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Old 19 March 2018, 17:55   #1
djukon
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Floppy disk IPF Imaging: 81 or 83 track Floppy Drive

I have a Commodore branded A1200 with its original floppy drive (looks like it). How can I be sure if it works with 81 or 83 tracks?

I need to image Lotus 1 to test out through emulation why it doesn't work on my real A1200 (though it does work on my real A500+). I imaged it to only 81 tracks on the cautious side and got a "Protection Failed" error when running the game on emulation. Could I have to image it to 83 tracks?

The KryoFlux Free ADF I wrote to floppy and booted from, tested out my drive and reported 83 tracks in ctout.txt . Can I trust that? I am wary since it did warn me that using 83 tracks could damage my drive if it didn't support that feature.

Thanks.
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Old 19 March 2018, 18:19   #2
Akira
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Lotus 1 is not compatible with the A1200, there's nothing you need to test on WinUAE (it will do the same on an A1200 config).
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Old 19 March 2018, 18:40   #3
djukon
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Akira View Post
Lotus 1 is not compatible with the A1200, there's nothing you need to test on WinUAE (it will do the same on an A1200 config).
Thanks, Akira, that solves the Lotus 1 issue on an A1200.

Anyway, I'd still like to know how to be certain a drive is 81 or 83 track.

Regarding Lotus 1, I went and ran the "Lotus Esprit Turbo Challenge (1991)(Gremlin)(FR)(en)[compilation Collectors, Les][2848]" SPS instance (which is compatible with the A500+: most likely my instance as well) and with it the floppy drive on WinUAE goes up to track 79 when doing the copy protection verification on boot. So it doesn't appear to need anything above that (at least to get beyond the copy protection scheme).

The game on the real floppy loads up properly on both the A500+ and the A1200 (crashing seconds after starting a graphically garbled race on the A1200). So besides the floppy being still good, both my real df0: drives are reading what is necessary to go past the copy protection scheme.

I'd like to understand why I can't image the game properly. Is it my drive that doesn't read the magnetic information correctly when running KryoFlux, something I'm doing wrong on KryoFlux Free (I ran with interrupt polling and the Blizzard 030 was slotted in), or do I have to image the floppy up to track 83?
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Old 19 March 2018, 18:42   #4
dlfrsilver
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it doesn't work because the game is only OCS ECS compatible, not AGA (or you need to cut out the CACHE and use ORIGINAL setting).
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Old 19 March 2018, 20:19   #5
djukon
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Originally Posted by dlfrsilver View Post
it doesn't work because the game is only OCS ECS compatible, not AGA (or you need to cut out the CACHE and use ORIGINAL setting).
Thanks, dlfrsilver.

For the record here are some quick tests I was able to perform.

Working: SPS "Lotus Esprit Turbo Challenge (1991)(Gremlin)(FR)(en)[compilation Collectors, Les][2848]" on an emulated stock A1200 with OCS selected and CPU Caches disabled.

Not Working: SPS "Lotus Esprit Turbo Challenge (1990)(Gremlin)[0774]" on an emulated stock A1200 with OCS selected and CPU Caches disabled (loads slowly and stalls before a race); My 1992 purchased floppy (most likely SPS-2848) on my real Bliz030@50 A1200 with OCS selected and CPU caches disabled (gradually builds up horizontal line distortions during the race and eventually results in a software failure; some sound distortions as well).

Regarding the 81 vs 83 track floppy drive thread topic, how can we confirm a drive really has the capability of reading 83 tracks?
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Old 20 March 2018, 12:53   #6
dlfrsilver
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Quote:
Originally Posted by djukon View Post
Thanks, dlfrsilver.

For the record here are some quick tests I was able to perform.

Working: SPS "Lotus Esprit Turbo Challenge (1991)(Gremlin)(FR)(en)[compilation Collectors, Les][2848]" onw an emulated stock A1200 with OCS selected and CPU Caches disabled.

Not Working: SPS "Lotus Esprit Turbo Challenge (1990)(Gremlin)[0774]" on an emulated stock A1200 with OCS selected and CPU Caches disabled (loads slowly and stalls before a race); My 1992 purchased floppy (most likely SPS-2848) on my real Bliz030@50 A1200 with OCS selected and CPU caches disabled (gradually builds up horizontal line distortions during the race and eventually results in a software failure; some sound distortions as well).

Regarding the 81 vs 83 track floppy drive thread topic, how can we confirm a drive really has the capability of reading 83 tracks?
about the drive ability, good question. it depends on the drive model and brand.
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Old 20 March 2018, 13:24   #7
meynaf
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Quote:
Originally Posted by djukon View Post
Regarding the 81 vs 83 track floppy drive thread topic, how can we confirm a drive really has the capability of reading 83 tracks?
The SPS dumping tool is supposed to perform a test showing whether 83 tracks are supported or not.
If it says yes, then try dumping some disk up to 83. By the noise seeking makes at the end, you should be able to know for sure (normal noise = supported, abnormal noise = don't do that again).
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Old 20 March 2018, 22:32   #8
djukon
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Quote:
Originally Posted by dlfrsilver View Post
about the drive ability, good question. it depends on the drive model and brand.
Is there a way to read that information through software without having to open up the A1200 case?

Quote:
Originally Posted by meynaf View Post
The SPS dumping tool is supposed to perform a test showing whether 83 tracks are supported or not.
Check . It says 83 tracks are supported.

Quote:
Originally Posted by meynaf View Post
abnormal noise = don't do that again
To minimize damage to the drive in the case it does sound abnormal by going from 81 to 83, should I immediately eject the disk or reset/turn off the Amiga? (which is the best option?)

Thanks, dlfrsilver and meynaf!

Last edited by djukon; 20 March 2018 at 22:36. Reason: model and brand question
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Old 21 March 2018, 07:49   #9
meynaf
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Originally Posted by djukon View Post
To minimize damage to the drive in the case it does sound abnormal by going from 81 to 83, should I immediately eject the disk or reset/turn off the Amiga? (which is the best option?)
If something goes wrong, reset !
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Old 21 March 2018, 22:50   #10
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If something goes wrong, reset !
Will do, thanks, meynaf .

I'll put this topic on hold until I have more information on the drive, by searching for online information on the model it is. I don't want to go through opening up the A1200 just for this. I'll wait until I have a batch of hardware related issues that justify opening it up for a single maintenance session.
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Old 21 March 2018, 22:59   #11
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Since you have an A1200, why not just use the WHDLoad version and be done with it?

...even if you somehow get a 100% duplicate of the original disks, it won't work on your A1200.
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Old 24 March 2018, 16:26   #12
djukon
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Since you have an A1200, why not just use the WHDLoad version and be done with it?
Playing Lotus 1 is not what drove me to find out more information about the thread topic. Playing the game on an emulator would be fine if need be.

My objectives are:
  1. Making sure the Lotus 1 copy I have has been properly preserved (and is not some other version);
  2. Acquiring tacit experience on the SPS imaging process.
According to the first bytes of making an ADF version, it matches one of sequences an SPS member sent me to compare, so it should be the "Lotus Esprit Turbo Challenge (1991)(Gremlin)(FR)(en)[compilation Collectors, Les][2848]" version. This means that objective number 1 is complete. Now I just want to be able to be successful at finishing an imaging process to make sure it works in case I need to use it for some other title.

Quote:
Originally Posted by DamienD View Post
...even if you somehow get a 100% duplicate of the original disks, it won't work on your A1200.
If I get a "Lotus Esprit Turbo Challenge (1991)(Gremlin)(FR)(en)[compilation Collectors, Les][2848]" cracked version onto a floppy or use my original disk, it should work as long as I remove the Bliz030. But yet again, it is not the point.
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