FINAL FIGHT (AMIGA) - Sh*t Rated at Last.

[Retro1234]

If you bought it back then yes you would of been happy because it was the best port at the time, once you saw the Snes version later you would notice the cracks.

[nobody]

Snes wasn't great too (no 2p, less colors ), but better than the Amiga.

PS It's weird every now and then someone writes about final fight

[saimon69]

@nobody
Final Fight, Outrun, Street Fighter, Black Tiger, Strider, Rolling Thunder, Double Dragon and Ghouls and Ghosts plus others are in my opinion considered "unfinished business" by the Amigans like me that also loved the games in the arcade, some sort of insult to the platform: is personal!

[d4rk3lf]

Originally Posted by Anubis

On this one I am with Gimbal, at the time many games I could label 'shitty' today were 'fine' for me back in the day.

It HUGELY depends on if you played Final Fight on arcade before, or not.
If you played it (and loved it), FF on the Amiga had NOTHING in common with that gameplay. The biggest issue for me is lacking a grab move (where you grab your opponent and throw it to the other opponents). And there are a lots of other issues.

However, people that were kids at the time, and haven't played FF on arcade, could basically accept this game as a "passable" beat em up. If you accept that mechanic is more like Double Dragon mechanic, and you use flying kick 90% of the time, it could be Ok, I guess.

We have to give Richard Aplin big credit for the game is running on UNEXPANDED Amiga 500 with only 512kb.
However, he didn't liked and played original FF (he said that in some interview), and the lack of proper game mechanic, I guess, that's the reason. If he would like it, I guess, he could have made gameplay much better and closer to FF.

All in all, I am in the legions of Amiga users, that are desperate because there's no single good beat em up on the Amiga (with exception on average Golden Axe), but my souls is now in piece, because of announcement of Metro Siege, that looks like a proper Capcom style beat em up game.

[Konrad]

Well, I grew up with Arcades and was still happy with Final Fight. The flaws were obvious back then of course. But I still found it playable, I had fun with it. Same with Strider or StreetFighter2. All those game were not great but passable for me.
Major letdowns were Outrun and Shinobi for example. Those are a mess.
DoubleDragon2 and ShadowDancer were/are awesome conversions in my opinion.

[BippyM]

I think back in the day if you had played Final Fight on the Amiga, and never played the arcade version (or any other version for that matter) then it might have been decent. The issues arise when it is compared to the source material!

[DamienD]

Originally Posted by Konrad

Well, I grew up with Arcades and was still happy with Final Fight. The flaws were obvious back then of course. But I still found it playable, I had fun with it. Same with Strider or StreetFighter2. All those game were not great but passable for me.
Major letdowns were Outrun and Shinobi for example. Those are a mess.
DoubleDragon2 and ShadowDancer were/are awesome conversions in my opinion.

Just like you I grew up in the Arcades

....and I agree with everything you've said; I'm especially disappointed with Shinobi, as that's my all time favourite Arcade game.

Ghosts 'N Goblins was another awesome conversion.

[jotd]

Conversion of Final Fight isn't very good if you compare with the original version.

But I remember playing this game on amiga and finding it not that bad. Not frustrating, and there aren't that many games like this.

Of course, if you compare with the arcade version, you're very disappointed. But that's not in the same league of other games Zeusdaz reviewed like Running Man or Bad Catz for instance.

Game is still playable & fast, sprites are big (and ripped from the arcade, not redrawn) and it's probably because Richard tried his best on 512K ECS (where a Tiertex conversion would have been even worse).

[mcgeezer]

I doubt tiertex could have actually achieved a conversion of final fight in any playable form.
Richard performed a miracle in my eyes from what he did.

[d4rk3lf]

Originally Posted by Konrad

Major letdowns were Outrun and Shinobi for example. Those are a mess.

What about Rolling Thunder?

btw, another example of a perfect arcade port is Pang.

[Dunny]

Originally Posted by mcgeezer

I doubt tiertex could have actually achieved a conversion of final fight in any playable form.
Richard performed a miracle in my eyes from what he did.

You're a developer; you're thinking in terms of technical achievement. Which is fine, he did indeed pull off the impossible (or nearly so). But from the point of view of someone who loves FinalFight, lives and breathes its intricacies, the game falls very far short of the arcade - not just in understandable graphical fidelity, but with entire gameplay mechanics completely missing.

So from that point of view, it is indeed shit, despite it being technically excellent.



...it's like when I first grabbed a copy of Jet Set Willy II for the Amiga. The Spectrum original was sublime (though not quite as good as JSW1) and the Amiga version had it all - scrolling through rooms, big sprites, colourful graphics, background tiles and music that wasn't a beeper.

The actual game was utter shit though.

[ZEUSDAZ]

Originally Posted by Dunny

You're a developer; you're thinking in terms of technical achievement. Which is fine, he did indeed pull off the impossible (or nearly so). But from the point of view of someone who loves FinalFight, lives and breathes its intricacies, the game falls very far short of the arcade - not just in understandable graphical fidelity, but with entire gameplay mechanics completely missing.

So from that point of view, it is indeed shit, despite it being technically excellent.



...it's like when I first grabbed a copy of Jet Set Willy II for the Amiga. The Spectrum original was sublime (though not quite as good as JSW1) and the Amiga version had it all - scrolling through rooms, big sprites, colourful graphics, background tiles and music that wasn't a beeper.

The actual game was utter shit though.

Hmm, JSW II for the Amiga,...that sounds like a SGT nomination ;-)

[Dunny]

Originally Posted by ZEUSDAZ

Hmm, JSW II for the Amiga,...that sounds like a SGT nomination ;-)

Oh good god yes, but do a side-by-side with the 8bit versions

[Anubis]

Originally Posted by d4rk3lf

It HUGELY depends on if you played Final Fight on arcade before, or not.
If you played it (and loved it), FF on the Amiga had NOTHING in common with that gameplay. The biggest issue for me is lacking a grab move (where you grab your opponent and throw it to the other opponents). And there are a lots of other issues.

However, people that were kids at the time, and haven't played FF on arcade, could basically accept this game as a "passable" beat em up. If you accept that mechanic is more like Double Dragon mechanic, and you use flying kick 90% of the time, it could be Ok, I guess.

We have to give Richard Aplin big credit for the game is running on UNEXPANDED Amiga 500 with only 512kb.
However, he didn't liked and played original FF (he said that in some interview), and the lack of proper game mechanic, I guess, that's the reason. If he would like it, I guess, he could have made gameplay much better and closer to FF.

All in all, I am in the legions of Amiga users, that are desperate because there's no single good beat em up on the Amiga (with exception on average Golden Axe), but my souls is now in piece, because of announcement of Metro Siege, that looks like a proper Capcom style beat em up game.

I agree with everything you've said, and just like mcgeezer pointed out in one of his first posts, I would blame publishing company for not getting a hold of source code. If they were supposed to make good conversion, shouldn't they have resources to stay as accurate as possible?

If that was the case, we would've seen much more quality ports...

[ZEUSDAZ]

Originally Posted by Dunny

Oh good god yes, but do a side-by-side with the 8bit versions

Stick it in the request video then You'll need to place it on the Youtube page, not here.
[ Show youtube player ]

[ZEUSDAZ]

I still don't fully agree that obtaining the scource code would produce vastly better results of conversions, the department could have easily got hold of the arcade machine (or rented it from the likes of Electrocoin) that way they could have had a very good idea of wht the game looks, sounds and moves like, some conversions look as if they only went on a few pictures and then guessed the rest,...Tiertex take note!!!! SF1 looked dreadful, the characters were drawn dreadful and even worse when it came to the animation, surly they could have seen from an arcade machine that the conversion they were doing was sheer shite and poorly resembled the machine.

[DanScott]

So here is the solution....

Somebody else do a version of Final Fight for the 512k Amiga see if you can do better.

BTW, Richard is a long time personal friend of mine since well before when he made FF for the Amiga... he did a great conversion given the resources and time he was given.

[alpine9000]

Originally Posted by DanScott

So here is the solution....

Somebody else do a version of Final Fight for the 512k Amiga see if you can do better.

BTW, Richard is a long time personal friend of mine since well before when he made FF for the Amiga... he did a great conversion given the resources and time he was given.

Having “toyed” with writing a brawler myself recently, I find it absolutely insane that FF Amiga fits in 512kb. I take my hat off to Richard. Absolutely amazing job. And the time frame sounds equally as crazy.

[Shatterhand]

I've seen Richard Aplin saying more than once he never liked Final Fight or the Double Dragons game, that he finds them "boring" or something to that effect.

This makes me believe he didn't get what made those games good. Amiga Double Dragon 2 is a much better effort but STILL has serious issues on the gameplay department.

The work he did on Final Fight is amazing, fitting that on 512kb is a friggin miracle and the game moves a fair amount of big stuff very smoothly on screen.

The thing is not getting the gameplay right. And this has nothing to do with "Lazyness" or not being an acomplished programmer. I really feel that what got cut wasn't a case of "This isn't possible to do", but more "I'll cut this because its not important for the game to work so I can focus on another stuff"... while it was.


Smaller graphics with the whole moveset and combos would be a lot better. But then of course he would need someone to port the graphics (instead of ripping them off the arcade board - another technically amazing job he did) and so proper support from US Gold which would never happen (They didn't even give him music to play ingame as he asked).

In a side note, he said he really loved arcade Shinobi and he would get back to play it even after he had finished work on its ports. This really shows in his CPC Port which is a great game for the system.

[d4rk3lf]

Yeah.
That's the impression I also have.
He just don't like these games, and didn't understood the mechanics.
Too bad, because with a few gameplay tweaks, FF on Amiga could have been much better.