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Old 21 April 2012, 02:22   #1
rsn8887
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Mouse pointer motion smoothness in WinUAE

I distinctly remember the mouse pointer motion on a real Amiga to be super smooth. With this I mean the mouse pointer moved around as fluently as the screen and sprite movement in e.g. Turrican or other smooth games. In fact, I remember laughing about Windows 95 back in the day because the mouse pointer was not moving smoothly.

Even in XP SP3 the mouse pointer is still not perfectly smooth in Windows - wtf? However, as far as I remember at least on Mac OSX it is as smooth as it was on the Amiga back in the day!

It turns out that on WinUAE, even with fastest possible and vsync enabled and latest beta (2.4.1 beta 7) , the mouse pointer motion seems to be "jerky." It is hard to explain, but feels very similar to the mouse pointer motion in Windows XP. Is this an artefact of the windows mouse driver? Or maybe it is only because I am running in 100 Hz (PAL) and not 50 Hz?

Does anybody else notice jerky (non-smooth) mouse pointer movement in WinUAE?
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Old 21 April 2012, 02:32   #2
clauddio
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yep winuae mouse pointer is really buggy on latests versions
also winuae is turning slow and slow in every new version
ask tony why...maybe he didn't realize very well because he is runing a coreI7
sincerely I do not care very much about new versions however I always try them but I always become frustrated because new versions always add new bugs or not working games and are becoming slow I still use winuae 1.6.0 which I consider it the best winuae version...the mouse pointer on this version is much better and smooth...try it

Last edited by clauddio; 21 April 2012 at 02:40.
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Old 21 April 2012, 03:17   #3
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clauddio, I don't agree! I cannot go back to 1.6.0 since just recently WinUAE got a _tremendous_ speed boost in vsync mode thanks to fastest possible vsync working properly now. I always refused to run non-vsynced because of tearing So for me, there's definitely no going back.

I just realized that mouse pointer already seems a bit smoother in 2.4.1b6 than in 2.4.1b7 but I might be seeing ghosts.
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Old 21 April 2012, 03:25   #4
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Just compared v1.6 vs the latest beta. The mouse pointer wasn't smoother in v1.6.

There is a point where you have to update/upgrade your old hardware. I remember how disappointed i was with some emulators (MAME, bsnes, WinUAE, SSF etc.) on my 2005 Computer with XP. Nearly all problems vanished after i bought a new PC in 2010+Windows 7. The recent WinUAE works pretty good here. There are great improvements since WinUAE 2.3, that's for sure.

Quote:
I just realized that mouse pointer already seems a bit smoother in 2.4.1b6 than in 2.4.1b7 but I might be seeing ghosts.
I can't "feel" any difference.

Last edited by Retro-Nerd; 21 April 2012 at 03:36.
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Old 21 April 2012, 03:35   #5
clauddio
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Quote:
Originally Posted by rsn8887 View Post
clauddio, I don't agree! I cannot go back to 1.6.0 since just recently WinUAE got a _tremendous_ speed boost in vsync mode thanks to fastest possible vsync working properly now. I always refused to run non-vsynced because of tearing So for me, there's definitely no going back.

I just realized that mouse pointer already seems a bit smoother in 2.4.1b6 than in 2.4.1b7 but I might be seeing ghosts.
but vsync works perfect on winuae 1.6.0
I run winuae on a 1280x960 screen 100 hz vsync on,in a samsung syncmaster 1100mb monitor
the scroll is perfect on games zero tearing better or equal /real amiga.... even I use screen filters
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Old 21 April 2012, 04:14   #6
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I find it's lots of factors though really and a reason pc and emulation is sometimes a pain when you change the hardware

If it's lcd of course then it's not completely smooth movement as we know it to be from an old crt, so can't faithfully recreate it anyway regardless. And that slight delay with input as well results further in feeling like control is sketchy with mouse. Winuae is still quite amazing though

Last edited by Adropac2; 21 April 2012 at 04:27.
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Old 21 April 2012, 07:42   #7
Toni Wilen
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You need mouse that reports movements fast enough and you need vsync. Thats it. Also mouse is much smoother in Windows if you have higher refresh rate than 60Hz.

Quote:
yep winuae mouse pointer is really buggy on latests versions
also winuae is turning slow and slow in every new version
No, it isn't. Buy a better PC or actually say something useful.
Do you want your money back too?

EDIT: This means some sane comparisons between versions and other useful information like logs. (But note that "legacy vsync" never have been working exactly right, it only worked on some PCs and most surprisingly it never worked like I wanted it to work on mine!)

VSync is very PC specific, two very similar PCs may work totally differently. It won't get fixed without proper bug reports, just waiting and possible complaining won't fix it!

Last edited by Toni Wilen; 21 April 2012 at 08:26.
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Old 21 April 2012, 10:12   #8
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Toni Wilen View Post
You need mouse that reports movements fast enough and you need vsync. Thats it. Also mouse is much smoother in Windows if you have higher refresh rate than 60Hz.



No, it isn't. Buy a better PC or actually say something useful.
Do you want your money back too?

EDIT: This means some sane comparisons between versions and other useful information like logs. (But note that "legacy vsync" never have been working exactly right, it only worked on some PCs and most surprisingly it never worked like I wanted it to work on mine!)

VSync is very PC specific, two very similar PCs may work totally differently. It won't get fixed without proper bug reports, just waiting and possible complaining won't fix it!
hey Tony don't get angry with me remember that version 1.6.0 was done by you
btw
I'm runing winuae on athlon x2 240 and vista sp2 and I will not purchase win 7 cause it don't make any sense and my vista copy is legal
so yes sorry I want a refund
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Old 21 April 2012, 10:19   #9
Toni Wilen
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I am not angry, I am just annoyed when someone says "it is not working" and thats all..

Not going to help anyone at all, totally opposite actually.

Ok, so it is dual core AMD: Most popular problem is (was) Windows timer counters jumping strangely in some situations: http://support.microsoft.com/kb/895980

WinUAE can work very strangely if this counter works badly.
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Old 21 April 2012, 10:38   #10
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Toni Wilen View Post
I am not angry, I am just annoyed when someone says "it is not working" and thats all..

Not going to help anyone at all, totally opposite actually.

Ok, so it is dual core AMD: Most popular problem is (was) Windows timer counters jumping strangely in some situations: http://support.microsoft.com/kb/895980

WinUAE can work very strangely if this counter works badly.
it can be that timer problem or maybe is because I have a geforce 6800gts which is directx 9
maybe a directx 10 card will cure that issues ?
what do you think?
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Old 21 April 2012, 12:07   #11
Toni Wilen
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Quote:
Originally Posted by clauddio View Post
it can be that timer problem or maybe is because I have a geforce 6800gts which is directx 9
maybe a directx 10 card will cure that issues ?
what do you think?
Nah, D3D mode uses D9D only (+Some D9DEx features if Vista or newer, not performance releated, mode switching etc..). DirectDraw mode shouldn't care at all.

Only possible difference is slower VRAM bandwidth compared to more modern display cards and (and mainboards too) but it shouldn't matter unless you use very large resolutions.

Timer/power saving bugs are one of the most common problems because WinUAE may use constant CPU 100% for 10ms or so and then it can suddenly stay totally idle next few milliseconds (waiting for next vsync sync position)
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Old 22 April 2012, 00:29   #12
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Toni Wilen View Post
You need mouse that reports movements fast enough and you need vsync. Thats it. Also mouse is much smoother in Windows if you have higher refresh rate than 60Hz.


Oh i see. This issue although hardly a biggie for me might be something i want to improve at some point so thanks for pointing out my ignorance
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Old 22 April 2012, 12:21   #13
Toni Wilen
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Low latency vsync + windowed mode also usually works (depends on PC as usual..) and makes mouse movement really smooth.

No need for fullscreen anymore.
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