After the War

[Shatterhand]

I just got to play After the War through WHDLoad.

First, congratulations to whoever did that slave, outstanding work. With the colors looking like an Amiga game and being able to kick with 2nd button on the 1st part of the game, the game became a lot better, and it's actually pretty fun to play.

Now this surprised me.. I am very fond of the Spectrum/MSX version, which I played a lot. In spite of being a black and white game, the sprites were very big on that game and the game was a lot playable and fun to play...

The Amiga version doesn't have as big sprites as the 8 bits version... but it has a LOT of stuff going on, like 2 floors, a bigger variety of enemies, collectable weapons (and also, obviously, is colorful).... it's a shame you can basically skip whole levels by just jumping forward constantly (this will not work on the 8 bits version), but it's a very playable and fun game to play.. I was expecting a lot less, since most of those spanish games really suck on 16 bits versions. Considering how awful our version of Vigilante was, this is a good replacement for sure. It's only lacking music.

Now part 2 isn't as playable as the first one, but it's still kinda fun to play. It's a shame part 1 is so easy and so short (It was short on the Spectrum/MSX too, but not that easy).

Now... my question: Is it possible to beat part 1 without just jumping and skipping everything? Because time limit is TOO FRIGGING tight, and this is really a bummer on the overall game. The 8 bits version had no time limit on part 1, just part 2... and here it's really too tight, bosses take a while to die.


Really, it may be just an atari ST port, but it's a pretty nice game, and we don't have that many Amiga games like this one. I just wished the 1st part was a bit longer, since that was the most fun to play.

Alas... why spanish developers kept dividing games in "Part 1" and "Part 2" on 16 bits systems with games being distributed on floppies? They could had made just one single, continuous game, it could have the "gameplay change" at one point, keep your score and maybe give you more lives or extra lives during gameplay to compensate.

Well, guess we were asking too much from the poor chaps, they had even worse work conditions than british guys.

They should had ported Captain Trueno for 16 bits systems. IMO it was the best game by Dinamic on the Spectrum/MSX .

[dlfrsilver]

First, congratulations to whoever did that slave, outstanding work. With the colors looking like an Amiga game and being able to kick with 2nd button on the 1st part of the game, the game became a lot better, and it's actually pretty fun to play.

Yes it's a nice game. A bit slow due to the use of a software engine, but a nice game to play.

Now this surprised me.. I am very fond of the Spectrum/MSX version, which I played a lot. In spite of being a black and white game, the sprites were very big on that game and the game was a lot playable and fun to play...

I love the CPC version, which was in 89 the lead machine at Dinamic.
It has everything, huge sprites, lots of colors, playability, and quite nice sounds.

The Amiga version doesn't have as big sprites as the 8 bits version... but it has a LOT of stuff going on, like 2 floors, a bigger variety of enemies, collectable weapons (and also, obviously, is colorful).... it's a shame you can basically skip whole levels by just jumping forward constantly (this will not work on the 8 bits version), but it's a very playable and fun game to play.. I was expecting a lot less, since most of those spanish games really suck on 16 bits versions. Considering how awful our version of Vigilante was, this is a good replacement for sure. It's only lacking music.

Yes but the graphics are thiner than the original version on 8 bits.

The spanish games suck on 16 bits machine because they used the ST as the main machine, using software engines.

On arcade games with lots of sprites, that's quite a problem. But nonetheless, the amiga version has slow downs, and it's a bit normal considering the number of sprites moving onscreen.

Now part 2 isn't as playable as the first one, but it's still kinda fun to play. It's a shame part 1 is so easy and so short (It was short on the Spectrum/MSX too, but not that easy).

Part 2 is more funny i think, due to the machinegun FX. It's very funny to use

Now... my question: Is it possible to beat part 1 without just jumping and skipping everything? Because time limit is TOO FRIGGING tight, and this is really a bummer on the overall game. The 8 bits version had no time limit on part 1, just part 2... and here it's really too tight, bosses take a while to die.

It's useless to try to beat all the enemies. Kill some of them, and respect the timer

Really, it may be just an atari ST port, but it's a pretty nice game, and we don't have that many Amiga games like this one. I just wished the 1st part was a bit longer, since that was the most fun to play.

yes dinamic had awesome graphists I loved this company for this matter.

Alas... why spanish developers kept dividing games in "Part 1" and "Part 2" on 16 bits systems with games being distributed on floppies? They could had made just one single, continuous game, it could have the "gameplay change" at one point, keep your score and maybe give you more lives or extra lives during gameplay to compensate.

that the way spanish games were made. You can't ask them to do things exactly like the UK companies

Well, guess we were asking too much from the poor chaps, they had even worse work conditions than british guys.

They should had ported Captain Trueno for 16 bits systems. IMO it was the best game by Dinamic on the Spectrum/MSX .

El capitan trueno (le Capitaine Fracasse in french), was a weak licence, hence the bad selling, hence they didn't port the game, which was already to short in term of life.

If you want to play the best version, go play the CPC version which again was the lead version It has great colors, nice animation, and a quite good playability

[s2325]

My imagination long ago linked After the War to Astro Marine Corps because of similar main hero and mood. When I was young playing Ater the War was like controlling SF comic book.

[Shatterhand]

I've played the CPC version of Captian Trueno through emulation, it indeed was pretty good

Astro Marine Corps is freaking awesome on Spectrum/MSX. It's also, IMO, the most impressive game I saw running on a spectrum. The game is very colorful, has parallax scroll, lots of stuff moving on screen, no color-clash, a KILLER soundtrack...

I first saw it on MSX, and I was like "Wow, for the first time those spanish guys made a proper MSX version instead of another rush spectrum port". And then I was amazed when I found out that the original Spectrum game was identical.

Then the Amiga version... what a dissapointment. None of the other versions are as good as the Speccy/MSX one (the CPC one gets close), but the Amiga version was really... bleh.

Should I change the topic title to "Spanish Games" ?

[Shatterhand]

that the way spanish games were made. You can't ask them to do things exactly like the UK companies

Spanish games were made like that so the user could get more value for the money... they were distributed in tape, part 1 was side A of the tape, part 2 was side B.

So it was like having 2 games while buying just one.

When the games were on floppy, this made no sense

[s2325]

I think second part was often protected with password which was only at end of first part. I know this from Amstrad games but only in Savage on Amiga.

[Shatterhand]

Yes, it was. Because while the idea was to have "2 games on ", the 2nd part was also directly linked to the first part. On AFter The War for example, first parts are level 1, 2 and 3, second part are levels 4, 5 and 6. Gameplay changes a lot between level 3 and 4, so it's nearly a new game. On Army Moves, levels 1, 2, 3 and 4 (first part) are a shoot'em up, while levels 5, 6 and 7 (2nd parte) are a jump and run. So you should only play part 2 if you have beaten part 1.

In some cases, the first part was some kind of introduction to second part. Game "Titanic" (only for 8 bits) had the first part you looking for the sunk ship, while second part was inside the ship.

sometimes the gameplay didn't change a lot (like in Titanic, or Astro Marine Corps), but then the graphics would look a lot different on each aprt. That's why I think there was no need to do it like that on floppy, just let the game keep going after you beat first part. You could, at best, have a password so players would start from the middle of the game, but even then I don't think it's really that necessary.. each part of After the War takes like 10 minutes, the whole game shouldn't take more than half a hour to be beaten.

I am pretty sure with Astro Marine Corps they did it like that, ditched the "2 parts" thing on Amiga and just added some loading mid-game, when you switch from earth to the alien planet (and graphics are completely different, while the gameplay remains pretty much the same)

BTW AFter the War also has part 2 locked while you don't beat part 1 and get the passcode for it. WHDLoad slave removes this

[dlfrsilver]

Originally Posted by Shatterhand

I've played the CPC version of Captian Trueno through emulation, it indeed was pretty good

Yes a nice game

Astro Marine Corps is freaking awesome on Spectrum/MSX. It's also, IMO, the most impressive game I saw running on a spectrum. The game is very colorful, has parallax scroll, lots of stuff moving on screen, no color-clash, a KILLER soundtrack...

Just try the CPC version (it was again the lead version on the lead machine), it has all the spectrum feat, minoring the lack of colors.

The CPC version is one of the very best games available on this machine.
I tried the Zx spectrum version, the amiga version (i owned it in original), the ST version, and the C64 version, it beats them all one hand tied in the back.

I'm playing to the CPC version on my Philips 16/9 CRT screen. It's really awesome !!!

I'll post a screen out of it !

I first saw it on MSX, and I was like "Wow, for the first time those spanish guys made a proper MSX version instead of another rush spectrum port". And then I was amazed when I found out that the original Spectrum game was identical.

Basically the MSX version is a speccy emulator running the speccy version.

Then the Amiga version... what a dissapointment. None of the other versions are as good as the Speccy/MSX one (the CPC one gets close), but the Amiga version was really... bleh.

Well at least, i'll recognize that the game has great graphics on Amiga (that's the least), but yeah the moon like jumps, not really good to see.

Pablo Ariza did the best he could i think.

Should I change the topic title to "Spanish Games" ?

[Shatterhand]

Basically the MSX version is a speccy emulator running the speccy version.

Actually the spanish guys made an effort to make the game run properly on the MSX. I've read more than one interview with different developers from that time, telling how frustating it was for them to have port the games from Spectrum to MSX without using MSX features, but it was the guys on suits who told them to do it like that.... guys from Topo Soft were really thrilled when they let them do a proper MSX games... and the guys from Opera Soft were the only ones who managed to convince the guys with the money to actually do proper MSX versions of their games (shame most of their games were really crap)

And the Topo Soft guys also tried to "sneak" MSX specific features whenever possible ... this reminds of Richard Aplin "sneaking" a better scroll routine for the Amiga version of Final Fight and then guys at US Gold complaining about him wasting time with this.

But really, in case of spanish games, I believe it was a little bit more than just a speccy emulator. I think this was more the case with british games, like Double Dragon, Swiv and ST Dragon, which then were *REALLY* slow on MSX, with no sound and ended up playing like shit.

But not all british developers were like that on MSX, and at least Gremlin Graphics also did some specific MSX games and made a lot of enhancements on their Gauntlet port for MSX.

[Shatterhand]

Also, I don't think an Atari ST->Amiga port automatically makes a bad game. We have to say that Dinamic did some *really* lousy, lazy jobs on this and didn't even bother to update the palettes.

But there are many nice Amiga games that were ST ports.. even if we have to say "it could be better if it has used Amiga specific hardware features", they are still good games on their own... although of course we can still be pissed at them for not using the Amiga hardware properly

Also just rememered Astro Marine Corps on MSX has one difference from the Speccy version: music. The MSX version has only one song that keeps playing all the time (it's the intro music on the speccy). The Spectrum has a dedicated song for ingame, and it's a different one for part 2.

So, kudos for the speccy version for being better

I remember playing AMC on the CPC and for some reason I felt it didn't play as well as the speccy one, but I don't remember why.

[Gzegzolka]

Arctic Moves works in similar way. In first part You have two "run and gun" mission. In second part You explore spaceship and use different terminals.
I wonder if "after the war" was based on arcade game? I hear that once on mame board, people there thinks that first was arcade board with this game and later Italian developers made computer game ports.

[dlfrsilver]

Originally Posted by Shatterhand

Actually the spanish guys made an effort to make the game run properly on the MSX.

The fact is that spanish companies used the same assets for a game, and then they used batteries of hardware emulator to churn out the games for each plateforms.

This way, you end with a speccy emulator for the MSX version of AMC.

the spanish companies really went far about computed ports.

[quote]I've read more than one interview with different developers from that time, telling how frustating it was for them to have port the games from Spectrum to MSX without using MSX features, but it was the guys on suits who told them to do it like that.... guys from Topo Soft were really thrilled when they let them do a proper MSX games... and the guys from Opera Soft were the only ones who managed to convince the guys with the money to actually do proper MSX versions of their games (shame most of their games were really crap).

Opera soft was using tons of hardware emulators, and everything was automatized to make the games for one platform.

Time to port a game from a computer to another : 30 minutes watch on hand.

Yes it was that bad.

And the Topo Soft guys also tried to "sneak" MSX specific features whenever possible ... this reminds of Richard Aplin "sneaking" a better scroll routine for the Amiga version of Final Fight and then guys at US Gold complaining about him wasting time with this.

But really, in case of spanish games, I believe it was a little bit more than just a speccy emulator. I think this was more the case with british games, like Double Dragon, Swiv and ST Dragon, which then were *REALLY* slow on MSX, with no sound and ended up playing like shit.

It's unfortunately a straight spectrum port.

But not all british developers were like that on MSX, and at least Gremlin Graphics also did some specific MSX games and made a lot of enhancements on their Gauntlet port for MSX.

i was not aware of that.

[dlfrsilver]

Originally Posted by Gzegzolka

Arctic Moves works in similar way. In first part You have two "run and gun" mission. In second part You explore spaceship and use different terminals.
I wonder if "after the war" was based on arcade game? I hear that once on mame board, people there thinks that first was arcade board with this game and later Italian developers made computer game ports.

There was thought a version in arcade for After the war, based on the TMS34010, but it never saw the light of the day.

After the war for computers were done in house by dinamic developers (including the famous Hermanos Ruiz, With "Snatcho" as coder).

[Shatterhand]

Look at Opera's Soft Goody, Livingstone and Last Mission for MSX. They are *eons* better than the Spectrum versions, colorfull.. Goody on Spectrum is black and white, on MSX is full of colors!

Gremlin Graphics did Desolator and Valkyr specifically for MSX - Desolator in special is a very, very good game, a defender-inspired shooter. They also ported a lot of their speccy games to MSX doing straight ports that ran at the same speed and had nice music, like Jack the Nipper 1 and 2, Bounder, Krack-Out, Auf Wiedersehen Monty (best 8bits soundtrack ever), etc.

And about Amiga Astro Marine Corps... it's not just the moon-gravity jump. The game feels all around slower and more empty than the 8 bits versions, and WHY, oh my god WHY DO I HAVE TO CHOOSE BETWEEN MUSIC AND SFX? The 8 bits version had a frigging AMAZING, EXCELLENT soundtrack.. and then on the version for the super 16 bits machine, not only I have an inferior music, but also I have to play without SFX to hear it?

Shit, the MSX and the Speccy have just 3 sound channels, Amiga has 4. They should had just mad .mod versions of the freaking awesome songs from the Speccy and you would still have room for sound effects!

Goody on MSX:
[ Show youtube player ]

And then there was even a specific MSX2 version, which is pretty amazing considering the state of the spanish market:
[ Show youtube player ]

[dlfrsilver]

I prefer the CPC version of Goody, it has more colors, and is also the lead version

I have passed the game in tape format for CPC a few days ago