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Old 17 January 2020, 14:25   #141
roondar
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@roondar

Wouldn't you say that the A1200 outperforms MD at large objects as well? Based on 64 pixels wide/unlimited height hw sprites of AGA?
It depends on what you want to achieve. If all you want is the single largest object you can create using AGA vs the MD, you'll find that both systems can generally cover slightly more than an entire screen with Bob and/or Sprite pixels.

However, in games you tend to have a whole bunch of objects and not just one very big one. Basically, if you want to draw as many 32x32 objects on screen as you can, the MD will definitely win. So I guess it'd be more accurate to say the MD wins at "big numbers of reasonably sized objects". This just so happens to be what most action games need most of the time, which is why I say the MD wins in that category.

Now, if your game relies heavily on many separate small objects (16x16 or smaller), this changes and the A1200 starts to take the lead.
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Old 17 January 2020, 14:39   #142
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I was mostly thinking about big bosses tbh. You can use just a couple of hw sprites to fill about 40% of screen or so.
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Old 17 January 2020, 14:54   #143
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I was mostly thinking about big bosses tbh. You can use just a couple of hw sprites to fill about 40% of screen or so.
It's actually a bit more. You can cover up to 256 pixels horizontally with 15 colour sprites using AGA, which is 80% of a normal screen

Anyway, the MD can do this as well - just cut the big baddie up in blocks of 32x32 pixels, which is why I didn't see an advantage.
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Old 17 January 2020, 16:02   #144
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Sure, but then, after using about 60-70 sprites to do that, how many sprites would've been left for enemy bullets etc after that? Not many I guess. Anyway, that's obviously a very specific scenario, so....
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Old 17 January 2020, 16:46   #145
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If anyone has a good idea of how many objects/Bob's(round balls 16*16 are classic) can be displayed on screen on an A1200 it should be McGeezer.

And there's always more interest in Games that work on non expanded spec, it's more interesting anyone can make a game run on endless Ram and CPU.
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Old 17 January 2020, 16:54   #146
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If anyone has a good idea of how many objects/Bob's(round balls 16*16 are classic) can be displayed on screen on an A1200 it should be McGeezer.
It would depend on the screenmode you use for Bobs. Don't have any A1200 numbers, but I did a test once for the A500 and got around 50 Bobs @16x16 for a 16 colour screen. This used no special tricks and no sprites.

Perhaps an A1200 test might be nice to do as well.
Quote:
And there's always more interest in Games that work on non expanded spec, it's more interesting anyone can make a game run on endless Ram and CPU.
This is 100% true. I have a lot of respect for those who do their magic even on the base Amiga models
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Old 17 January 2020, 16:57   #147
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Well LowRes I don't know maybe 64colours or Dual Playfield.

Yeah maybe but that's just hear say and not with any game logic or scrolling.
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Old 17 January 2020, 17:03   #148
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Well LowRes I don't know maybe 64colours or Dual Playfield.

Yeah maybe but that's just hear say and not with any game logic or scrolling.
Scrolling doesn't change much as the overhead for that is not that big, but you are right, game logic will indeed lower these numbers.

It was just meant as a ballpark number by the way, nothing more. Take it as you will.
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Old 17 January 2020, 21:50   #149
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Back in early 2000-ies I was able to connect my non-expanded Amiga 1200 (without Hard Drive) to Internet with a 56K Modem and download games from Aminet. The only downside was that I had to switch disks, so later I added IdeFIX and installed everything on CD (Still no HD), then I had an usable Internet machine from that unexpanded A1200 - which was used in such config for several months.

A Sega console that was able to Browse the Internet was the Dreamcast, only two console generations later.
What TCP/IP stack did you use back then? AmiTCP or AmigaTCP?? What was max bps you could get with the 56K? I read 68000 was 19,200bps and 68020 was 28,800bps with no losses?!?

McGeezer, After doing Rygar, How many games do you think you could of coded or ported for the Amiga back in 92 -> Dec 94 using the tools available back in the day working full time?!?
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Old 17 January 2020, 21:54   #150
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It would depend on the screenmode you use for Bobs. Don't have any A1200 numbers, but I did a test once for the A500 and got around 50 Bobs @16x16 for a 16 colour screen. This used no special tricks and no sprites.
Is this double buffered or single screen update? I'm guessing this is with out a music routine as well?
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Old 17 January 2020, 22:23   #151
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McGeezer, After doing Rygar, How many games do you think you could of coded or ported for the Amiga back in 92 -> Dec 94 using the tools available back in the day working full time?!?
I'm not sure as it depends on the game. Some could have been done quickly... others slowly... others not at all because when I was 17 I wasn't mentally tough enough to code games.
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Old 18 January 2020, 00:32   #152
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Is this double buffered or single screen update? I'm guessing this is with out a music routine as well?
No sprites, no music, using three buffers (double buffer+pristine buffer for quick restoring). No special Bob trickery. Merely to get an indication of what normal bobs can do on the A500.
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Old 18 January 2020, 06:51   #153
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What TCP/IP stack did you use back then? AmiTCP or AmigaTCP?? What was max bps you could get with the 56K? I read 68000 was 19,200bps and 68020 was 28,800bps with no losses?!?
I used MiAMI. I was getting around 3-4 KB/second, which was for the times okay for browsing (text only, images turned off in AWeb), e-mail and games from Aminet.
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Old 21 January 2020, 10:13   #154
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A1200 without any doubt!
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