Available now: AmigaOS 3.1.4

[gulliver]

Originally Posted by duga

Looking forward to proof read your (Swedish) translation before release. It's better to have no translation than a bad translation.

You are more than welcome to do that.

Just PM and I will give you my email so that we get in touch, and then you can catch any mistake and I can rectify it. The more eyes the merrier.

[tom256]

Originally Posted by gulliver

....
We don't see 3.1.4.1 as the end of the road, but just a step forward in a long road ahead. We have lots of ideas and projects.
....

When can we expect 3.1.4.1?

[gulliver]

Originally Posted by tom256

When can we expect 3.1.4.1?

This is a difficult question to answer, and I will explain you why:

We already have the core of the update in place, but we still need to iron out a few more bugs, build the locales along with their fixes, test the deployment process, and send the finished project to Hyperion.

And all these jobs depend on our spare time that we have to spend in these tasks, which of course, varies from person to person within our team due to job, commitments, personal issues, and life in general.

So this is why it is difficult to give you a proper estimate.

[Hewitson]

Whatever. A huge problem with the Shell still hasn't been addressed. An update should have been made immediately, yet buggy kickstart roms are still being sold at an exorbitant rate.

Who do you guys think you are? Microsoft?

[kolla]

Microsoft have updates every Tuesday, so I don't think so

[kolla]

Originally Posted by gulliver

The NDA is nothing more than a commitment that I won't divulge any internal secret without prior permission.

So it is a "carte blanche" type NDA with no specifics, where "internal secret" can be defined by Hyperion at any given time. Exactly what I thought.

You are still working for free with nothing in return, but making a good economic favor to Hyperion.

I doubt that anyone buy OS 3.1.4 because of my locales.

And then you are also paying them a license to be able to have 3.1.4.

Note that I only have one copy, the 68000 one, and also the "original" one, where Hyperion claims all rights (which Olsen says was a simple mistake, but a mistake that nevertheless also spread to the labels of the floppies distributed - quite impressive for a revision back-roll mistake!)

When I bought OS 3.1.4, there was no software license to be read prior to buying, and when I read the license that came alone, I realised I can not use the copy I bought on the system I bought it for, without breaking the software license. But everyone keeps telling me that "software licenses is just legal mumbujumbo to be ignored anyways". The license also requires that I set my locales according to my location, but then it also became apparent that the translation was terrible. Well, to fix that, I broke another portion of the software license.. "decompile, reverse engineer, disassemble, modify". Since I am breaking the license east and west to just be able to use the damn OS, I asked Hyperion on the forum to clarify their license, something they of course will never answer to. Hyperion never answer to anything, except if it is to help someone buy something from them. Well, I have 9 more Amiga systems that could benefit from OS 3.1.4, and I had all intentions of buying one copy for each system, but as things are what they are, with buggy kickstarts etc, I am not buying any more copies.

1. Early access to AmigaOS releases and betas.

Rather worthless, as we are all beta testers here.

2. Free AmigaOS for all Amiga models, not just one set.

It's not "Free", it's at best "For free", which is something else. Besides, there are not really "sets", it's mostly about what scsi.device that is in the kickstart. For "most users" it's the gayle IDE, and most "big box" users boot from third party disk controllers anyways, right?

3. I also participate on the development path the OS takes.

I doubt it, that's probably more of an illusion and your suggestions are mostly "voted down" by experts.

4. I have access to exclusive AmigaOS content that is not part of releases.

If it is not part of the releases, it is also not AmigaOS content, and also not very interesting. Or are you saying that there is a "different" AmigaOS for "insiders" only?

5. I get to meet very interesting people.

No doubt, but so do I and everyone else - have you ever been to larger software conferences?

6. I learn a lot from other developers and testers.

As can anyone.

7. I get to know more details about the history and internals of AmigaOS since I can see the sourcecode.

I also see the sourcecode, it has become mandatory since documentation of the OS is lacking and the developer(s) find more satisfaction in writing essays about his struggles with the code that no-one is allowed to see, rather than writing pragmatic documentation that would help end users.

8. I get to practice other languages I know by doing translations, so that I don't get rusty on them.

That's of little value, as the context offered is very limited. There are some very weird translations here and there, that shows that the translator was not in touch with the context of the original text. For example, the Norwegian translation used "Amerikansk brev" for the paper size known as "US letter", which is rather hilarious. Note also that English is the *only* Germanic language that split words, so whenever you see that in Danish, Icelandic, Swedish, Norwegian, German, Dutch, Luxembourgish etc - those are mistakes (https://de.wikipedia.org/wiki/Leerzeichen_in_Komposita) The Norwegian translator contacted me on IRC (after seeing my complaints) and his main excuses was that "gadgets" (text fields) were too tiny for Norwegian strings - but it doesn't really help when one insist on adding lots of bogus spaces in the strings. Also - Thesaurus - use them, use short and precise local words over elaborate latin based words - Norwegian "sesjon" is not the same as English "session", avoid "false friends". And look at other operating systems, what strings are "standard", KDE has very good translations of the Norwegian languages at least. Translate the message, not the words - don't translate word for word, especially in "help texts". Choose short precise sentences over long elaborate essays. Be consistent - make up your mind about what to call it... drawers, folders, directories. Sigh...

9. I can develop something I like.

As long as Hyperion permits. What will you do the day Hyperion no longer permits (or are no longer permitted) releasing OS 3.1.4....? You go back to assembling unofficial "boing bags" with binaries you find wherever, like you used to?

So from my point of view, I am well compensated, within my hobby.

Let me remind you what you wrote earlier.

It sucks, but there is nothing I can do about it.

And believe me, I am the first to complain. I am having lots of headaches.

very few people want to really help

I do not impose those crappy conditions

I hate them nonetheless.

It is tedious work

Oh, a little OT - I see that "head honcho" Apollo Core developer Gunnar, is promoting pirated OS 3.9 over OS 3.1.4 for new users.
(http://www.apollo-core.com/knowledge...19752&z=gEATjd)

Originally Posted by gulliver

You should ask Hyperion directly for their plans and susteinability if you really want to know.

I can tell you that we, as a team have lots of plans looking forward. And if Hyperion interests and ours are able to be somehow aligned, things can be good for everyone involved.

Again, understand this, money is not a driving issue for us. Not because we are rich people or something like that. We make our living doing other things. Of course, everyone would love to earn money testing/developing AmigaOS, but we primarily do what we do because we enjoy the Amiga, it is our hobby and passion. Our fuel and incentive comes from there.

If we were only looking for making money, I am sure we would all be testing/developing in another more mainstream platform, certainly not the Amiga.

We don't see 3.1.4.1 as the end of the road, but just a step forward in a long road ahead. We have lots of ideas and projects.

We are happy about what we achieved so far, but this had fed our ambitions and propels us to seek for more.

We want more.

Sound like a good prospect. Have fun on the journey.

[gulliver]

@kolla

Thank you for your detailed excuses and for taking words out of context, it makes for an entertaining read.

[kolla]

There are no excuses, I have nothing to excuse.

[gulliver]

Originally Posted by Syntrax

Sound like a good prospect. Have fun on the journey.

Thank you.

@kolla

Ok then.

[Hewitson]

Originally Posted by kolla

Oh, a little OT - I see that "head honcho" Apollo Core developer Gunnar, is promoting pirated OS 3.9 over OS 3.1.4 for new users.

Well, at least the Shell works.

[Gorf]

@ kolla

The license also requires that I set my locales according to my location,...

What?
Can you cite this paragraph?

This is alone would render the whole OS useless:
imagine you travel to Hungary with your Amiga and than you are required to change locals to your location...

[kolla]

Do no-one read the damn software license?

http://www.hyperion-entertainment.co...88-amigaos-314

2. Permitted Uses and Restrictions. This License allows you to install and use the AmigaOS on a single computer at a time. This License does not allow the AmigaOS to exist on more than one computer at a time. This license allows you to install or operate the AmigaOS only on a computer system that had a version of AmigaOS installed on it at the time you acquired such computer system, which was especially prepared for running AmigaOS through the use of a dedicated (flash)rom or similar mechanism or for which a legitimate version of AmigaOS was or is available. You may make one copy of the AmigaOS in machine-readable form for backup purposes only. The backup copy must include all copyright information contained on the original. You are required to select the appropriate "Locale" setting based on the location where you will be operating the AmigaOS. Except as expressly permitted in this License or by law, you may not decompile, reverse engineer, disassemble, modify, rent, lease, loan, sublicense, distribute or create derivative works based upon the AmigaOS in whole or part or transmit the AmigaOS over a network or from one computer to another. THE AMIGAOS IS NOT INTENDED FOR USE IN THE OPERATION OF NUCLEAR FACILITIES, AIRCRAFT NAVIGATION, COMMUNICATION SYSTEMS, OR AIR TRAFFIC CONTROL MACHINES IN WHICH CASE THE FAILURE OF THE AMIGAOS COULD LEAD TO DEATH, PERSONAL INJURY, OR SEVERE PHYSICAL OR ENVIRONMENTAL DAMAGE. Your rights under this License will terminate automatically without notice from Hyperion if you fail to comply with any term(s) of this License.

I underlined parts that I find vague or questionable.

[Hewitson]

Originally Posted by Gorf

This is alone would render the whole OS useless

We've already established it's useless, haven't we?

[Gorf]

This License does not allow the AmigaOS to exist on more than one computer at a time

Since someone already installed AmigaOS, it can not exist anywhere else in the world.
So basically Hyperion could have sold only ONE SINGLE ROM, according to their own license agreement.

only on a computer system that had a version of AmigaOS installed on it at the time you acquired such computer system...

so no luck for Phoenix, Rejuvenator, GBA ...

The backup copy must include all copyright information contained on the original..

so no backup for your installation, unless you waste space ...

You are required to select the appropriate "Locale" setting based on the location where you will be operating the AmigaOS.

good luck on your travels...

you may not decompile, reverse engineer, disassemble, modify,

So no patches at all. But many are still vital.
And you are not allowed to apply any future bugfix-patches.

or transmit the AmigaOS over a network or from one computer to another.

No way of making a backup to my backup server.
Hyperion must stop the digital download version at once.

OK - now it is official: completely useless pile of zeros and ones.

[DamienD]

Thread moved from the News section as there's too much rubbish going on; and this dosn't need to be in the headlines across the "abime.net" network...

[kolla]

For some of my machines, I use tftp (http://aminet.net/package/comm/tcp/sana2-tftpclient) to "transmit" kickstarts, kickstart modules etc from my tftp server to the Amiga on bootup. Clearly another violation of the software license.

[roondar]

Originally Posted by kolla

For some of my machines, I use tftp (http://aminet.net/package/comm/tcp/sana2-tftpclient) to "transmit" kickstarts, kickstart modules etc from my tftp server to the Amiga on bootup. Clearly another violation of the software license.

That scheme would almost certainly be a violation of the original license by Commodore as well, or in fact most commercial licenses currently in existence.

It would technically be illegal even for quite a few open/free software licenses given that a number of them (definitely including GPL in any of its versions) require you to reproduce the license agreement in an easy to access user-readable form alongside any copy you make

I will admit it's unlikely to be seen as a problem for most people using such a license, but the text of (for instance) the GPL 3.0 makes it crystal clear you need to include the license text itself alongside any copy you make of a program covered by it:

Originally Posted by GPL 3.0

...provided that you conspicuously and appropriately publish on each copy an appropriate copyright notice; keep intact all notices stating that this License and any non-permissive terms added in accord with section 7 apply to the code; keep intact all notices of the absence of any warranty; and give all recipients a copy of this License along with the Program...

Note: my point here is not that the Hyperion license is good by the way, it's more that most licenses are not as permissive as some people might like.

[Gorf]

And in case someone missed the obvious:

You are NOT allowed to run it in an emulator like (Win)UAE.

This license allows you to install or operate the AmigaOS only on a computer system that had a version of AmigaOS installed on it at the time you acquired such computer system, which was especially prepared for running AmigaOS through the use of a dedicated (flash)rom or similar mechanism or for which a legitimate version of AmigaOS was or is available.

[roondar]

Originally Posted by Gorf

And in case someone missed the obvious:

You are NOT allowed to run it in an emulator like (Win)UAE.

That's not entirely true. Amiga Forever comes with several "legitimate versions of Amiga OS" and as such should be a valid target.

In fact, as long as a license holder of any version of Amiga OS sells (or gifts) you a "legitimate version of AmigaOS" aimed at use in an emulator you should be fine, given the text ends with that whole "or for which a legitimate version of AmigaOS was or is available." bit.