Need Help for testing

Lord Riton · 05 April 2011, 15:58

Hello all,

I recently re-wrote my chunky to planar sub-routine for my QON game, and i got badly surprised that it ended beeing slower than my old one.
I suspect this to be the case because i'm on WinUAE. I have a real Amiga 1200 + 68030 + 8MB Ram, but i cannot transfer files between my PC and my amiga. (Well i did it to transfer my whole Amiga HD once but it was a pain in the a.. , had to use another PC).
I would like to ask you, if you have a real Amiga, if you could help me in testing this please. Would be nice to help, thank you.

Test instructions:

Download the file with this link: QON EXECUTABLES

unzip them where ever you want, but keep the repertory structure like it is in the zip file.

- Launch Qon2011old,
- choose "LARGE" screen size (even if you have a slow Amiga, doesn't matter)
- choose "EDITOR" mode, and push the START buton.
- push "Load level" and choose "Nargoth" (with a left mouse click on it)
- push "Continue with that level"
- push "Move in 3D" without moving the mouse button, this is important to be sure both tests are done for the exact same view.
- Wait at least a minute without moving the mouse and without pushing any key, then note the 2nd number that you see at the botom of the 3D view. It's the averadge framerate since you have hit the "Move in 3D" button.
- Repeat this with Qon2011new
- tell me both numbers you got and if possible what Amiga you used (processor, MHz, memory)

Thanks in advance.

I will start the test:

Test Results:

- Qon2011old = 24.1 fps
- Qon2011new = 16.6 fps

On my PC with WinUAE

Djay · 05 April 2011, 16:46

No problems I can transfer and test... Check my sig for my Amiga specs

daxb · 05 April 2011, 18:27

A1200 040/40 32MB:

- Qon2011old = 3,9 fps
- Qon2011new = 3,6 fps

DDNI · 05 April 2011, 19:19

using classicwbFULL on my OS3.1 A1230 50mhz machine.

Initially files were not executable. Fixed this in .info
Running the files from a fully loaded WB the first screen shows up but with a grey background and yellow buttons I select large and editor then hit start. Mouse pointer freezes and needs a reset.
Running from prompt with wb loaded without SCALOS, forst screen loads but with a grey background and yellow buttons I choose Large and editor then hit start nothing happens. mouse pointer does not freeze. Need reset though.

Will keep testing

Edit. Running from prompt and it works. If however I use wbrun from the prompt, I get the same crash as above.

Qon2011old = 3.2 fps
Qon2011new = 3.5 fps

not that much difference between my 030 fps and 040. Chipset must be the limiting factor....?

Lord Riton · 05 April 2011, 20:18

Quote:

Originally Posted by DDNI

Initially files were not executable. Fixed this in .info
Running the files from a fully loaded WB the first screen shows up but with a grey background and yellow buttons I select large and editor then hit start. Mouse pointer freezes and needs a reset.
Running from prompt with wb loaded without SCALOS, forst screen loads but with a grey background and yellow buttons I choose Large and editor then hit start nothing happens. mouse pointer does not freeze. Need reset though.

I got this problem too today. I don't know from where it comes. I tought it comes from my new devpac 3 assembling, so i used my devpac 2, uploaded the zip, then it worked. But guess it's still not working for everyone, hmm, weird..

Anyway, thanks for testing, and the fact that you got better results with QON2011new makes me a bit happy at least

even if DaxB got better results from QON2011old apparently.

rockersuke · 05 April 2011, 20:45

Hi there!

Amiga 1200 KS 3.1 with Blizzard 1230 MKIV 50 MHz + 64 Mb Fast RAM (It's got a FPU, but since you don't mention that Nargoth uses it, I guess it's not relevant)

OLD -> 3.3
NEW -> 3.5

Launching from Workbench in a plain 3.1 setup I've had no issues at all.
By the way, never played with this before, and I must say I'm totally impressed!

--

BippyM · 05 April 2011, 20:51

Ermmmm... I don't want to sound like a bit of a weasle but 3fps on an 040... Is this for GFX card end machines or WinUAE???

Lord Riton I believe you should ditch this and do that new game you have been on about.. You know the Captive/DM style!

gimbal · 05 April 2011, 21:03

Quote:

Originally Posted by bippym

Lord Riton I believe you should ditch this and do that new game you have been on about.. You know the Captive/DM style!

LOL. Bippy isn't in any way biased you know.

Its the game development process Bipstah. First make it work, then make it work fast.

BippyM · 05 April 2011, 21:05

gimbal.. Lord Riton himself has said this

gimbal · 05 April 2011, 21:15

I know I know, I'm a participant of that thread also. But I won't pass up a chance to poke and prod.

BippyM · 05 April 2011, 21:17

just keep your poking and prodding clean

Lord Riton · 05 April 2011, 21:18

Quote:

Originally Posted by rockersuke

Hi there!

Amiga 1200 KS 3.1 with Blizzard 1230 MKIV 50 MHz + 64 Mb Fast RAM (It's got a FPU, but since you don't mention that Nargoth uses it, I guess it's not relevant)

OLD -> 3.3
NEW -> 3.5

Launching from Workbench in a plain 3.1 setup I've had no issues at all.
By the way, never played with this before, and I must say I'm totally impressed!

--

Thank you for testing, and also thank you for the "right" results i wanted to see

NathanTolbert · 05 April 2011, 21:18

A4000D 060 @ 50MHz

Old - 4.1
New - 5.0

Looks very nice though.
On WinUAE it ran over 100 in both.

Lord Riton · 05 April 2011, 21:20

Quote:

Originally Posted by bippym

Ermmmm... I don't want to sound like a bit of a weasle but 3fps on an 040... Is this for GFX card end machines or WinUAE???

Lord Riton I believe you should ditch this and do that new game you have been on about.. You know the Captive/DM style!

Well, let's hope this night someone comes and just erazes qon from my HD, then you could be sure i would definituvely go to that DM style game

Oh, wait, i saved the sources on sourgeforge, ah well, no luck

Quote:

Originally Posted by NathanTolbert

A4000D 060 @ 50MHz

Old - 4.1
New - 5.0

Looks very nice though.
On WinUAE it ran over 100 in both.

Wow ! impressive, you are sure you did not mixup old and new tests ? if this is confirmed i'm a really really happy guy

I was sure that new routine was better, and that WinUAE just lied to me

BippyM · 05 April 2011, 21:23

hehehe sorry I didn't mean to sound rude, I know this is a labour of love for you.. I just don't see the point at those FPS's...

Still you might get some magic going and get it running 12fps+

nujack · 05 April 2011, 21:32

Here are my results, tested on A4000/060 with 50MHz:

Qon2011old = 6.7 fps
Qon2011new = 7.2 fps

There is no difference if you start the executable from Harddisk or FastRam(same values).
So Qon2011new is a little bit faster. BTW there is now a nice dungeon in that version.

Lord Riton · 05 April 2011, 21:43

Quote:

Originally Posted by bippym

hehehe sorry I didn't mean to sound rude, I know this is a labour of love for you.. I just don't see the point at those FPS's...

Still you might get some magic going and get it running 12fps+

NP, i agree that 4 fps is not really enjoyable for a 3D action game. But this will not be an action game, you will move in 3D yes, but the combat will be 2D, heroes of might and magic strategic style. Also there will be NPCs with dialogs of quests , story, and such. Still, i know most people would not want to play it simply because it's that slow. Don't forget there are 3 view sizes, and personnaly on my 030 that goes only at 28Mhz, i would enjoy it at the medium screen size.
But anyway, there is WinUAE, and you can easily get 50 fps on this one if you're not happy with your real Amiga

Why is it that slow ? a fiew years agoo i would have said: because i suck and am not a pro

Now my answer changed a bit: i still suck, but the hires mode did help a lot to slow it even more down. Hires mode does not only mean you have to draw 2x more amount for the same screen size than on a loRes screen, but just the fact that the hires mode is active slows even more down the process of drawing on the screen, because hires does slow down chip memory even more than it already is. Ah well, next time i'll go lores

Quote:

Originally Posted by nujack

Here are my results, tested on A4000/060 with 50MHz:

Qon2011old = 6.7 fps
Qon2011new = 7.2 fps

There is no difference if you start the executable from Harddisk or FastRam(same values).
So Qon2011new is a little bit faster. BTW there is now a nice dungeon in that version.

Nice, thank you

nujack · 05 April 2011, 21:54

No problem. Please continue with the development of QON. I like it!!!

rockersuke · 05 April 2011, 21:59

Quote:

Originally Posted by bippym

hehehe sorry I didn't mean to sound rude, I know this is a labour of love for you.. I just don't see the point at those FPS's...

Still you might get some magic going and get it running 12fps+

It all relies on perspective, as usual

3.x FPS at large size means you are going to average double than that in medium, and that itself is not only way smoother but also looks a lot nicer than similar early 90's commercial attempts as Legends Of Valour perform in my machine with the same acceleration, which is more than OK for a RPG stye game. It's the same performance you would expect for a 386 era PC, which is fairly reasonable if targetting 68030 Amigas.

Anyway I see there is a topic for QoN at the game factory sub-forum, so I'm surely repeating topics here! ^_^'

--

NathanTolbert · 06 April 2011, 05:45

Quote:

Originally Posted by Lord Riton

Wow ! impressive, you are sure you did not mixup old and new tests ? if this is confirmed i'm a really really happy guy

I was sure that new routine was better, and that WinUAE just lied to me

No, I just double tested it. If I don't move around and let it level off, the frame rates are as such

Old - 4.8
New - 6.5

If I run them in the small window I get the following

Old - 16.7
New - 18.4

I haven't tried the medium window yet. Maybe I'll do that tomorrow.

05 April 2011, 15:58	#1
Lord Riton Registered User Join Date: Jan 2011 Location: France Age: 52 Posts: 507	Need Help for testing Hello all, I recently re-wrote my chunky to planar sub-routine for my QON game, and i got badly surprised that it ended beeing slower than my old one. I suspect this to be the case because i'm on WinUAE. I have a real Amiga 1200 + 68030 + 8MB Ram, but i cannot transfer files between my PC and my amiga. (Well i did it to transfer my whole Amiga HD once but it was a pain in the a.. , had to use another PC). I would like to ask you, if you have a real Amiga, if you could help me in testing this please. Would be nice to help, thank you. Test instructions: Download the file with this link: QON EXECUTABLES unzip them where ever you want, but keep the repertory structure like it is in the zip file. - Launch Qon2011old, - choose "LARGE" screen size (even if you have a slow Amiga, doesn't matter) - choose "EDITOR" mode, and push the START buton. - push "Load level" and choose "Nargoth" (with a left mouse click on it) - push "Continue with that level" - push "Move in 3D" without moving the mouse button, this is important to be sure both tests are done for the exact same view. - Wait at least a minute without moving the mouse and without pushing any key, then note the 2nd number that you see at the botom of the 3D view. It's the averadge framerate since you have hit the "Move in 3D" button. - Repeat this with Qon2011new - tell me both numbers you got and if possible what Amiga you used (processor, MHz, memory) Thanks in advance. I will start the test: Test Results: - Qon2011old = 24.1 fps - Qon2011new = 16.6 fps On my PC with WinUAE

05 April 2011, 19:19	#4
DDNI Targ Explorer Join Date: Mar 2006 Location: Northern Ireland Posts: 5,431	using classicwbFULL on my OS3.1 A1230 50mhz machine. Initially files were not executable. Fixed this in .info Running the files from a fully loaded WB the first screen shows up but with a grey background and yellow buttons I select large and editor then hit start. Mouse pointer freezes and needs a reset. Running from prompt with wb loaded without SCALOS, forst screen loads but with a grey background and yellow buttons I choose Large and editor then hit start nothing happens. mouse pointer does not freeze. Need reset though. Will keep testing Edit. Running from prompt and it works. If however I use wbrun from the prompt, I get the same crash as above. Qon2011old = 3.2 fps Qon2011new = 3.5 fps not that much difference between my 030 fps and 040. Chipset must be the limiting factor....? Last edited by DDNI; 05 April 2011 at 19:38.

05 April 2011, 21:32	#16
nujack Zone Friend Join Date: Apr 2005 Location: Leipzig/Germany Age: 49 Posts: 458	Here are my results, tested on A4000/060 with 50MHz: Qon2011old = 6.7 fps Qon2011new = 7.2 fps There is no difference if you start the executable from Harddisk or FastRam(same values). So Qon2011new is a little bit faster. BTW there is now a nice dungeon in that version. Attached Thumbnails Last edited by nujack; 05 April 2011 at 21:43. Reason: Picture added

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05 April 2011, 16:46	#2
Djay 95th User Join Date: May 2001 Location: Brighton/UK Age: 48 Posts: 3,120	No problems I can transfer and test... Check my sig for my Amiga specs

05 April 2011, 18:27	#3
daxb Registered User Join Date: Oct 2009 Location: Germany Posts: 3,303	A1200 040/40 32MB: - Qon2011old = 3,9 fps - Qon2011new = 3,6 fps

05 April 2011, 20:45	#6
rockersuke Registered User Join Date: Mar 2006 Location: Madrid / Spain Age: 56 Posts: 258	Hi there! Amiga 1200 KS 3.1 with Blizzard 1230 MKIV 50 MHz + 64 Mb Fast RAM (It's got a FPU, but since you don't mention that Nargoth uses it, I guess it's not relevant) OLD -> 3.3 NEW -> 3.5 Launching from Workbench in a plain 3.1 setup I've had no issues at all. By the way, never played with this before, and I must say I'm totally impressed! --

05 April 2011, 20:51	#7
BippyM Global Moderator Join Date: Nov 2001 Location: Derby, UK Age: 48 Posts: 9,355	Ermmmm... I don't want to sound like a bit of a weasle but 3fps on an 040... Is this for GFX card end machines or WinUAE??? Lord Riton I believe you should ditch this and do that new game you have been on about.. You know the Captive/DM style!

05 April 2011, 21:05	#9
BippyM Global Moderator Join Date: Nov 2001 Location: Derby, UK Age: 48 Posts: 9,355	gimbal.. Lord Riton himself has said this

05 April 2011, 21:15	#10
gimbal cheeky scoundrel Join Date: Nov 2004 Location: Spijkenisse/Netherlands Age: 42 Posts: 6,905	I know I know, I'm a participant of that thread also. But I won't pass up a chance to poke and prod.

05 April 2011, 21:17	#11
BippyM Global Moderator Join Date: Nov 2001 Location: Derby, UK Age: 48 Posts: 9,355	just keep your poking and prodding clean

05 April 2011, 21:18	#13
NathanTolbert Users Awaiting Email Confirmation Join Date: Jun 2009 Location: Olathe, Kansas Posts: 42	A4000D 060 @ 50MHz Old - 4.1 New - 5.0 Looks very nice though. On WinUAE it ran over 100 in both.

05 April 2011, 21:23	#15
BippyM Global Moderator Join Date: Nov 2001 Location: Derby, UK Age: 48 Posts: 9,355	hehehe sorry I didn't mean to sound rude, I know this is a labour of love for you.. I just don't see the point at those FPS's... Still you might get some magic going and get it running 12fps+

05 April 2011, 21:54	#18
nujack Zone Friend Join Date: Apr 2005 Location: Leipzig/Germany Age: 49 Posts: 458	No problem. Please continue with the development of QON. I like it!!!

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