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Old 23 October 2018, 08:19   #61
kolla
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Originally Posted by desiv View Post
If you want totally free and open, there is AROS. Win Win. ;-)
What is the official stance if Hyperion regarding AROS again?

Was it "most likely illegal"? Once Hyperion have a few more nickles to throw around, I would be totally unsurprised to see them waste it on taking down AROS and MorphOS as well. It's really the only "skill" Hyperion has inhouse, "battling" in court.
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Old 23 October 2018, 08:43   #62
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I have never bought anything that Hyperion offers, so it seems I get by doing my Amiga hobby without them..

So what's the problem here?
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Old 23 October 2018, 18:14   #63
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What is the official stance if Hyperion regarding AROS again?
As AROS is still moving along, I'm not sure it matters. ;-)

It's one thing to stop people selling something.
It's another to try to stop an open source OS from existing. If they thought they could stop it, they would have. Now, that doesn't mean they might not try from time to time. Companies do that. (There are some that will tell you that legally they are required to show effort in order not to risk losing the rights they supposedly have.)
But I think they know they can't stop AROS. Best they could do is probably take down a website or two. That's never stopped availability on the internet. ;-) Kind of like how it is now impossible to find a Super Mario ROM since Nintendo flared. (hint: it isn't)
MorphOS, being another commercial product is a different ball of wax. If they want to keep selling their product, dealing with companies like those is part of what they have to do...
I'm not saying they are good companies. They are businesses and do bad things. And this is an awkward business situation to start with. That said, there are also some positives, and the negatives can't stop me enjoying my Amiga.
AmigaOS 3.1.4 is out there. Enough of us have it now, that even if someone was somehow stopped from selling it (which I don't think will happen long term), it will still be available for people. (In fact, if it is "blocked," I would think that might increase its spread actually. ;-)
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Old 23 October 2018, 18:16   #64
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Originally Posted by Steril707 View Post
I have never bought anything that Hyperion offers, so it seems I get by doing my Amiga hobby without them..

So what's the problem here?
The problem is there are too few users following your example. So, Hyperion continues to do what they have always done.
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Old 23 October 2018, 18:23   #65
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The problem is there are too few users following your example. So, Hyperion continues to do what they have always done.
No, the problem is that there is no actual problem. ;-)
Bad Company <Insert Cloanto, Hyperion, Amino, etc here> can do what they want.
We will STILL be able to enjoy our Amigas.
We're fans of the best computer and get to enjoy that regardless of businesses doing businessy stuff.
It's a win-win for us.
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Old 23 October 2018, 19:05   #66
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How did 'best computer' attract shameless companies as any of those, that is real question here.
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Old 23 October 2018, 19:42   #67
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How did 'best computer' attract shameless companies as any of those, that is real question here.
Easy.
Extremely gullible fan base that would eat up anything with "Amiga" name on it.
Perfect target to this day.
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Old 23 October 2018, 19:50   #68
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How did 'best computer' attract shameless companies as any of those, that is real question here.
Rule #9 - Opportunity plus instinct equals profit (and related rules):

http://memory-beta.wikia.com/wiki/Fe...of_Acquisition
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Old 23 October 2018, 21:02   #69
nexus
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Originally Posted by Puggsy View Post
Easy.
Extremely gullible fan base that would eat up anything with "Amiga" name on it.
Perfect target to this day.
yep same shit goes on in console world too any little toy etc that has sega or nintendo etc branding and people buy it up
so bad my local target sells squishies of ther IP's right yet they are in a closed bag and you cant even see what it is and they charge you $5 and people still buy them up
its a compulsive sickness thats getting worse and worse today
and allows shitty companies like ATGAMES to produce the shit they do even lie like the current BLAST junk they are selling that doesnt even have the correct ROMS
box shows arcade ROMs yet the device is emulating NES with the NES versions of the games
big class action waiting to happen
surprised target etc store havent rip them out of stores after this backlash
even SEGA fired that company recently over there new system

Last edited by nexus; 23 October 2018 at 21:08.
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Old 24 October 2018, 12:28   #70
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But I think they know they can't stop AROS. Best they could do is probably take down a website or two.
No, that is nothing. The "best" they do is to threaten with legal action whenever OS developers wish to jump ship from Amiga OS to AROS or MorphOS.
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Old 24 October 2018, 12:53   #71
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RiscOS has managed to go open source and is better for it. Hyperion/Cloanto/Whoever should really take a brave step and open source it, and make money from providing physical ROMs, disks, support.
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Old 24 October 2018, 17:20   #72
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Devs that have seen AmigaOS source code aren't allowed to work on reverse-engineered works like AROS and MorphOS legally.
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Old 24 October 2018, 17:44   #73
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No, that is nothing. The "best" they do is to threaten with legal action whenever OS developers wish to jump ship from Amiga OS to AROS or MorphOS.
So the best they can do is threaten?
Fine... No issues then.. ;-)
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Old 26 October 2018, 09:37   #74
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RiscOS has managed to go open source and is better for it. Hyperion/Cloanto/Whoever should really take a brave step and open source it, and make money from providing physical ROMs, disks, support.

I cannot give this too many thumbs up!! But I will try...

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Old 26 October 2018, 11:35   #75
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Devs that have seen AmigaOS source code aren't allowed to work on reverse-engineered works like AROS and MorphOS legally.
As far as I know yes

When the old sources leaked some time ago they threatened everyone who would look at. Best is to stay far away from it...

Those who officially could work with the sources had to sign a NDA anyway which forbits them to work on anything competing, and that are certainly AROS and MorphOS. And if someone would ignore that and f.e. contribute to AROS they could try to use it against AROS then. So best is to both stay away from the sources and Hyperion as long as you want to keep your freedom. That is how I understood what Thomas Richter f.e. wrote.
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Old 26 October 2018, 12:28   #76
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Like all clauses, an NDA is subject to rules.
Generally speaking, an NDA that would prevent a worker from finding another job would be considered null and void!
Nobody should be afraid just because an NDA has been signed. The courts are full of voided NDA because they were abusive!
Inquiring is the only word here...
The most important is to have cash in in the bank account, to feed the family and to pay the bills...
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Old 26 October 2018, 12:35   #77
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Like all clauses, an NDA is subject to rules.
Generally speaking, an NDA that would prevent a worker from finding another job would be considered null and void!
Nobody should be afraid just because an NDA has been signed. The courts are full of voided NDA because they were abusive!
Inquiring is the only word here...
The most important is to have cash in in the bank account, to feed the family and to pay the bills...
Yes perhaps

There are also speculations that even the contracts Hyperion is based on would fail at court but to see if that is the case or not someone has to challenge these contracts. The same is true for developers and the NDAs, perhaps Hyperion would loose but in any case it means trouble but Amiga is just hobby and no money to earn, I assume if developers loose interest they drop the platform as a whole instead of risking court cases.
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Old 26 October 2018, 14:46   #78
kolla
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I assume if developers loose interest they drop the platform as a whole instead of risking court cases.
Exactly, the risk of legal mumbojumbo is enough for most to loose interest.

In my view, it is therefore very important that the community itself steps up and holds the self-acclaimed rights holders feet to the fire when it comes to legal issues - especially Hyperion, who threaten people at every cross road, yet again and again have been proven to speak mostly BS. Sadly, there are way too many apologists among us, who rather see that nobody stirs the boat as it sinks.
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Old 26 October 2018, 14:49   #79
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So the best they can do is threaten?
Fine... No issues then.. ;-)
Maybe no issue for you, but enough for others to just leave.
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Old 26 October 2018, 15:19   #80
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There are also speculations that even the contracts Hyperion is based on would fail at court ...
Couldn't hold my tears back if a court would cut the HyperOnion off from its roots ...
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