Amiga1992 Registered User Join Date: May 2001 Location: ? Posts: 19,645	Also look for Panasonic JU257 drives.

21 February 2003, 01:03	#9
Overdoc Commodore Collector Join Date: Aug 2001 Location: Austria Age: 53 Posts: 944	Maybe also the TEAC 235-HF will work ? TEAC 235-F is an Amiga drive, so maybe the HF, too ? I once picked up one of these for 1 Euro on a fleamarket, but haven't checked whether it works, yet. Btw, Burseg, why are all your miggys missing their drives ?

21 February 2003, 01:26	#10
oldpx Posts: n/a	Two of the 500s did not have drives when I bought them. Two other amigas have drives that don't work. They might be repaired but the only person I knew that could do it said the drives were just too old and wouldn't work anyway.

21 February 2003, 01:29	#11
oldpx Posts: n/a	I created a thread in the marketplace section. If you're sure these drives will work I'm looking for them

22 February 2003, 02:22	#12
Overdoc Commodore Collector Join Date: Aug 2001 Location: Austria Age: 53 Posts: 944	Well, I know for sure that the FZ-357 works because I have 2 of them working in Amiga computers, and also some A-2000 models had them built in from factory For the Panasonic there exist quite a large number of different drives, all starting with the number JU-257. Some of them can be converted to work with Amigas just by soldering two pads on the board, but I think some cannot be converted easily ! As for the Teac 235HF I haven't tested it 100%, yet, since I don't have my Robocop disk any more, and also I haven't built a suited cable, yet. If I just hook the drive to the Amiga like it is then I can read Amiga disks, but I am not sure if it will read also NDOS disks ? Also, the diskchange will not work, which I think is because most PC drives have pins 2 & 34 swapped. But this can be done by modifying the cable. I have repaired quite a few Amiga drives, but I also have 2 where I have no idea why they don't work ??? Common problems I repaired was misaligned upper heads, misaligned track-0 sensor, misaligned stepper motor, damaged or bad contact in disk-insertion sensor, broken wire in motor coil. So if your drives have one of these problems then perhaps I could repair them, but I think you would pay more shipping them to me than it would be worth ! I think your best chance would be to look in used PC computer shops if you can find a FZ-357. You can easily identify them, because they have the eject button on the outer side of the drive and not a bit in the middle like other drives.

22 February 2003, 02:29	#13
oldpx Posts: n/a	I think I'll wait for a while and collect dead hardware, including A590 bios chips so that I can send you all at once Thanks for the offer, it isn't practically easy as you know I'll keep looking for the floppies. That different eject button is nice, it might fit into amigas better.

24 February 2003, 15:33	#14
Amiga1992 Registered User Join Date: May 2001 Location: ? Posts: 19,645	The JU257 I had was not modified, I only flipped some dipswitches and it worked, HOWEVER, it did not have teh ready signal thing fixed, so a lot of games wouldn't work (I remember having to use teh changedisk command in workbench to make the Amiga recognize a new disk! )

24 February 2003, 16:09	#15
oldpx Posts: n/a	Hmm that's too bad.

25 February 2003, 17:38	#16
oldpx Posts: n/a	I've found a Panasonic JU-253-033P now. It has some jumpers on the back. Can I convert it to amiga?

25 February 2003, 20:07	#17
Amiga1992 Registered User Join Date: May 2001 Location: ? Posts: 19,645	Play around with the jumpers. Flick some, turn on the amiga, check. Flick some others, turn on the Amiga, check. Until it works. Stick a bootable AmigaDOS disk in it so you check if it works. As for the ready-signal thing I have no clue about how to mod it, but it is possible, i think.

25 February 2003, 20:53	#18
Overdoc Commodore Collector Join Date: Aug 2001 Location: Austria Age: 53 Posts: 944	Well, I am not 100% sure and also a bit too lazy to open up about 15 A-500s , but I think I have seen the JU257-033P in an Amiga Usually, there should be either jumpers or small switches on the back of the drive. There is normally one for DS0/DS1, one for RY/DC ( or RD/DC - short for Ready/Diskchange ) and maybe another one or two others. The DS0/DS1 has to be put to DS0 for internal use, and the RD/DC has to be put in RD mode to work on the Amiga. If it doesn't recognise the Ready signal then I think I also have some instructions somewhere how to hack it so it will accpet the Ready signal, but I will have to search for that, and I don't know if it works with all JU257 drives ( there is a whole ass full of different JU257 ones ) @Akira: You could try the hack ( when I find it ), or you can also try to swap wire #2 and #34 in the drive ribbon ! This will make the drive accpept at least the diskchange signal.

25 February 2003, 22:57	#19
oldpx Posts: n/a	There are three jumpers 1/2/3/4 MD/MS RY/DC I guess 1/2/3/4 is the drive number and I need to set it to 1 for internal use as well as RY for amiga use. I'm trying now.

25 February 2003, 23:17	#20
oldpx Posts: n/a	Strange sounds are coming from the drive. It might be dead. I'll try it with the PC

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