Zeus68k – Accelerator/IDE/RAM for the A500/2000/CDTV and others

[qrulf]

Hi, I would like to declare interest as well!

[Mr B]

Jimbob, i guess i should have added [Irony][/Irony] but i honestly thought the

Originally Posted by Mr B

We are just bored out of our mind, and talk about the effect of over-clocking the physical CPU as if it would matter.

Dude, please. Read the thread again.

whould have made the irony-tag's over the top.

Sim085, your post i just don't get at all.

[p@rity]

interested in 1.

[Sim085]

Originally Posted by Mr B

Sim085, your post i just don't get at all.
B!

It means I am *embarrassed* for not understand the seemingly simple fact that the 68SEC000 is not emulated but a real processor. When I read that the board used FPGA I immediately concluded (wrongly) that the processor was emulated. To my defence I did admit before hand that I understood very little of hardware and was only asking to understand a little bit more. Sorry for pissing you so much

[Mr B]

Oh, ya didn't piss me off. I just figured if you didn't figure out that the 68000 was a real CPU rather then a emulated one, then what else did ya miss out on. This seams like a cute bit of tech, and even tho i'm not in the target group for one, lacking the host hardware, i'm going to keep an eye on it, just to see the tech porn.

[TotO]

The more promising card for Amigamers!

[lurch]

Very interesting, wonder how this compares to the ACA520? Anyway very interested depending on final cost.

But could make a nice xmas present :-)

[duga]

Originally Posted by lurch

Very interesting, wonder how this compares to the ACA520? Anyway very interested depending on final cost.

But could make a nice xmas present :-)

It's nowadays known as ACA500.

[Mr B]

Originally Posted by lurch

Very interesting, wonder how this compares to the ACA520?

Seeing as this is 7/50MHz, and the ACA500 is 14MHz, you take a guess? (Both being 68000)
The ACA500 isn't as much a CPU upgrade as it's a extender making it possible to hook up a ACA123X accelerator to the A500. So out of the box it's not equipped with a lot of memory, or a fast CPU.
If one intends to try and get their A500 even faster, then the ACA500 is the "only" option, where as the Zeus68k is the better kit on it's own. Well, at least on paper.

[ikonsgr]

This is how i see it so far:
Zeus68k: Turn your old granny amiga 500 to an Amiga 3000 level machine, for ... "SERIOUS" work!

ACA 500 : Run whdload from sd card on amiga 500 as cheap as possible!

If you notice the specs of aca 500 is EXACTLY that! They give you the minimum you will need, for whdload usage on amiga 500!
As for the ability to use amiga 1200 accelerator cards on amiga 500 using aca 500 as a "bridge" for that, imho is a little too far streched! Why give 100's of euros to beef up an amiga 500, when ,with the same kind of money you can have an AGA 1200 based system, with accelerator?
On the other hand, zeus68k has MUCH more horse power and memory (to be precise is EXACTLY "4X aca 500": same cpu in 4X clock speed, 4X amount of memory!) ,and for that i believe it will be more expensive than aca 500, and also it will give the amiga 500, a more "professional" profile.

[TotO]

The ACA500 only get 1MB of slow RAM. Is enough for WHDLoad ???
The Zeus68k look more promising for an Amiga 500.

[duga]

Originally Posted by TotO

The ACA500 only get 1MB of slow RAM. Is enough for WHDLoad ???

No slow ram at all. I suppose you mean chip ram?

[TotO]

Originally Posted by duga

No slow ram at all. I suppose you mean chip ram?

No I sait Slow RAM. The ACA500 use the $C00000 address space for it's embedded memory. It's slow RAM, not fast RAM. It's why you can't use expansion card to the trap door w/o conflicts. (except if the A500 is hacked to use it as chip RAM)
So, you have to buy an ACA12XX card to get real Fast RAM.

The Zeus68K embed FAST RAM.

[ikonsgr]

According to this: http://eab.abime.net/showpost.php?p=829088&postcount=1

" The ACA500 is powered by a 14MHz CMOS-68000 processor with 2MBytes RAM "
"The relatively moderate increase in speed is enough to run WHDload."

So probably the onboard aca 500 extra 2mb ram + 14mhz 68000 is enough for whdload.

As for the memory configuration, if things are like toto says, then normally you cant use trapdoor expansion (as it will also sit at $C0000 address) and probably will end up with a 2.5Mb ram amiga (2mb on aca 500 + 0.5 on board amiga). BUT i believe too, that if you mod your A500 motherboard ( http://www.amibay.com/showthread.php?t=4722 ) to see the extra trapdoor 512k as chip ram, you can have an amiga 500 with 3mb ram : 1mb chip +2mb slow!

[duga]

Originally Posted by TotO

No I sait Slow RAM. The ACA500 use the $C00000 address space for it's embedded memory. It's slow RAM, not fast RAM. It's why you can't use expansion card to the trap door w/o conflicts. (except if the A500 is hacked to use it as chip RAM)
So, you have to buy an ACA12XX card to get real Fast RAM.

The Zeus68K embed FAST RAM.

Okay. But the _speed_ should be as fast as fast ram even though it uses the slow ram address space?

[TotO]

Originally Posted by duga

Okay. But the _speed_ should be as fast as fast ram even though it uses the slow ram address space?

If I'm not wrong, the SlowRAM is like a ChipRAM speed, but only the CPU access it.
So, it's faster than sharing with others chipset. But at the system speed, because the CPU can't access it directly. (the address bus is not directly wired on it)

[Toni Wilen]

Originally Posted by TotO

If I'm not wrong, the SlowRAM is like a ChipRAM speed, but only the CPU access it.
So, it's faster than sharing with others chipset. But at the system speed, because the CPU can't access it directly. (the address bus is not directly wired on it)

Yes but RAM is on CPU board = full speed. A500 Slow RAM is shared with Agnus bus. 0xc00000 does not always mean slow ram, even original A2000 (not "B2000") had real fast at 0xc00000.

CPU boards with onboard RAM: RAM can be mapped anywhere, even on top of IO or ROM regions. (which of course would not make any sense..)

[TotO]

Hello Toni,

Originally Posted by Toni Wilen

Yes but RAM is on CPU board = full speed. A500 Slow RAM is shared with Agnus bus. 0xc00000 does not always mean slow ram, even original A2000 (not "B2000") had real fast at 0xc00000.

OK. So, the speed is more function of "where the RAM is located", because the $C00000 address space can be used as well by AGNUS than by the CPU.

Originally Posted by Toni Wilen

CPU boards with onboard RAM: RAM can be mapped anywhere, even on top of IO or ROM regions. (which of course would not make any sense..)

Like does by accelerator card with more than 8MB fast RAM, I though. (Blizzard, ...)

Please, can you explain me why using the $200000 (AUTOCONFIG / FAST RAM) area will limit the RAM speed to "7Mhz" ? (like said by Jens on the ACA topic)

Thank you.

[Toni Wilen]

Originally Posted by TotO

Hello Toni,

OK. So, the speed is more function of "where the RAM is located", because the $C00000 address space can be used as well by AGNUS than by the CPU.

Function of physical location (where and how it is connected), not logical (where it is mapped in address space) location.

Please, can you explain me why using the $200000 (AUTOCONFIG / FAST RAM) area will limit the RAM speed to "7Mhz" ? (like said by Jens on the ACA topic)

He said "If you add fastmem on the 86-pin port, it's going to be slow (7MHz)" = normal A500 compatible fast ram board in expansion port would ram at 7MHz (of course, expansion was designed for A500 spec), CPU board RAM at 0x200000 of course be fast.

[TotO]

OK, I though that the 86-pin side expansion was wired directly to the CPU bus.
Thank you.

[Calabazam]

Interested in 1 as well please.

[dJOS]

depending on price, im interested in one too.

[gibs]

so am I

[lurch]

Puzzling stuff, as I have an A500+ which has 1MB onboard and a 1MB via the trap door.

Have Toms 8MB in the CPU socket.

So going by what has been said if I get an ACA500 I'd have to remove the 1MB in the trap door and the 8MB in the CPU socket as the ACA500 blocks the CPU socket :-/

ACA500 2MB (classed as chip?) + 1MB onboard + 80 Euros

ACA1220 - 128MB + 90 Euros

170 Euros..... Not too bad.

Is there anymore info about the Zeus board?

Another thing that is confusing to me is I have no issues playing 90% of the games via WHDLoad on my 500+ My CPU is a 68010 for the quit key to work properly but no other tweaks.

Only games that are really slow are space quest/kings quest although they're far more playable now that I have the 8MB to play around with.

[duga]

Nope. You'll leave the trap door expansion which gives you a total of 2 MB chip.

Then you'll remove the Toms 8 MB and replace it with the ACA500. That gives you 2 MB fast.

Then you can sell Toms 8 MB and buy a ACA1220 as a replacement.

[ikonsgr]

Originally Posted by lurch

Another thing that is confusing to me is I have no issues playing 90% of the games via WHDLoad on my 500+ My CPU is a 68010 for the quit key to work properly but no other tweaks.
Only games that are really slow are space quest/kings quest although they're far more playable now that I have the 8MB to play around with.

So the old 68000/7Mhz (68010 is barely faster than 68000...) can handle whdload games without any speed penalty? I was under the impression that except for extra fast ram you will also need a more powerfull cpu than 68000/7Mhz! I have an amiga 500 (with 1mb chip mod) and i was thinking, if adding only fast ram (like the one kipper2k make) and perhaps something like the ide68k with ide to cf card adaptor could make my amiga 500 be able to run whdload games without any speed problems! (Of course,i will need to change kickstart with a 2.04 version too, right?)
What exactly is your configuration, that allows you to run whdload games?

[TotO]

Sure, with WHDLoad you need few power to handle games that already kick off the good old 68K@7MHz.

[lurch]

Originally Posted by ikonsgr

What exactly is your configuration, that allows you to run whdload games?

Current config is an A500 plus with 2MB chip, Toms 8MB fast RAM which connects to the CPU socket, a 68010, an A590 with a Mechware SCSI card reader so I can use a 2GB cfcard.

Can play 90% of games fine, Space quest I gave up on too slow, kings quest enhanced works not too badly needs a slight bump in speed :-)

The 8MB from Tom helped alot.

Upgraded to Workbench 3.1 along with the kick but that gave me less chip RAM available.

Actually the fastest combination was Workbench 2.x with kickstart 3.1 :-) Gave me 1.9MB chip to play with.

[lurch]

Will be replacing the SCSI card reader with the ide68k I have sitting here so should improve the HDD seek times :-)

[Lord Aga]

Originally Posted by TotO

A multiple frequency choice on the boot menu will be just great to increase compatibility.

This would be awesome !
7 MHz 100% compatible
14 MHz cruise speed
28 MHz serious muscle
50 MHz turbo charge (when rendering with Real 3D )

So we can pick some medium values where the extra speed is showing, but it still goes easy on the CPU.

[mr.vince]

Whatever you like. get ready for some pics later tonight.

[Lord Aga]

Ohboyohboyohboyohboy

[mr.vince]

Alright, this is no vaporware... Here's a real PCB. We plan to have the final boards immersion gold coated, but it's too expensive for one demo board. Please look at the first picture, especially on the lower left and tell me what you see...

[gibs]

Top!

So it is for september ?

Originally Posted by lurch

Actually the fastest combination was Workbench 2.x with kickstart 3.1 :-) Gave me 1.9MB chip to play with.

Tiny Launcher can give you more

[kipper2k]

Originally Posted by mr.vince

Alright, this is no vaporware... Here's a real PCB. We plan to have the final boards immersion gold coated, but it's too expensive for one demo board. Please look at the first picture, especially on the lower left and tell me what you see...

Attachment 32314

Attachment 32315

a Real Time clock

[gibs]

This board is going to be a success !

[TjLaZer]

Nice can't wait to see it finished!

[mr.vince]

Originally Posted by kipper2k

a Real Time clock

Yes, indeed. One more function built into the beast. No add-on, no adapter.

[dJOS]

Nice, what modes does the IDE Support - UDMA33 or UDMA66?

[JuvUK]

hi,

i would like to state interest in one of these