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Old 02 March 2019, 18:45   #141
Dr.Venom
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Yeah, i see what you mean. The "new" version was a tad brighter, but the tradeoff is probably a bit worse.

Current version has reverted to old behavior. Now slotmask isn't 0.0/1.0 anymore, but strength can be selected. Think it's better this way. I also put the "4k" version on ice, since i can't test it properly and it slowed the shader, even unused.
Having the ability to select the strenght makes it perfect, thx

I understand to put the 4k version on ice. Lets see when we have some real 4K monitors to test it on..

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About smart smoothing, current implementation is more a hack, but quite fast. I tested the full version of it, and it slowed the shader down. As i'm considering even intel igpu users, this might get a bummer (still need an intel tester with 1080p ).

You might want to test it with games with more colors, as it blends near standing ones and games with few colors also use greater color differences, so no change here.
I see what you mean. I've been running some tests with the psx driver and it makes a subtle but noticable difference. Very nice, it adds another touch of realism that once you have used it for a bit, there's no going back

Would it be an idea to include the full version as a selectable option, e.g. to have the three options for the "Smart Horizontal Smoothing": 0=off, 1=fast, 2=full. Or would inclusion of it with the if defs etc slow it down too much already?

Lastly I wondered whether it would be worthwhile to add the possibility to have 3 blank lines of spacing vertically between the slots (selectable, as I like the current compressed one!), instead of the current 1 line spacing?

Please see below picture: it could be that having the spacing between slots vertically at 3 blank lines brings the slot count closer to the real slotmask (which equals 5 to 6 slots per vertical "column" per 3 scanlines).

Maybe it won't look good at all, but maybe it will. Seems like a worthwhile test (I have a hunch you may have tested it already )




Edit: note that i disabled scanlines in the shader example above, such that the slot count is easier. At full 1080p resolution with scanlines the example really is 3 scanlines.

Last edited by Dr.Venom; 02 March 2019 at 19:00.
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Old 02 March 2019, 23:21   #142
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Quote:
Would it be an idea to include the full version as a selectable option, e.g. to have the three options for the "Smart Horizontal Smoothing": 0=off, 1=fast, 2=full. Or would inclusion of it with the if defs etc slow it down too much already?
Even unused code can slow the shader down, but thinking about it a bit more, quality is prio. So i'll just ad the normal, slower smoothing, makes a difference with higher resolutions too. But the shader is faster if this is off, so it looks like a OK deal.

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Lastly I wondered whether it would be worthwhile to add the possibility to have 3 blank lines of spacing vertically between the slots (selectable, as I like the current compressed one!), instead of the current 1 line spacing?
Yeah, why not. I've added a parameter to select betweeen slotmask configurations. Must also say that it would probably require a higher resolution and soft scanlines, since a hybrid approach like 3x1 produces inconsistencies (have tired it). It can stay in the shader, doesn't affect speed (and wait untill we got better displays).
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Old 03 March 2019, 16:20   #143
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Originally Posted by guest.r View Post
Even unused code can slow the shader down, but thinking about it a bit more, quality is prio. So i'll just ad the normal, slower smoothing, makes a difference with higher resolutions too. But the shader is faster if this is off, so it looks like a OK deal.
Awesome, really beautiful for high color systems like PSX etc. Gobsmacked with the combination of Alternate Scanlines 2 + Mask 5 + SlotMask + Smart Horizontal Smoothing! What's quite nice is that you can even put your nose up to the screen and it's still has that CRT vibe like when you do with a real CRT .

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Yeah, why not. I've added a parameter to select betweeen slotmask configurations. Must also say that it would probably require a higher resolution and soft scanlines, since a hybrid approach like 3x1 produces inconsistencies (have tired it). It can stay in the shader, doesn't affect speed (and wait untill we got better displays).
Interesting, even though theoretically a bit more correct it doesn't look as good. I'll stick with the compressed one for now (which works beautifully). Will probably indeed need a bit higher resolution to look good..

With regards to the Smart Horizontal Smoothing for lower color systems, like MSX2 (which has low amount of on screen colors from a palette of 512), I'm seeing some instances where it creates a bit too much softening on objects, which makes them slightly fuzzy. So mostly the setting has no effect, but then on some single objects you see the softening appear quite strongly. It's a bit too strong worded, but it slightly interrupts the consistency of sharpness in the image (compared to real CRT where the sharpness / silkiness across the image is very consistent). So currently I'm keeping it disabled for the MSX system for example.

Just wondered whether a "grade" setting instead of the current on-off could possibly make it more finetunable for systems like MSX2? I just want to stress it's really great as it is, and I'm loving it with PSX and such, so please don't change anything unless a grade setting could be a natural evolvement / thing to do!

Lastly, I'm making use of the "Smart Y Integer scaling" for some systems, and I noticed that because it only extends in the Y direction, for these systems the aspect ratio changes slightly. Could you possibly include an additional setting that also scales X such that aspect ratio remains intact? As a possible suggestion it could be renamed to "Smart Integer Scaling" and have three options: 0=off, 1 = Y, 2=Y+X (keep aspect)?

Sorry to keep pestering you with this stuff, but this surely will be the last thing 0:-)

With that out of the way, it really feels that it's about as complete as it can get now? Given 1080p / SDR limitations, it has become so good it's scary
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Old 04 March 2019, 21:50   #144
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Quote:
With regards to the Smart Horizontal Smoothing for lower color systems, like MSX2 (which has low amount of on screen colors from a palette of 512), I'm seeing some instances where it creates a bit too much softening on objects, which makes them slightly fuzzy. So mostly the setting has no effect, but then on some single objects you see the softening appear quite strongly. It's a bit too strong worded, but it slightly interrupts the consistency of sharpness in the image (compared to real CRT where the sharpness / silkiness across the image is very consistent). So currently I'm keeping it disabled for the MSX system for example.
Been thinking about it a bit and i added two parameters to control the smoothing effect. First is the smart smoothing threshold parameter which decides if the effect applies, second (current one) has been transformed too, from 0.0 to 1.0 with arbitrary values - it decides the strength of the smoothing.
I think it can serve many situations now.
Besides, i made this one much more faster too by applying a multipass trick, so i'm not cranked with speed loss anymore.

Quote:
Lastly, I'm making use of the "Smart Y Integer scaling" for some systems, and I noticed that because it only extends in the Y direction, for these systems the aspect ratio changes slightly. Could you possibly include an additional setting that also scales X such that aspect ratio remains intact? As a possible suggestion it could be renamed to "Smart Integer Scaling" and have three options: 0=off, 1 = Y, 2=Y+X (keep aspect)?
Works this way now. Mode 2 keeps aspect ratio.

Quote:
Sorry to keep pestering you with this stuff, but this surely will be the last thing 0:-)
Np. I think it needs some testing, before we can call it a final version, but worked pretty fine here.
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File Type: zip guest.zip (13.3 KB, 25 views)
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Old 05 March 2019, 03:17   #145
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The horizontal smoothing stuff works great. Makes it easier to mimic a S-Video connection via C64. Looks really good now.
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Old 05 March 2019, 03:42   #146
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I use the CRT-easymode shader for most of the 8-bit/16-bit emulator cores in Retroarch and for the most part most systems look great. The C64 VICE x64 core however is sometimes "off" with this shader. THe way some pixel artists did color pixelart back then in the early to mid-80s was strange. They'd sprinkle little dots of color into their sprites that was suppose to give it a nice shading effect on "blurry"" CRTs of the era but on LCDs, even with shaders, some of these early games look like shit because of it. Even something fairly recent like Metal Warrior has colored pixels on your character's pants and hair that makes him look like he got bukkaked by a rainbow. I'm confident that someday I'll find the perfect shader for VICE x64.
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Old 05 March 2019, 09:50   #147
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You have to tweak almost every shader (except crt-aperture and a few more) to get a decent result because usually the default mask is wrong, in my opinion should be 2 colors mask up to 1080p(4x) and 3 color mask at higher definition, 1440p+(6x). Also there is too much blur, either that or it's too sharp/LCD like. For the old 8bit stuff I find crt-geom-curved doing a decent job but too blurry and default gamma is wrong-scanlines are weak, mostly has that s-video look. Good for C64/Spectrum stuff.

Crt-aperture is good mostly for later stuff like snes-md. Easymode-halation is a good overall shader, Crt-trinitron (I think not in retroarch but crt-guest can do about the same) is a good shader for that arcade look.
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Old 05 March 2019, 14:35   #148
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I use CRT-Geom for the SVN build of DOSBox and it looks fantastic... most of the time. It seems to simulate standard VGA CRT monitors very very well but looks wrong with many SVGA games. I dislike the extreme curvature effects so I turn them down a bit.
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Old 05 March 2019, 19:23   #149
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Took the time to tweak CRT-Guest.r-Dr.Venom in Retroarch having my Trinitron as a reference, gone a bit far from default settings lol

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Old 06 March 2019, 10:34   #150
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Hello

I am following this thread with no much assiduity and I have a question:
You posted several shaders but are they only evolutions and so the last is the better ? or are they several "forks" (differents effects) so what are the ones to use/try ? shaders list ? shaders descriptions ?

BTW I tried to recompile one of yours shaders for Warp3DNova OS4 (as it use GLSL too) and with little modifications glslangvalidator can compile it to spir :-)
Anyway I didnt tested it (for the moment) as it need to write a nova test program with your "uniforms" variables and I dont have the time to do that now...
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Old 06 March 2019, 15:26   #151
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Quote:
Originally Posted by nobody View Post
Took the time to tweak CRT-Guest.r-Dr.Venom in Retroarch having my Trinitron as a reference, gone a bit far from default settings lol

Nice work! That's a bit of the idea of the shader to have many custom options and tweaks. The speed might be a problem for poor adapters, so i'm working on a fast version too.

@thellier
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You posted several shaders but are they only evolutions and so the last is the better ? or are they several "forks" (differents effects) so what are the ones to use/try ? shaders list ? shaders descriptions ?
It's a bit catchy to use this specific shader outside Retroarch. The shader effect consists of several passes managed by the preset. If you want to use it you must put the preset file into the "shaders_glsl\crt" folder and the "guest" folder goes to "shaders_glsl\crt\shaders". Seperate passes won't work by themselves.
The only other environment this shader could be ported to is BSNES/Higan. Like i said, it must be converted, copy/paste is incompatible.

Quote:
BTW I tried to recompile one of yours shaders for Warp3DNova OS4 (as it use GLSL too) and with little modifications glslangvalidator can compile it to spir :-)
Anyway I didnt tested it (for the moment) as it need to write a nova test program with your "uniforms" variables and I dont have the time to do that now...
I would start with something simple here, since the "crt-guest-dr-venom" package can't work without the meta shader environment (i.e. presets...). There are some mame/bsnes GLSL ports of the crt-trinitron, maybe it's a bit simpler to get this working.

Anyway, i like to remember folks that crt shaders need a low (original) input resolution and a proper way to calculate exact output pixel coordinates for masks. That's why i don't think about doing a reshade thingie, since it operates at output resolutions, probably screen resolution most of the time.
Only masks are doable with this deal.
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Old 06 March 2019, 15:41   #152
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Nice work! That's a bit of the idea of the shader to have many custom options and tweaks. The speed might be a problem for poor adapters, so i'm working on a fast version too.
.
Yes it needs a bit of tweaking but now looks pretty close to my Trinitron, except the mask, on real Trinitron there is a very thin line between pixels that can't be emulated with current resolutions of 1080p etc. Beam dynamics-saturation-scanlines-glow are really close with this shader.

Also I noticed on real CRT that scanlines have different effect on every color, example they are not so visible on red-yellow colors but more visible on "blue" colors (same brightness red/blue pixels). There is noticeable difference there.
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Old 06 March 2019, 16:08   #153
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I tried the CRT-Guest.r-Dr.Venom shader a while back but it had a glow to it that I didn't care for and more prominent scanlines than I like so I went back to the good ol' crt-easymode. I know all this can be configured away but i'm the type of guy who just wants to install a shader and have it look exactly like my old 17" Sony trinitron right out of the box. I don't fuss for hours with these things, but that's just me... and maybe you... and him... and possibly her

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Old 06 March 2019, 16:40   #154
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I tried the CRT-Guest.r-Dr.Venom shader a while back but it had a glow to it that I didn't care for and more prominent scanlines than I like so I went back to the good ol' crt-easymode. I know all this can be configured away but i'm the type of guy who just wants to install a shader and have it look exactly like my old 17" Sony trinitron right out of the box. I don't fuss for hours with these things, but that's just me... and maybe you... and him... and possibly her
New version works "trinitronish" out of the box too...
But i think you've made your point.
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Old 06 March 2019, 16:49   #155
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It does indeed with default settings. Much more than CRT-Royale, where you have to tweek a lot.
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Old 07 March 2019, 07:50   #156
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Shader is a bit heavy but runs on my old laptop well. I would say it's close to being as heavy as crt-royale. But I wouldn't cut edges to make it lighter (=look worse). It's more simple to configure than crt-royale and looks just as good if not better.
Also default setting is a bit off, at least from my Trinitron (default is darker, more blurry, scanlines are not so defined etc but that could be due to my TV having different settings than someone else's TV).
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Old 07 March 2019, 14:42   #157
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Quote:
Also default setting is a bit off, at least from my Trinitron (default is darker, more blurry, scanlines are not so defined etc but that could be due to my TV having different settings than someone else's TV).

Probably valid for any CRT shader i've seen so far. Especially when we talk about the default mask.
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Old 08 March 2019, 22:58   #158
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As mentioned, i was working on a fast version too. One of the motivations are weaker/ older gpu's / Intel igpu's, second are higher resolutions, third is faster gameplay (like leveling) and fourth to make the parameters look less intimidating.

Both versions got one more setting "Mask Size" to pruduce a 1080p mask look with 4k (very fast tweak), and "Alternate Scanlines" is renamed to "Scanlines Type" since it reflects the situation more properly.

Speed boost with fast version is decent, it's almost as fast as crt-hyllian.
Some feedback is welcome, since i got different results using different adapters.
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File Type: zip crt-guest-dr-venom-presets.zip (735 Bytes, 14 views)

Last edited by guest.r; 09 March 2019 at 00:12.
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Old 08 March 2019, 23:54   #159
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Mask Size 2.0 doesn't look good in 4K on my PC (AMD Radeon RX 560) i'm afraid. Tested both versions.


mask style 5





mask style 6


Last edited by Retro-Nerd; 08 March 2019 at 23:59.
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Old 09 March 2019, 00:14   #160
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There seems to be other problems aswell, filtering looks wrong and scanlines too.
Could you try it with normal version too, since my upscaled "4k" works as intended.
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