fs-uae - a new multi-platform amiga emulator for games!

[kire_online]

Scanlines would be awesome.

[FrodeSolheim]

Originally Posted by kire_online

Scanlines would be awesome.

And possibly quite easy to implement, but there are probably several different techniques with different outcome, but chiefly in two categories I suppose: scanlines before, or after, scaling.

I think something like this looks quite nice: http://fengestad.no/fs-uae/scanlines1.png (Gimp-ed image)
(scanlines applied before scaling - every other line is a bit darker, and the other lines are a tiny bit lighter than normal to prevent the overall image to get too dark)
- of course, effect intensity etc could be configurable.

What do other people here think? I don't want to implement X different types of scanline effects ;-)

I was the one who opened an issue for it. Instead of trying to reinvent the wheel, i think it would be easier to implement GLSL ( on windows it's HLSL i think ). That would enable configurable filters that are already available. ( Not sure how much work it would be, but mame / mess use it ).

Shader sources: here and here

[prowler]

Originally Posted by FrodeSolheim

I think something like this looks quite nice: http://fengestad.no/fs-uae/scanlines1.png (Gimp-ed image)
(scanlines applied before scaling - every other line is a bit darker, and the other lines are a tiny bit lighter than normal to prevent the overall image to get too dark)
- of course, effect intensity etc could be configurable.

What do other people here think? I don't want to implement X different types of scanline effects ;-)

Hey, that doesn't just look nice; the whole idea sounds like it could possibly be the best implementation of scanlines ever!

[FrodeSolheim]

Originally Posted by Aequitas

I was the one who opened an issue for it. Instead of trying to reinvent the wheel, i think it would be easier to implement GLSL ( on windows it's HLSL i think ). That would enable configurable filters that are already available. ( Not sure how much work it would be, but mame / mess use it ).

Shader sources: here and here

No, I won't try to reinvent the wheel here -but to have a general purpose shader framework is a bit more work than just loading a pixel shader, which is why I posted the image in the previous post: If something like this is what people want, it can be done quite efficiently (and quickly implemented) on the CPU.

Regarding shaders, it would be GLSL for FS-UAE on all platforms since FS-UAE uses OpenGL on all platforms.

Edit: Of course, if there is a standardized framework for GLSL shaders for such purposes (i.e. the emulator gives the shader a set of specified custom variables to aid the shader, and there is a set of shaders written against this specification), I won't categorically dismiss adding support for it.

Originally Posted by prowler

Hey, that doesn't just look nice; the whole idea sounds like it could possibly be the best implementation of scanlines ever!

?? Possibly true, but not specially clever, and effect described can be implemented without shaders in about 15 minutes.

[prowler]

Originally Posted by FrodeSolheim

?? Possibly true, but not specially clever, and effect described can be implemented without shaders in about 15 minutes.

I didn't say it was clever, but its excellent by virtue of its simplicity and configurability.

Amiga users fall into two categories: those who like scanlines and those who hate them. You'll never get them to agree, so its not worth spending a great deal of time and effort on trying to achieve perfection. And your solution is an ideal one from that point of view.

That's all I meant.

[FrodeSolheim]

Originally Posted by prowler

I didn't say it was clever, but its excellent by virtue of its simplicity and configurability.

Amiga users fall into two categories: those who like scanlines and those who hate them. You'll never get them to agree, so its not worth spending a great deal of time and effort on trying to achieve perfection. And your solution is an ideal one from that point of view.

That's all I meant.

I didn't really mean to imply that you thought it was very clever, just a bit surprised at the good response for such straight-forward method I agree with you -I too like the simplicity with this approach. I would rather implement this quickly than spending hours tweaking some shader code which may or may not (subjectively) give better results, so I would be quite happy if the consensus was that this is good enough.

[prowler]

Originally Posted by FrodeSolheim

I would rather implement this quickly than spending hours tweaking some shader code which may or may not (subjectively) give better results, so I would be quite happy if the consensus was that this is good enough.

That's really what I had in mind as well. I'd be surprised if it wasn't thought to be good enough.

Originally Posted by FrodeSolheim

...just a bit surprised at the good response

You'd better get used to good responses. It's a great job you're doing here.

BTW, sorry for taking my time to reply. It took me a while to spot your edit.

Originally Posted by FrodeSolheim

Of course, if there is a standardized framework for GLSL shaders for such purposes (i.e. the emulator gives the shader a set of specified custom variables to aid the shader, and there is a set of shaders written against this specification), I won't categorically dismiss adding support for it.

I had been looking around a while back for a shader for mame and the one i'm using now is crt.vsh that can be found on banisters i think. I have no idea if there's a shader framework around, never bothered to look at it that much.

The screenshot is looking nice and a holy grail of emulated scanlines doesn't exist by the looks of it, i think it can work out quite nicely

[lesta_smsc]

This project is looking great - can't wait for the netplay beta version to be released!

[chiark]

Another vote for the simple scanline solution. Looks great. And with scaling being something that only comes more and more important as monitor resolutions increase, I think 'scaled scanlines' will make a lot of sense.

[kire_online]

Simple scanlines please, I'd love to give it a go. I suspect your implementation of scanlines before scaling will look awesome on an LCD.

[Pyromania]

@FrodeSolheim

fs-uae is Awesome! Thanx for making it!

[jondel]

Thanks for this great programme,the only thing is that I cannot use either kickstart 300 or 310 images in either Kubuntu 11.10 64bit or Slackware 13.37 32bit.Both images work fine in E-uae.When used, the whole screen locks up mouse not operable. Images 130 and 204 work with no problem.Please help.

[FrodeSolheim]

Simple scanlines it is, then!

Originally Posted by jondel

Thanks for this great programme,the only thing is that I cannot use either kickstart 300 or 310 images in either Kubuntu 11.10 64bit or Slackware 13.37 32bit.Both images work fine in E-uae.When used, the whole screen locks up mouse not operable. Images 130 and 204 work with no problem.Please help.

I test with kickstart 3.1 regularly, so it should work. Please post the log file at ~/.local/share/fs-uae/fs-uae.log (as an attachment to a post, preferably, as it can be quite large).

[jondel]

Thanks for your reply. Attachment added.

[FrodeSolheim]

Originally Posted by jondel

Thanks for your reply. Attachment added.

set option "kickstart_rom_file" to "/home/john/rom/amiga-os-310.rom" (result: 1)
...
Known ROM 'KS ROM v3.1 (A4000)(Cloanto)' loaded
...
drive_insert drv=0x2a097e0 dnum=0 fname=/home/john/ADF1/ fake=0

The problem is that you are loading the kickstart for Amiga 4000 (and UAE "resets" itself continuously). You should use the file amiga-os-310-a1200.rom from Amiga Forever instead.

FS-UAE's interface will soon be completely independent from the emulation thread, so input events would not be blocked in this case - minor planned restructuring).

I also spotted that the floppy in df0 is an invalid file path (but the kickstart is the cause of the problem).

Unrelated Edit: Version 0.9.9beta1 released

* Scanline effect support (see example.conf).
* Added an application icon.
* Associate .fs-uae files with FS-UAE on Mac OS X.
* Can override controller configurations by placing configs files in new FS-UAE/Controllers directory (+ option to configure this directory).
* New configuration option: audio/floppy_drive_volume
* New configuration option: paths/base_dir
* Ported updated caps code from WinUAE.
* New frame limiting logic in libfsemu.
* Use rawinput in Windows for keyboard support.
* Use some keyboard scancodes on other platforms to improve key mapping.

http://fengestad.no/fs-uae/files/fs-...a1-windows.zip
http://fengestad.no/fs-uae/files/fs-...-macosx.tar.gz
http://fengestad.no/fs-uae/files/fs-...ta1-0_i386.deb
http://fengestad.no/fs-uae/files/fs-...a1-0_amd64.deb
http://fengestad.no/fs-uae/files/fs-....9beta1.tar.gz

Check example.conf for how to enable (and tweak) scanlines, but basically:

[video]
scanlines = 1

The scanline effect should look nice in fullscreen mode, but the resolution of the window mode is too small to get a nice result, just so you know -test it in fullscreen! There will probably be a slight moire pattern in menu mode (a consequence of tight horizontal lines rendered in 3D perspective) -this is normal.

[jondel]

Thanks for being so quick with the reply
"The problem is that you are loading the kickstart for Amiga 4000 (and UAE "resets" itself continuously). You should use the file amiga-os-310-a1200.rom from Amiga Forever instead."

The version of Amiga Forever that I have is from 2004 and does not contain the amiga-os-310-a1200.rom.From this page (http://whdload.de/docs/en/need.html) it seems that this was not included until a later version of Amiga Forever,but if your planned restructuring overcomes this then I will wait for your newer version of FS-UAE.

Many thanks for a great programme, at least I have save states working which were not in E-uae.

[FrodeSolheim]

Originally Posted by jondel

The version of Amiga Forever that I have is from 2004 and does not contain the amiga-os-310-a1200.rom.From this page (http://whdload.de/docs/en/need.html) it seems that this was not included until a later version of Amiga Forever,but if your planned restructuring overcomes this then I will wait for your newer version of FS-UAE.

No sorry, the code update I mentioned would only prevent FS-UAE from locking up -the emulation would still not work. You need a A1200 kickstart rom (luckily for me, I have Amiga Forever 2010 )

It is possible amiga-os-310.rom works with A1200 setup in other UAE versions (?), if so, a likely explanation is that FS-UAE does not (currently) emulate a feature A4000 (kickstart) needs. If so, it is possible it will work later, if I work on A4000 compatibility at some point.

[chiark]

Works very well, must admit scanlines works well to my eyes.

Was going to request a way to constrain aspect for fullscreen, but damn it you've already done it! This is working perfectly to emulate my 500 for ECS demos.

Now time to set up a Picasso96 environment and give it a full work out.

To say I'm impressed with the speed you've pulled this together would be an understatement. Tip top work.