Oldest RTS?

26 February 2003, 18:14

Does anyone know the oldest ever Real Time Stratagy is? For any console? I just want to know the game that started off the whole genre.

cv643d · 26 February 2003, 18:34

They say Dune2 was one of the first.

26 February 2003, 18:36

Quote:

Originally posted by zakfab
Does anyone know the oldest ever Real Time Stratagy is? For any console? I just want to know the game that started off the whole genre.

The oldest game I can remember is the 8 bits version of War in the Middle Earth (Amstrad CPC version is fantastic)

Steve · 26 February 2003, 18:36

Quote:

Originally posted by cv643d
They say Dune2 was one of the first.

Yeah I agree. Although someone will probably come up with some really obscure game that was on the C64 or BBC Micro.

26 February 2003, 18:39

Quote:

Originally posted by cv643d
They say Dune2 was one of the first.

Dune 2 was inspired in the Genesis/Megadrive game Herzog Zwei (I read a interview to the programmers where they confirmed it)

Unknown_K · 26 February 2003, 22:26

Every RTS up to the present day has origins from DUNE 2.

I still have the original loaded on my 3866/40 dos box and have the amiga version on floppies (HD version on my A1200).

Very fun game

Shatterhand · 27 February 2003, 04:27

If you are considering what was the 1st RTS in the same style of EVERY RTS released today, then it's Dune 2. But think about it, Megalomania IS an RTS, and it's older than Dune 2.

Herzog Zwei indeed has some stuff similar to Dune 2, but you control a ship that can carry all the other units and move them around the field. Herzog Zwei is the sequel of Herzog for MSX, which also is a little bit like Dune 2.

The oldest RTS I can think of is Bokosuka Wars for MSX, if you can call that a strategy game. Many people do it.

Unknown_K · 27 February 2003, 05:31

The term RTS didnt even exist untill after Dune 2 and the other clones came out. It was defined for the games where combat, resource gathering, and base building was done in real time by 2 or more players/computer opponents. Other traits are exploring the map to uncover features (fog of war), and control is mostly using a mouse.

manicx · 27 February 2003, 09:50

What is defined as RTG? How about Laser Squad?

RetroMan · 27 February 2003, 11:26

I would vote for Populous

Wasn´t it released before Dune II ???

Drake1009 · 27 February 2003, 11:27

Laser squad isn't what I'd call real time, but rather turn based. So the RT in your RTG had better be something else than Real Time.

7-Zark-7 · 27 February 2003, 15:00

Quote:

Originally posted by RetroMan
I would vote for Populous Wasn´t it released before Dune II ???

Excellent point retroman. Although I'm trying to recall wouldn't Mike Singleton's games also count for R.T.S.? (I'm not a huge fan of the genre excepting starcraft, nowdays. However, I do recall Mike Singleton being regarded the king of strategy games at one time.).
Early Amiga games Midwinter 1 & 2, previously C64 Quake Minus One, Lords of Midnight & Doomdark's Revenge?

CodyJarrett · 27 February 2003, 16:03

I wouldn't call Populous a RTS game - you have no direct control over the people. It's a god sim.

North And South is closer to RTS than Populous is.

7-Zark-7 · 27 February 2003, 16:38

What about Powermonger then,Cody?

CodyJarrett · 27 February 2003, 17:18

Powermonger is quite close to an RTS, because you have direct control over your armies. It's more of a wargame than a god sim.

Unknown_K · 27 February 2003, 17:24

Having direct control of your armies is only part of it. I desribe RTS as a player starting from a small base. You then have to gather multiple resources, expand the base, create new buildings types, research tech upgrades pump out troops, and then defeat the enemy all in real time.

Mr Creosote · 27 February 2003, 18:38

Nether Earth, released in 1987 for the Spectrum.

Shatterhand · 28 February 2003, 05:03

Quote:

Originally posted by Unknown_K
Having direct control of your armies is only part of it. I desribe RTS as a player starting from a small base. You then have to gather multiple resources, expand the base, create new buildings types, research tech upgrades pump out troops, and then defeat the enemy all in real time.

I.E. 99% of strategy games released today

Real Time Strategy should mean any strategy game that's not played in turns. If two players could play chess against each other at the same time (I.E. not taking turns), it should be a RTS.

And I think Utopia has all the stuff you mentione above, don't ?

Athoulgh I agree the name only appeared after Dune 2. But this name is just marketing stuff. First real strategy game my arse

BTW, Bokosuka Wars is from 1984, if you want to take this contender seriously..

Unknown_K · 28 February 2003, 05:32

Quote:

Originally posted by Shatterhand
I.E. 99% of strategy games released today

Real Time Strategy should mean any strategy game that's not played in turns. If two players could play chess against each other at the same time (I.E. not taking turns), it should be a RTS.

And I think Utopia has all the stuff you mentione above, don't ?

Athoulgh I agree the name only appeared after Dune 2. But this name is just marketing stuff. First real strategy game my arse

BTW, Bokosuka Wars is from 1984, if you want to take this contender seriously..

Well RTS might be a marketing term but when you use that term expect to hear about games around the time the term was created. People hear the term and automatically think of games like dune 2 and what came after.

If you would have said FPS people would have said doom, or wolf3d even though there were other dungeon games with the 3d ish look where you explored and killed monsters.

Some games had such a good combination of design factors that they DEFINED the genre that gets named after them. Sure there are games that are kind of like it.. but none had the same effect as the games mentioned above.

cv643d · 28 February 2003, 17:59

what about Chaos for Spectrum, came out in the 80-ies sometimes.

Incredible game IMHO.

26 February 2003, 18:14	#1
Traquer Posts: n/a	Oldest RTS? Does anyone know the oldest ever Real Time Stratagy is? For any console? I just want to know the game that started off the whole genre.

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26 February 2003, 18:34	#2
cv643d Registered User Join Date: Jul 2002 Location: Sweden Posts: 762	They say Dune2 was one of the first.

26 February 2003, 22:26	#6
Unknown_K Registered User Join Date: May 2002 Location: Ohio/USA Age: 55 Posts: 1,380	Every RTS up to the present day has origins from DUNE 2. I still have the original loaded on my 3866/40 dos box and have the amiga version on floppies (HD version on my A1200). Very fun game

27 February 2003, 04:27	#7
Shatterhand Warhasneverbeensomuchfun Join Date: Jun 2001 Location: Rio de Janeiro / Brazil Age: 41 Posts: 3,450	If you are considering what was the 1st RTS in the same style of EVERY RTS released today, then it's Dune 2. But think about it, Megalomania IS an RTS, and it's older than Dune 2. Herzog Zwei indeed has some stuff similar to Dune 2, but you control a ship that can carry all the other units and move them around the field. Herzog Zwei is the sequel of Herzog for MSX, which also is a little bit like Dune 2. The oldest RTS I can think of is Bokosuka Wars for MSX, if you can call that a strategy game. Many people do it.

27 February 2003, 05:31	#8
Unknown_K Registered User Join Date: May 2002 Location: Ohio/USA Age: 55 Posts: 1,380	The term RTS didnt even exist untill after Dune 2 and the other clones came out. It was defined for the games where combat, resource gathering, and base building was done in real time by 2 or more players/computer opponents. Other traits are exploring the map to uncover features (fog of war), and control is mostly using a mouse.

27 February 2003, 09:50	#9
manicx Junior Member Join Date: Oct 2002 Location: Athens, Greece Posts: 991	What is defined as RTG? How about Laser Squad?

27 February 2003, 11:26	#10
RetroMan Registered User Join Date: Aug 2001 Location: Germany Age: 51 Posts: 3,704	I would vote for Populous Wasn´t it released before Dune II ???

27 February 2003, 11:27	#11
Drake1009 Registered User Join Date: Jul 2001 Location: Denmark Posts: 2,284	Laser squad isn't what I'd call real time, but rather turn based. So the RT in your RTG had better be something else than Real Time.

27 February 2003, 16:03	#13
CodyJarrett Global Moderator Join Date: Mar 2001 Location: UK Age: 46 Posts: 6,160	I wouldn't call Populous a RTS game - you have no direct control over the people. It's a god sim. North And South is closer to RTS than Populous is.

27 February 2003, 16:38	#14
7-Zark-7 Zone Friend Join Date: Aug 2001 Location: Brisbane/Australia Posts: 1,270	What about Powermonger then,Cody?

27 February 2003, 17:18	#15
CodyJarrett Global Moderator Join Date: Mar 2001 Location: UK Age: 46 Posts: 6,160	Powermonger is quite close to an RTS, because you have direct control over your armies. It's more of a wargame than a god sim.

27 February 2003, 17:24	#16
Unknown_K Registered User Join Date: May 2002 Location: Ohio/USA Age: 55 Posts: 1,380	Having direct control of your armies is only part of it. I desribe RTS as a player starting from a small base. You then have to gather multiple resources, expand the base, create new buildings types, research tech upgrades pump out troops, and then defeat the enemy all in real time.

27 February 2003, 18:38	#17
Mr Creosote Evil Mastermind Join Date: Jul 2002 Location: Home Posts: 740	Nether Earth, released in 1987 for the Spectrum.

28 February 2003, 17:59	#20
cv643d Registered User Join Date: Jul 2002 Location: Sweden Posts: 762	what about Chaos for Spectrum, came out in the 80-ies sometimes. Incredible game IMHO.

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