I just installed my new "Amiga". :) - Page 2

Minuous · 28 March 2002, 21:45

OK, the results are in! Clearly WinUAE0.8.8.R9 is faster than 0.8.17R3...

Here's the SysInfo results for 0.8.17R3:

Minuous · 28 March 2002, 21:47

And, for comparison, here's the results under 0.8.8R9:

Bloodwych · 30 March 2002, 12:26

Minuous:

That's really strange, JIT WinUAE is MANY times faster than non-JIT on my system.

About your screen caps - I can't work out the readings given in sysinfo.

The first one (817R3) shows a locked 7.09Mhz speed, as if you've selected "run A500 speed" in the CPU section and not "fastest possibe".

Selecting the former will limit the possible performance gain from running JIT.

Did you use the configeration "test" I'd provided with WinUAE8.17R3?

andreas · 30 March 2002, 16:47

To put it bluntly: that's like comparing apples and oranges.

0.8.17 R3 shows FPU = NONE, 0.8.8 R9 shows FPU = 68881!

Minuous · 03 April 2002, 13:46

Yes, it's set to "Fastest possible, but maintain chipset timing".

I agree about the FPU, but I don't believe in this case it makes a difference, as I'm not running anything that might use the FPU, and the dhrystones test being used as a benchmark is an integer test. I can switch off the FPU and retest but I doubt it will have much if any effect.

It is very strange that WinUAE is so slow and that JIT does not work :-( I wonder if I should submit a bug report to the new programmer of WinUAE, he will hopefully be more inclined to act than the previous programmer (BK). I've had this same problem with several versions of WinUAE and on two different computers.

Bloodwych · 03 April 2002, 15:51

It seems WinUAE is very system/OS dependant - it throws up different results for everyone!

turk182 · 03 April 2002, 16:03

@burseg
my Athlon 500 has been running at 750+ for over a year now with little problems ..By the time it dies I will need a new AMD chip anyhow..It really does save you a few dollars/pounds/lira

dont be afraid go for it!

@kim wow we are honoured welcome to 16bit power! ..

I like your site lots!...

Toni Wilen · 03 April 2002, 16:48

Quote:

It is very strange that WinUAE is so slow and that JIT does not work

Could you try following:

- create new configuration from scratch (delete default.uae first)
- disable/enable sound
- boot from non-modified workbench floppy or boot without startup-sequence (programs that disable CPU caches also disable JIT)
- try different display modes
- try different kickstart images (at least some A4000 kickstart images are not 100% compatible with UAE)

Paul · 03 April 2002, 17:37

On my system 21r2 is much faster than 8.8r9 but not as fast as 17r3. Both results use the same config...68020+FPU, 4MB CHIP, 16MB FAST, 8MB RTG, Fastest possible, but maintain chipset, AGA, sound on 100% compatable, ks3.1.

This is 8.8r9 sysinfo results

Paul · 03 April 2002, 17:39

And 21r2 with JIT

Paul · 03 April 2002, 17:44

And 17r3 With JIT. The fastest

Paul · 03 April 2002, 17:54

@Minuous

I see you only have 64Mb. I think you need a minimum of 128MB for JIT to work right due to the amount taken up by Windows.

Bloodwych · 03 April 2002, 18:03

Quote:

Originally posted by Bloodwych

How much RAM do you have in your PC? You'll need memory for the Amiga, program AND 4 MB for the JIT cache. You may have been allocating too much memory for your system to handle or not giving JIT a cache at all.

Paul, I was onto RAM as a possible reason (see above) but never thought WinUAE JIT required 128MB physical RAM - that's astronomical!

Oh well Minuous, time for e-bay and an inexpensive RAM upgrade. You should be able to get that machine up to 128MB for next to nothing. JIT is definitely worth it due to the manner you use WinUAE.

Paul, what system are you running to get those results? Looks like you've found similar ratios to me across the different versions.

Paul · 03 April 2002, 18:18

Quote:

Originally posted by Bloodwych
Paul, I was onto RAM as a possible reason (see above) but never thought WinUAE JIT required 128MB physical RAM - that's astronomical!

I have 1GB of RAM in my newest system and after boot up I have 735MB left free according to Ram Booster, so this shows how bad Windows is at managing ram, on Windows 98SE Anyway.

Quote:

Paul, what system are you running to get those results? Looks like you've found similar ratios to me across the different versions.

Rest of my system specs.

1GHz AMD processor
80GB HD split into 2 40GB partitions.
32MB ATI 128 ultra Graphics card.
Soundblaster Live 5.1
CD-R/CD-RW 16x10x40x
4X DVD-ROM
1.44MB Floppy drive

Bloodwych · 03 April 2002, 18:24

Hehe, not that I want to turn this into a pissing contest or anything but I've still got the SysInfo crown in terms of raw speed in AGA chipset mode.

Come on, beat my pesky little Duron 950, 256MB Crucial DDR, 8KHA+ KT266A, Matrox G200 and sblive! rig. :smoking

Paul, I know Windows uses a lot of physical RAM (mainly for Vcache) and Win 98SE doesn't have the best memory management (although better than 95).

It is designed to eat RAM though, as it's better put to free RAM to use as a dynamic vcache than not at all

. I was just surprised that 64MB+SWAP wasn't enough to enable JIT. Toni, please clarify!

Minuous · 04 April 2002, 02:11

If WinUAE truly requires 128Mb RAM then this is a major flaw, nothing else I run needs such colossal amounts of memory...

Should I send a formal bug report to TW?

Toni Wilen · 04 April 2002, 08:55

Quote:

If WinUAE truly requires 128Mb RAM then this is a major flaw, nothing else I run needs such colossal amounts of memory...

No, it does not require 128Mb (if you don't set Amiga memory size to over 64Mb...), but because Windows internally requires at least 32Mb of memory to work properly. This leaves only about 30Mb (if you have 64Mb system) for WinUAE. Running WinUAE takes about 10Mb memory = you have only about max 20Mb for emulated Amiga's memory + JIT caches...

But this doesn't explain why JIT doesn't work on your system. It should work if you have enough swap space. Did you try my suggestions?

Minuous · 05 April 2002, 00:23

I've tried most of those suggestions.

Regarding swap space, generally my C: partition is more or less full, occasionally it fills up. Although not very often and only when I have lots of apps open. But I have Windoze as the only thing on that 400Mb partition, I refuse to allocate more than 400Mb to an operating system :-) Especially one that is rather crap :-D

If JIT can't allocate its memory surely it would come up with a requester stating this? Since no such requester appears I would assume that it can find enough memory...

28 March 2002, 21:45	#21
Minuous Coder/webmaster/gamer Join Date: Oct 2001 Location: Canberra/Australia Posts: 2,643	OK, the results are in! Clearly WinUAE0.8.8.R9 is faster than 0.8.17R3... Here's the SysInfo results for 0.8.17R3: Attached Thumbnails

28 March 2002, 21:47	#22
Minuous Coder/webmaster/gamer Join Date: Oct 2001 Location: Canberra/Australia Posts: 2,643	And, for comparison, here's the results under 0.8.8R9: Attached Thumbnails

03 April 2002, 16:03	#27
turk182 Junior Member Join Date: Sep 2001 Location: london Posts: 188	@burseg my Athlon 500 has been running at 750+ for over a year now with little problems ..By the time it dies I will need a new AMD chip anyhow..It really does save you a few dollars/pounds/lira dont be afraid go for it! @kim wow we are honoured welcome to 16bit power! .. I like your site lots!... Last edited by turk182; 03 April 2002 at 16:08.

03 April 2002, 17:37	#29
Paul RIP Friends Join Date: Sep 2005 Location: UK Posts: 2,157	On my system 21r2 is much faster than 8.8r9 but not as fast as 17r3. Both results use the same config...68020+FPU, 4MB CHIP, 16MB FAST, 8MB RTG, Fastest possible, but maintain chipset, AGA, sound on 100% compatable, ks3.1. This is 8.8r9 sysinfo results Attached Thumbnails Last edited by Paul; 03 April 2002 at 18:47.

03 April 2002, 17:39	#30
Paul RIP Friends Join Date: Sep 2005 Location: UK Posts: 2,157	And 21r2 with JIT Attached Thumbnails

30 March 2002, 12:26	#23
Bloodwych Moderator Join Date: Jun 2001 Location: I'm behind you! Posts: 3,763	Minuous: That's really strange, JIT WinUAE is MANY times faster than non-JIT on my system. About your screen caps - I can't work out the readings given in sysinfo. The first one (817R3) shows a locked 7.09Mhz speed, as if you've selected "run A500 speed" in the CPU section and not "fastest possibe". Selecting the former will limit the possible performance gain from running JIT. Did you use the configeration "test" I'd provided with WinUAE8.17R3?

30 March 2002, 16:47	#24
andreas Zone Friend Join Date: Jun 2001 Location: Germany Age: 50 Posts: 5,857	To put it bluntly: that's like comparing apples and oranges. 0.8.17 R3 shows FPU = NONE, 0.8.8 R9 shows FPU = 68881!

03 April 2002, 13:46	#25
Minuous Coder/webmaster/gamer Join Date: Oct 2001 Location: Canberra/Australia Posts: 2,643	Yes, it's set to "Fastest possible, but maintain chipset timing". I agree about the FPU, but I don't believe in this case it makes a difference, as I'm not running anything that might use the FPU, and the dhrystones test being used as a benchmark is an integer test. I can switch off the FPU and retest but I doubt it will have much if any effect. It is very strange that WinUAE is so slow and that JIT does not work :-( I wonder if I should submit a bug report to the new programmer of WinUAE, he will hopefully be more inclined to act than the previous programmer (BK). I've had this same problem with several versions of WinUAE and on two different computers.

03 April 2002, 15:51	#26
Bloodwych Moderator Join Date: Jun 2001 Location: I'm behind you! Posts: 3,763	It seems WinUAE is very system/OS dependant - it throws up different results for everyone!

03 April 2002, 17:44	#31
Paul RIP Friends Join Date: Sep 2005 Location: UK Posts: 2,157	And 17r3 With JIT. The fastest Attached Thumbnails

03 April 2002, 17:54	#32
Paul RIP Friends Join Date: Sep 2005 Location: UK Posts: 2,157	@Minuous I see you only have 64Mb. I think you need a minimum of 128MB for JIT to work right due to the amount taken up by Windows. Last edited by Paul; 03 April 2002 at 18:03.

03 April 2002, 18:24	#35
Bloodwych Moderator Join Date: Jun 2001 Location: I'm behind you! Posts: 3,763	Hehe, not that I want to turn this into a pissing contest or anything but I've still got the SysInfo crown in terms of raw speed in AGA chipset mode. Come on, beat my pesky little Duron 950, 256MB Crucial DDR, 8KHA+ KT266A, Matrox G200 and sblive! rig. :smoking Paul, I know Windows uses a lot of physical RAM (mainly for Vcache) and Win 98SE doesn't have the best memory management (although better than 95). It is designed to eat RAM though, as it's better put to free RAM to use as a dynamic vcache than not at all . I was just surprised that 64MB+SWAP wasn't enough to enable JIT. Toni, please clarify!

04 April 2002, 02:11	#36
Minuous Coder/webmaster/gamer Join Date: Oct 2001 Location: Canberra/Australia Posts: 2,643	If WinUAE truly requires 128Mb RAM then this is a major flaw, nothing else I run needs such colossal amounts of memory... Should I send a formal bug report to TW?

05 April 2002, 00:23	#38
Minuous Coder/webmaster/gamer Join Date: Oct 2001 Location: Canberra/Australia Posts: 2,643	I've tried most of those suggestions. Regarding swap space, generally my C: partition is more or less full, occasionally it fills up. Although not very often and only when I have lots of apps open. But I have Windoze as the only thing on that 400Mb partition, I refuse to allocate more than 400Mb to an operating system :-) Especially one that is rather crap :-D If JIT can't allocate its memory surely it would come up with a requester stating this? Since no such requester appears I would assume that it can find enough memory...

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