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Old 11 September 2018, 11:51   #21
Hewitson
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Originally Posted by ubermick View Post
So in terms of the 1084S... again, I'm a gobshite when it comes to the PAL/NTSC debate, but one assumes that if I find one here (and find room to set it up) it's going to be firmly an NTSC model, and give me issues with bottom of the screen chopping?
It's important to understand the difference between PAL/NTSC and 50/60hz.

PAL and NTSC are nothing but colour encoding formats. The Amiga erroneously refers to 50hz as PAL and 60hz as NTSC. This is misleading and simply incorrect.

An NTSC Amiga will output 50hz or 60hz in NTSC.

A PAL Amiga will output 50hz or 60hz in PAL.
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Old 11 September 2018, 19:38   #22
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why you should go RGB then PAL/NTSC dont matter
the GBS-82XX have RGB input etc so as long as the scaler can do 50/60Hz you are good
if you want something you can hook many things into your tv's etc then go for a OSSC they are cheaper it you built it fyi
easily have many retro connected to 1

Last edited by nexus; 11 September 2018 at 19:52.
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Old 12 September 2018, 12:45   #23
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The GBS (aside from being cheap and nasty) does not support a 50hz output. Not recommended.
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Old 12 September 2018, 16:30   #24
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I use a Dell 2001FP, and it's pretty great. But it's biggest drawback is that it doesn't remember the position of the screen, after a resolution change.
Looks like absolute shit compared to a Benq.
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Old 12 September 2018, 17:43   #25
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Yeah, I already had the GBS-82XX on the previous Amiga and LCD monitor, and it looked like garbage. Really unimpressed by it, although apparently a spot of copper tape helps. I already have one, so...

The Benq - despite being expensive - apparently doesn't chop off pixels in overscan, compared to some of the other ones, notably the NEC. Again though, for the price of the Benq 702A shipped to the USA (about $200) I could get the Indivision AGA Mk2 from Jens and use the Amiga on one of the 4 monitors I already have?

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Old 12 September 2018, 20:01   #26
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Originally Posted by Hewitson View Post
The GBS (aside from being cheap and nasty) does not support a 50hz output. Not recommended.
Not sure specifically what you are saying there.

I display games/display modes that output from the Amiga at 50Hz on my VGA monitor using a GBS. They do display and function.

I'm not sure what the output frequency is from the GBS to the VGA monitor, so maybe that is what you are mentioning?


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Old 12 September 2018, 22:52   #27
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There are some projects on the net to improve the video output from the GBS devices, not just putting copper tape over the RAM traces. My GBS-8200 does not have the white specks problem, the image just looks soft. The Amiga to SCART and then SCART to HDMI converter looked better on my monitors. My A2000 has a Microway Flicker Fixer, fast motion shows interlacing artifacts and I also have vertical bars, I have noticed the vertical bars in other peoples EBAY listings also.

The BENQ 702A looks OK at low rez but interlaced resolutions flicker and look soft to me, I paid $136 plus about $30 shipping to buy one from Italy and have it shipped to California, the Amazon reseller I bought from has raised the price about $20 since I bought mine.

If it were me, I would try looking into some of the GBS image quality improvement options before spending too much money on other options.
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Old 12 September 2018, 23:22   #28
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If it were me, I would try looking into some of the GBS image quality improvement options before spending too much money on other options.
Yeah, that's more or less where I'm at. I have the GBS already, I even managed to talk Pavel (the fella on Amibay who sells the RGB to VGA cables) to part with an extra 23 pin connector to build a cable for it rather than dremeling a 25-pin. Based on the few youtube videos I've watched the copper tape is really the one that makes a difference, the extra resistors seem to be hit and miss. Some of the NEC monitors like the EA190M and 1970V are available on fleabay for $40-50 so not a huge outlay to see if that works. It'll probably be "tolerable" for me. If not, I'll start looking at the Indivision.
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Old 13 September 2018, 00:20   #29
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There are some other projects with sync strippers and using arduinos for settings also.
I just picked up a NEC 1970VX brand new in the box for $31 just last month, was even the white cased model so it better matches my Atari I bought it for.
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Old 13 September 2018, 09:48   #30
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I decided to do some testing with my Amiga 500 and my NEC 1970VX, using just the VGA adapter the picture quality was very soft, after setting my 500 to interlaced mode the PQ was an extremely soft, flickering mess.

I dug out my GBS-8200, it gave the best image quality in low rez and it looked pretty good in interlaced mode, my GBS-8200 does not suffer from some of the problems I see people complain about, my 500 is NTSC and not PAL so maybe that makes a difference.
My 19" NEC might be softer than the BENQ 702A due to a larger screen size.

I next tried my Amiga to SCART cable with my $30 SCART to HDMI adapter on my 27" HP monitor, in low rez it looked really good, in interlaced mode it had what almost looked like hum bars moving from the bottom of the frame to the top. I wonder if it might have been better with a 50Hz. PAL signal feeding it instead of a 60Hz NTSC.
The image was also stretched because my 27" monitor is 16:9.
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Old 13 September 2018, 11:18   #31
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Originally Posted by desiv View Post
Not sure specifically what you are saying there.

I display games/display modes that output from the Amiga at 50Hz on my VGA monitor using a GBS. They do display and function.

I'm not sure what the output frequency is from the GBS to the VGA monitor, so maybe that is what you are mentioning?

desiv
Yes, I'm referring to the output refresh rate. Even if you feed it a 50hz signal, it'll convert it to 60hz, resulting in jerky scrolling. Also, old computers/consoles look terrible without scanlines, which I don't believe the GBS is capable of.

Much better off with an RGB to YUV converter and a CRT TV.
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Old 13 September 2018, 20:09   #32
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Yes, I'm referring to the output refresh rate. Even if you feed it a 50hz signal, it'll convert it to 60hz, resulting in jerky scrolling. Also, old computers/consoles look terrible without scanlines, which I don't believe the GBS is capable of.

Much better off with an RGB to YUV converter and a CRT TV.
Mostly agree there.
I do a lot of my gaming with my A1000 on the 1084s monitor.
The A1200 with the GBS is more for the non-games stuff.
Although I do use it for some AGA games. But I don't have the deskspace for an extra monitor there, so I use a KVM and it shares the same monitor (using the GBS) as my PC. It's not as good, but workable for me...
(Note: the KVM is only for the monitor. I still use the Amiga keyboard and mouse. Yes, I grab the wrong mouse sometimes... ;-)


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Old 04 December 2018, 16:15   #33
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Dell U221H - works for me

I'm in the USA & own an Amiga 600 purchased via eBay from a seller in the UK.

Using a Dell U221H lcd monitor - works fine & connected with a video cable I also obtained via eBay.
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Old Today, 02:59   #34
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1084-equivalents are pretty easy to find in the U.S. (whether the Philips or Samsung-type) -- you just have to search for equivalent part numbers for the ones that had RGB input ports. *ALL* of them will work fine at 50Hz and have vertical/horizontal sizing controls to fit a PAL display size. The caveat here is that some of them place the sizing potentiometers on the motherboard instead of on the external controls. The great thing about the 1084 was that they were all available externally.

Failing that, it's not that hard to do a mod on 90's-era televisions to turn them into RGB monitors capable of 50Hz. The display chipsets in them often have at least one RGB input that you can solder directly onto. The downside is that it is usually occupied by the onscreen display (which means you have to add a switch to change software-defined controls). The vertical/horizontal size pots on these are almost always on the motherboard, except for late 90's ones where they are in the hidden service mode of the onscreen display.

EDIT: Also if you can find a late 90's CRT TV that supports component video out of the box, many of them work fine at 50Hz -- you need a passive RGB -> Component converter in between (NOT a digital framebuffer converter). You can build a RGB -> Component converter yourself if you need to using relatively few passive components. This is especially easy if you have a pre-added luma line that you can tap into as then you can just subtract it from the R and B lines to get the component lines. Then you need to go into the hidden service mode on the TV (or use onboard pots) to adjust the display to PAL aspect ratio.

Last edited by AmigaHope; Today at 03:18.
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