CD32 Cartridge games ;-)

[eXeler0]

Wait what? Cartridge games for the CD32?

It's an old, crazy idea that has been in the back of my head ever since the days of Doom coming to SNES using the SuperFX2 chip.. so basically "cheating".. and giving SNES nerds a chance to claim their "vanilla" SNES can run Doom while Amiga can't ;-)
So why couldn't we (Amigans) cheat then.. Sure, theoretically you could throw in an accelerator into the CD32 and then run Doom..
But the idea here is to hide the fact you're basically packaging an accelerator and a game into that looks like a cartridge so that you can casually pop it into any vanilla CD32 and it boots the game.

So with stuff like PiStorm, EMU68, recent release of Raspberry Pi 5, I'm thinking it should be possible to create a PiStorm based card / cartridge that runs on a RBPi 5 and autoboots/load something like Quake 2 running at high frame rates on what looks like a vanilla CD32. ;-) Put it in a 3d printed case and put some professional sticker on it so that it looks like a cartridge (Hey should still be smaller than NeoGeo carts ;-) )

This isn't about making sense, or being a financially sound idea, I'm just interested in finding out it its doable and what it would take.

*Pistorm32 for the CD32 would be a good start.
*PCB design that doesnt require to many parts or adapters. Layout so that it can fit inside a CD32 like the FMV module.
*Firmware to config and autostart a game.
*Now, obviously to make this look legit we still need to output video and sound through the CD32 outputs.

Of course once done, it could easily be "replicated" for other demanding games that wouldn't run otherwise.

[Photon]

So the goal is to run a not-console game inside a console, without using the console hardware? XD Or did I misunderstand your vision.

And require downloading firmware updates and open the console (or make holes in the case) while still keeping the case to cover the non-Amiga component and unused Amiga components?

I just wonder if you actually want to own a CD32, or everything is wrong with and you want to own a generic 'multi-emu' like the others. You could do that without modding much more than for the HDMI cable sticking out.

[eXeler0]

Originally Posted by Photon

So the goal is to run a not-console game inside a console, without using the console hardware? XD Or did I misunderstand your vision.

And require downloading firmware updates and open the console (or make holes in the case) while still keeping the case to cover the non-Amiga component and unused Amiga components?

I just wonder if you actually want to own a CD32, or everything is wrong with and you want to own a generic 'multi-emu' like the others. You could do that without modding much more than for the HDMI cable sticking out.

Im pretty sure you misunderstood. :-)
First of all I own 21 Amigas and 3 of those are CD32s.

My vision to create a cartridge you can pop into any CD32 and it will autorun whatever is on that cartridge. To get more power it eould be based on something like emu68 / pistor32 / cm4 or it could be a Vampire v4 based system. (more expensive)

Its a ”because you can” project, not that it makes any sense from most other angles.

[alexh]

Originally Posted by eXeler0

*PCB design that doesnt require to many parts or adapters. Layout so that it can fit inside a CD32 like the FMV module.

This is practical but it will "stick out a bit" like all CD32 risers. Even the FMV module sticks out a bit.

Originally Posted by eXeler0

*Pistorm32 for the CD32 would be a good start.

I believe (but I am not 100% sure) that PiStorm32 is incompatible with the CD32 at the moment. It doesn't support bus arbitration required to co-exist with the AKIKO chip inside CD32. I might be wrong as the AKIKO might not be a DMA master (but I thought the CD-ROM controller was). The CDTV's DMAC used for it's CD-ROM is definitely incompatible with the current PiStorm.

[Bruce Abbott]

Originally Posted by eXeler0

I own 21 Amigas and 3 of those are CD32s.

Hoarder!

[Lord Aga]

So that's where all European Amigas went to

[eXeler0]

Originally Posted by Bruce Abbott

Hoarder!

Glad you didn’t see the rest of my stuff ;-)

[Photon]

Originally Posted by eXeler0

Im pretty sure you misunderstood. :-)
First of all I own 21 Amigas and 3 of those are CD32s.

My vision to create a cartridge you can pop into any CD32 and it will autorun whatever is on that cartridge. To get more power it eould be based on something like emu68 / pistor32 / cm4 or it could be a Vampire v4 based system. (more expensive)

Its a ”because you can” project, not that it makes any sense from most other angles.

You're free to do what you want to your Amiga collection, ofc. Non-Amiga in Amiga case is done before, but the 68k emulation would have to be patched, or code written for a custom Kickstart to identify the cartridge would have to be written to auto-start it.

If mapped to the expansion bus, ROM space is limited to 512K, and code is running from early boot mode. This means the software in the ROM must also have code similar to what's in the Kickstart to properly initialize and use the Amiga hardware.

You would probably run into problems saving games, since the CD32 didn't finish booting.

To distribute the game, you would have to make a physical PCB, populate it, and burn/flash a ROM with the code for it.

Those are the problems I see with it, while CDs replaced carts on consoles eventually. I for one celebrate the fact that Amiga was first, and the CD32 was a banger of a release at the time. It just didn't survive the strange time - like many other consoles, I should point out.

This to say that even if you put a superfast CPU in your Amiga instead of the real CPU, or an RPi in the cart itself, using the motherboard to "funnel" the game causes problems in no way related to the excellent design of the hardware. Consoles were cheap and limited and the Amiga is the best computer. You can blame consoles for being cheap and limited, but to blame Amiga for not being a console is to ask to degrade it to nothing so you can replace it with another platform (e.g. chips in carts).

[eXeler0]

Originally Posted by Lord Aga

So that's where all European Amigas went to

Mostly, yes :-)

[eXeler0]

@Photon (& @alexh)
Im hoping theres a better way. It should not require a custom rom or the whole thing falls apart. It needs to work on vanilla cd32 or its a no go.
Whatever is on the cartridge should probably ”pretend to be a CD” so that it would boot like any CD game.
How exactly that would be done though, I have no idea… yet ;-)
It’s very possible that more work needs to be done on the Pistorm/Emu68 side to make it play nicely with a cd32 and after that maybe it gets a lot easier.

[Cobe]

Why would it have to pretend to be a cd? It can boot to ide.

[eXeler0]

Originally Posted by Cobe

Why would it have to pretend to be a cd? It can boot to ide.

Whatever is easiest and works

[redblade]

That's why I was wondering if there were hardware schematics to turn the A500 into a arcade machine with Jamma and maybe a 3-4 button joystick input (1P, + 2 action, or 1P + 3 action) and maybe the Metro Siege authors would release a ROM version of their game for $100 for commercial use, so people can make money of the game converting A500s as a arcade machine.

[eXeler0]

Originally Posted by redblade

That's why I was wondering if there were hardware schematics to turn the A500 into a arcade machine with Jamma and maybe a 3-4 button joystick input (1P, + 2 action, or 1P + 3 action) and maybe the Metro Siege authors would release a ROM version of their game for $100 for commercial use, so people can make money of the game converting A500s as a arcade machine.

That would be pretty neat, Amiga powered Arcade in 2024 ;-)

[S0ulA55a551n]

It wasn't the SNES that started this, this has happened since the beginning of the NES. The NES was not that capable and they have been adding extra hardware to the cartridges from pretty much the first day.

I quite like this is an idea. Maybe if you can go with lowest spec PI you would be looking at similar price per cartridge as cartridges back in the day

[eXeler0]

Btw, Ive been a Patreon supporter for Emu68 for a while, Ill ask Michal about PiStorm and CD32 status ;-)
Maybe if I throw in a €€€ bounty on top ;-)

[khph_re]

Would be fun to see what could be done with a Pi Zero W 2.
Easily small and inexpensive enough to hide in a cart.

I'd often hoped someone would do a modern sidecar expansion for the A500 using one.

[eXeler0]

Originally Posted by khph_re

Would be fun to see what could be done with a Pi Zero W 2.
Easily small and inexpensive enough to hide in a cart.

I'd often hoped someone would do a modern sidecar expansion for the A500 using one.

Niklas is not far off
https://github.com/niklasekstrom/a314

[pandy71]

Originally Posted by alexh

I believe (but I am not 100% sure) that PiStorm32 is incompatible with the CD32 at the moment. It doesn't support bus arbitration required to co-exist with the AKIKO chip inside CD32. I might be wrong as the AKIKO might not be a DMA master (but I thought the CD-ROM controller was). The CDTV's DMAC used for it's CD-ROM is definitely incompatible with the current PiStorm.

It can put overlay on top of Amiga video (as FMV module) so it should not be so difficult or render screen and encode it as HAM6/8 - probably doable but i don't see added value unless someone vicious intentions to pretend that CD32 can emulate more powerful systems.

[redblade]

Originally Posted by eXeler0

That would be pretty neat, Amiga powered Arcade in 2024 ;-)

Yes but the problem is it could increase the price of the A500.