Cloanto ROM detection

alexh · 04 February 2007, 10:54

This is not so much a bug as a feature request.

Cloanto encrypted ROMS do not identify in the System ROMS settings the same way as unencrypted ones do.

Unencrypted ones change from their file name to a description e.g. "C:/13.rom" becomes "KS ROM v1.3 (A500,A1000,A2000) rev 34.5 (256k)" whereas encrypted ones do not.

Any chance that can be changed? I guess you just need to decrypt before CRC checking or something?

I appologise if this has been asked and answered a 1000 times before.

Toni Wilen · 04 February 2007, 12:31

Quote:

Originally Posted by alexh

This is not so much a bug as a feature request.

Cloanto encrypted ROMS do not identify in the System ROMS settings the same way as unencrypted ones do.

Unencrypted ones change from their file name to a description e.g. "C:/13.rom" becomes "KS ROM v1.3 (A500,A1000,A2000) rev 34.5 (256k)" whereas encrypted ones do not.

Any chance that can be changed? I guess you just need to decrypt before CRC checking or something?

I appologise if this has been asked and answered a 1000 times before.

Works fine here. You sure you have correct key file? (CRC comparison is done after decrypting)

alexh · 04 February 2007, 14:28

Quote:

Originally Posted by Toni Wilen

Works fine here.

Hmmm. Doesn't here.

Quote:

You sure you have correct key file? (CRC comparison is done after decrypting)

I take it that if I didnt have the right key-file then the files wouldnt work? They definately work.

They are from (one of the first?) Amiga Forever discs from back in 1997/8.

Maybe they were just bad dumps back then? For example the KS1.3 rom is 512kbytes

Toni Wilen · 04 February 2007, 14:57

What are their CRC32? (in encrypted form)

alexh · 04 February 2007, 15:38

Kickstart 1.3 = 3ACD06F1
Kickstart 2.04 = 02C4CD2C
Kickstart 3.0 = 5F13BE3E

I double checked and moved ROM.KEY out of the DIR and they no longer work, confirming that they are encrypted ROMS.

alexh · 04 February 2007, 15:46

Oh I noticed looking at memory.c that you are missing the CRC for the A3000 version(s) of KS2.04 and KS3.1. I have both of these somewhere. If you are interested I could fire up my A3k and TransDump them?

I also have the SuperKickstart ROMS for the A3000 (1.3, 2.04 and 3.1). They have additional code to make them work from RAM with A3000 that have a physical KS1.4 in them. They were on my A3000 hard drive in Dev:kickstart when I got it.

Ultron · 04 February 2007, 15:48

Too bad Cloanto doesn't provide any support (ie.- work) to their products, i guess they get tired with just burning somebody else's free software and licensed IP on CD's to do any actual work in the products they sell.

I'm probably being unfair since all the Amiga emulation sites they closed must've been a lot of work out of their hands for the benefit of the community. God bless their key and chain kickstarts.

Toni Wilen · 04 February 2007, 16:17

Quote:

Originally Posted by alexh

Oh I noticed looking at memory.c that you are missing the CRC for the A3000 version(s) of KS2.04 and KS3.1. I have both of these somewhere. If you are interested I could fire up my A3k and TransDump them?

I also have the SuperKickstart ROMS for the A3000 (1.3, 2.04 and 3.1). They have additional code to make them work from RAM with A3000 that have a physical KS1.4 in them. They were on my A3000 hard drive in Dev:kickstart when I got it.

They are not included because A3000 ROMs require 68030 with MMU.

alexh · 04 February 2007, 16:52

Ah, understood.

Did you get anything from the CRC's I provided?

Shamino · 05 February 2007, 05:10

I suggest removing support for these crippled Cloanto ROMs altogether.

Supporting them just adds bloat to the emulator. It's odd that Cloanto don't trust their supposedly honest users with a normal ROM dump. It just adds annoyance for the users; if they really want to spread the ROM they can still do it, they would just distribute the keyfile along with the crippled ROM. So it's completely ineffective as an anti-piracy measure.

So where's the justification? And why does Mr Wilen bother to support this parasitic business at the cost of bloatware and user annoyance? Time spent implementing this keyfile nonsense means less time for actually improving the emulator.

If support for these was removed Cloanto would quickly replace their crippled ROMs with normal ones, the emulator would be less bloated, the community would be less angry with them, etc. A win-win for all.

alexh · 05 February 2007, 09:30

Troll alert

@Toni

If I get time later I'll dump the ROMS from within WinUAE and get the CRCs (in unencrypted form).

Toni Wilen · 05 February 2007, 10:19

Quote:

If I get time later I'll dump the ROMS from within WinUAE and get the CRCs (in unencrypted form).

I have 1.3 and 3.0 cloanto roms with same CRC and they still do work just fine. (2.04 had different crc)

Does ROM scanner detect them properly?

Shamino · 05 February 2007, 11:08

Making a constructive suggestion for improving the emulator and Amiga Forever package is considered trolling? Ridiculous.

Toni Wilen · 05 February 2007, 11:18

I guess it would be technically improvement but only in theory. It also would be complete support fiasco. (and the key file stuff isn't anything complex)

05 February 2007, 09:30	#11
alexh Thalion Webshrine Join Date: Jan 2004 Location: Oxford Posts: 14,337	Troll alert @Toni If I get time later I'll dump the ROMS from within WinUAE and get the CRCs (in unencrypted form). Last edited by alexh; 05 February 2007 at 09:38.

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04 February 2007, 10:54	#1
alexh Thalion Webshrine Join Date: Jan 2004 Location: Oxford Posts: 14,337	This is not so much a bug as a feature request. Cloanto encrypted ROMS do not identify in the System ROMS settings the same way as unencrypted ones do. Unencrypted ones change from their file name to a description e.g. "C:/13.rom" becomes "KS ROM v1.3 (A500,A1000,A2000) rev 34.5 (256k)" whereas encrypted ones do not. Any chance that can be changed? I guess you just need to decrypt before CRC checking or something? I appologise if this has been asked and answered a 1000 times before.

04 February 2007, 14:57	#4
Toni Wilen WinUAE developer Join Date: Aug 2001 Location: Hämeenlinna/Finland Age: 49 Posts: 26,505	What are their CRC32? (in encrypted form)

04 February 2007, 15:38	#5
alexh Thalion Webshrine Join Date: Jan 2004 Location: Oxford Posts: 14,337	Kickstart 1.3 = 3ACD06F1 Kickstart 2.04 = 02C4CD2C Kickstart 3.0 = 5F13BE3E I double checked and moved ROM.KEY out of the DIR and they no longer work, confirming that they are encrypted ROMS.

04 February 2007, 15:46	#6
alexh Thalion Webshrine Join Date: Jan 2004 Location: Oxford Posts: 14,337	Oh I noticed looking at memory.c that you are missing the CRC for the A3000 version(s) of KS2.04 and KS3.1. I have both of these somewhere. If you are interested I could fire up my A3k and TransDump them? I also have the SuperKickstart ROMS for the A3000 (1.3, 2.04 and 3.1). They have additional code to make them work from RAM with A3000 that have a physical KS1.4 in them. They were on my A3000 hard drive in Dev:kickstart when I got it.

04 February 2007, 15:48	#7
Ultron Something Join Date: Feb 2006 Location: Amigaland, Nostalgia Age: 48 Posts: 757	Too bad Cloanto doesn't provide any support (ie.- work) to their products, i guess they get tired with just burning somebody else's free software and licensed IP on CD's to do any actual work in the products they sell. I'm probably being unfair since all the Amiga emulation sites they closed must've been a lot of work out of their hands for the benefit of the community. God bless their key and chain kickstarts.

04 February 2007, 16:52	#9
alexh Thalion Webshrine Join Date: Jan 2004 Location: Oxford Posts: 14,337	Ah, understood. Did you get anything from the CRC's I provided?

05 February 2007, 05:10	#10
Shamino Registered User Join Date: Jan 2007 Location: Parramatta NSW Posts: 36	I suggest removing support for these crippled Cloanto ROMs altogether. Supporting them just adds bloat to the emulator. It's odd that Cloanto don't trust their supposedly honest users with a normal ROM dump. It just adds annoyance for the users; if they really want to spread the ROM they can still do it, they would just distribute the keyfile along with the crippled ROM. So it's completely ineffective as an anti-piracy measure. So where's the justification? And why does Mr Wilen bother to support this parasitic business at the cost of bloatware and user annoyance? Time spent implementing this keyfile nonsense means less time for actually improving the emulator. If support for these was removed Cloanto would quickly replace their crippled ROMs with normal ones, the emulator would be less bloated, the community would be less angry with them, etc. A win-win for all.

05 February 2007, 11:08	#13
Shamino Registered User Join Date: Jan 2007 Location: Parramatta NSW Posts: 36	Making a constructive suggestion for improving the emulator and Amiga Forever package is considered trolling? Ridiculous.

05 February 2007, 11:18	#14
Toni Wilen WinUAE developer Join Date: Aug 2001 Location: Hämeenlinna/Finland Age: 49 Posts: 26,505	I guess it would be technically improvement but only in theory. It also would be complete support fiasco. (and the key file stuff isn't anything complex)

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