Tfx Aga? - Page 3

Reynolds · 22 April 2020, 21:50

Still, an RTG and/or PPC exe would be totally awesome...

Steve · 22 April 2020, 21:58

Quote:

Originally Posted by Reynolds

Still, an RTG and/or PPC exe would be totally awesome...

Haha. Will never happen. Would be nice sure but no, won't happen.

Superman · 23 April 2020, 12:47

Just downloaded this game and I cannot get it to work whatsoever on my A1200. Keeps telling me to insert TFX and DID. Can’t find anything to tell me how to fix it. This is a good reason why a Whdload slave would be good. Just install it and click on an icon to run it.

James · 23 April 2020, 13:35

Quote:

Originally Posted by DamienD

It runs fine on:

(c) TFX_040 BETA exec (requires 68040/060 CPU)

I have a tfx.lha that I downloaded on the 7/12/2001.
The executable contained in the archive is dated 5/12/2001.
I have no memory of where i got it, but it must be this one:

https://groups.google.com/forum/#!to...es/kKZHKZtN8bQ

Have no idea if it works - not had TFX running for years. Will post it up later.

DamienD · 23 April 2020, 19:36

Quote:

Originally Posted by Superman

Just downloaded this game and I cannot get it to work whatsoever on my A1200. Keeps telling me to insert TFX and DID. Can’t find anything to tell me how to fix it.

You're missing the required Assigns then... which are in the scripts to launch whatever model / FPU "game exe" you've chosen to install e.g:

These get created after using the provided installer.

Installing this game is not rocket science guys

James · 23 April 2020, 23:57

The 040 version from 2001 is in the zone now.

DamienD · 24 April 2020, 00:36

Quote:

Originally Posted by James

The 040 version from 2001 is in the zone now.

Thanks James, I'll give it a try

Angus · 25 April 2020, 22:39

Quote:

Originally Posted by jotd

okay, not huge. But is there a point about creating a whdload slave? What is it going to bring despite quitkey?

honest question.

The usual stuff.

I know you guys can't do the impossible, but you've pulled off quite a few miracles in the past.
As you know I have no technical expertise, but based on what I've seen, I would not be at all surprised if a WHDLoad ninja could find some optimisations. Flight Sims didn't get more ambitious than this on the Amiga, so worth a look?

I remember there was a bug with the FPU version that stopped the cannon from working. I think running FASTEXEC helped a little with the speed.

I believe it ran abit faster on an 030, and that there was a flicker issue that turning the caches off resolved(!).

I got into converstaion with Charlie Wallace, the guy that released it, on comp.sys.amiga.games. He gave some fairly detailed info that would probably make more sense to you, and give you a better idea of what might be done.

Bits and pirces like:

"it still uses SMC code and flushes the cache more than it should to
get round it, which will kill the performance of any heavily
cache dependant CPU, which i believe where most of the 060
gets is boost."

The full thread is here:

https://groups.google.com/forum/#!se...Q/SD6r360dIEMJ

"TFX does use fixed point for a lot of stuff like the renderer, however
the flight models too complex to get away with the reduced accuracy
of fixed point.."

jotd · 11 May 2020, 23:10

okay so my 2 cents:

If I understand correctly, TFX runs on a 68060, but the 68040-optimized version does not. Only the 68020/non-FPU version would work and attempting to run the 68040 crashes the machine.

With whdload, an unsupported 68040 FPU instruction would trip an exception. I'd say that non-compatible 68060 FPU instructions could be found in disassembly and maybe patched so the 68060 could run the 68040 version with a few (?) patches, without figuring out the whole picture.

That would probably be better than running a non-FPU version. But this may be an ungrateful task, and unsure that it would allow the game to go significantly faster than the 68020 version. Thougths?

pipper · 12 May 2020, 09:21

Aren’t there tools that are supposed to do this kind of patching kind of on the fly. Oxypatcher?

Angus · 13 May 2020, 17:32

Guys,

A suggestion. TFX was released for the Amiga over 20 years ago, and Charlie Wallace worked on it further for some time, releasing some new .exes. If a WHDLoad slave is made, it would make sense to gather all the .exes that were released so the Patcher can make an informed decision on which exe (or exes) to work on.

I've done a bit of research and have found 6 different exe files.

The first 5 were included in an .hdf put together by Steve Bruce. (Nice one, Steve) :-)

they are named:

TFX.020 filesize: 571008 - patched 020 crashes with fast ram
TFX.030 filesize: 570480 - crashes
TFX.040 filesize: 571008 - crashes

TFX.OLD filesize: 554340 -runs
TFX.FPU filesize: 503340 -runs but I think cannon no longer damages anything.

TFX.??? filesize: 599152 - runs
This last one, is one that I archived myself, years ago. I can't say much about it other than it works, and it's a different filesize to the others. I'm sure I kept it because it was the latest working exe I knew of at the time.

So if any of you have other exes, or info, or recollections? :-)

jotd · 13 May 2020, 19:27

Code:

"it still uses SMC code and flushes the cache more than it should to
get round it, which will kill the performance of any heavily
cache dependant CPU, which i believe where most of the 060
gets is boost."

That can be patched without too much trouble. A lot of 3D games use self-modifying code because their target are 68000 (Red Zone, CAPS are 2 of them). A whdload patch can rework those executables so they don't use SMC anymore (and remove the cache flush call). It's very easy to locate them thanks to the following cache flush which is super easy to locate.

Angus · 21 August 2020, 14:31

Quote:

Originally Posted by jotd

[CODE]
That can be patched without too much trouble. A lot of 3D games use self-modifying code because their target are 68000 (Red Zone, CAPS are 2 of them). A whdload patch can rework those executables so they don't use SMC anymore (and remove the cache flush call). It's very easy to locate them thanks to the following cache flush which is super easy to locate.

This was sounding fairly positive..........

jotd · 21 August 2020, 14:40

that is if any of the executables worked. Most of the executables provided crash at startup. Code disassembly reveals that it's completely broken.

AmigaHope · 25 August 2020, 06:01

Quote:

Originally Posted by jotd

that is if any of the executables worked. Most of the executables provided crash at startup. Code disassembly reveals that it's completely broken.

This is on the executables from the author's old geocities site? I seem to recall most of them at least *ran* on my A4000 back in the day.

DamienD · 25 August 2020, 12:00

Quote:

Originally Posted by jotd

that is if any of the executables worked. Most of the executables provided crash at startup. Code disassembly reveals that it's completely broken.

I used the archive from the magazine Commodore User CD15.

From memory the TFX_68000 and TFX_FPU files worked fine, but I think I had issues with TFX_040.

Angus · 25 August 2020, 23:28

This was my contribution to the working .exe issue:

TFX.020 filesize: 571008 - patched 020 crashes with fast ram
TFX.030 filesize: 570480 - crashes
TFX.040 filesize: 571008 - crashes

TFX.OLD filesize: 554340 -runs
TFX.FPU filesize: 503340 -runs but I think cannon no longer damages anything.

TFX.??? filesize: 599152 - runs
This last one, is one that I archived myself, years ago. I can't say much about it other than it works, and it's a different filesize to the others. I'm sure I kept it because it was the latest working exe I knew of at the time.

NovaCoder · 26 August 2020, 10:20

Quote:

Originally Posted by Angus

This was my contribution to the working .exe issue:

TFX.020 filesize: 571008 - patched 020 crashes with fast ram
TFX.030 filesize: 570480 - crashes
TFX.040 filesize: 571008 - crashes

TFX.OLD filesize: 554340 -runs
TFX.FPU filesize: 503340 -runs but I think cannon no longer damages anything.

TFX.??? filesize: 599152 - runs
This last one, is one that I archived myself, years ago. I can't say much about it other than it works, and it's a different filesize to the others. I'm sure I kept it because it was the latest working exe I knew of at the time.

Yep like I said originally, they are a right mess.

I still don't understand why this wouldn't be a great candidate for a WHLOAD patch to get the bloody thing working properly

jotd · 26 August 2020, 21:55

can someone just zone / zip the working exes and not the ones that crash? A whdload installation could provide the proper executables for this game instead of downloaded ones assembled with who knows what tool (a blender?)

DamienD · 26 August 2020, 22:56

As mentined, these worked for me in WinUAE (well, except for TFX_040):

Quote:

Originally Posted by DamienD

I used the archive from the magazine Commodore User CD15.

From memory the TFX_68000 and TFX_FPU files worked fine, but I think I had issues with TFX_040.

Ok, in The Zone!

13 May 2020, 17:32	#51
Angus Amiga Games Database Join Date: Jun 2006 Location: South West England Posts: 1,240	Guys, A suggestion. TFX was released for the Amiga over 20 years ago, and Charlie Wallace worked on it further for some time, releasing some new .exes. If a WHDLoad slave is made, it would make sense to gather all the .exes that were released so the Patcher can make an informed decision on which exe (or exes) to work on. I've done a bit of research and have found 6 different exe files. The first 5 were included in an .hdf put together by Steve Bruce. (Nice one, Steve) :-) they are named: TFX.020 filesize: 571008 - patched 020 crashes with fast ram TFX.030 filesize: 570480 - crashes TFX.040 filesize: 571008 - crashes TFX.OLD filesize: 554340 -runs TFX.FPU filesize: 503340 -runs but I think cannon no longer damages anything. TFX.??? filesize: 599152 - runs This last one, is one that I archived myself, years ago. I can't say much about it other than it works, and it's a different filesize to the others. I'm sure I kept it because it was the latest working exe I knew of at the time. So if any of you have other exes, or info, or recollections? :-) Last edited by Angus; 13 May 2020 at 20:54.

13 May 2020, 19:27	#52
jotd This cat is no more Join Date: Dec 2004 Location: FRANCE Age: 52 Posts: 8,170	Code: "it still uses SMC code and flushes the cache more than it should to get round it, which will kill the performance of any heavily cache dependant CPU, which i believe where most of the 060 gets is boost." That can be patched without too much trouble. A lot of 3D games use self-modifying code because their target are 68000 (Red Zone, CAPS are 2 of them). A whdload patch can rework those executables so they don't use SMC anymore (and remove the cache flush call). It's very easy to locate them thanks to the following cache flush which is super easy to locate.

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22 April 2020, 21:50	#41
Reynolds Alien Breeder Join Date: Dec 2007 Location: Szigetszentmiklos / Hungary Age: 46 Posts: 1,096	Still, an RTG and/or PPC exe would be totally awesome...

23 April 2020, 12:47	#43
Superman Super Member Join Date: Sep 2014 Location: Wakefield Age: 48 Posts: 1,334	Just downloaded this game and I cannot get it to work whatsoever on my A1200. Keeps telling me to insert TFX and DID. Can’t find anything to tell me how to fix it. This is a good reason why a Whdload slave would be good. Just install it and click on an icon to run it.

23 April 2020, 23:57	#46
James Registered User Join Date: Mar 2010 Location: Beckenham/England Posts: 795	The 040 version from 2001 is in the zone now.

11 May 2020, 23:10	#49
jotd This cat is no more Join Date: Dec 2004 Location: FRANCE Age: 52 Posts: 8,170	okay so my 2 cents: If I understand correctly, TFX runs on a 68060, but the 68040-optimized version does not. Only the 68020/non-FPU version would work and attempting to run the 68040 crashes the machine. With whdload, an unsupported 68040 FPU instruction would trip an exception. I'd say that non-compatible 68060 FPU instructions could be found in disassembly and maybe patched so the 68060 could run the 68040 version with a few (?) patches, without figuring out the whole picture. That would probably be better than running a non-FPU version. But this may be an ungrateful task, and unsure that it would allow the game to go significantly faster than the 68020 version. Thougths?

12 May 2020, 09:21	#50
pipper Registered User Join Date: Jul 2017 Location: San Jose Posts: 652	Aren’t there tools that are supposed to do this kind of patching kind of on the fly. Oxypatcher?

21 August 2020, 14:40	#54
jotd This cat is no more Join Date: Dec 2004 Location: FRANCE Age: 52 Posts: 8,170	that is if any of the executables worked. Most of the executables provided crash at startup. Code disassembly reveals that it's completely broken.

25 August 2020, 23:28	#57
Angus Amiga Games Database Join Date: Jun 2006 Location: South West England Posts: 1,240	This was my contribution to the working .exe issue: TFX.020 filesize: 571008 - patched 020 crashes with fast ram TFX.030 filesize: 570480 - crashes TFX.040 filesize: 571008 - crashes TFX.OLD filesize: 554340 -runs TFX.FPU filesize: 503340 -runs but I think cannon no longer damages anything. TFX.??? filesize: 599152 - runs This last one, is one that I archived myself, years ago. I can't say much about it other than it works, and it's a different filesize to the others. I'm sure I kept it because it was the latest working exe I knew of at the time.

26 August 2020, 21:55	#59
jotd This cat is no more Join Date: Dec 2004 Location: FRANCE Age: 52 Posts: 8,170	can someone just zone / zip the working exes and not the ones that crash? A whdload installation could provide the proper executables for this game instead of downloaded ones assembled with who knows what tool (a blender?)

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