Amiga.com is down! This is the end! - Page 5

Zetr0 · 25 May 2010, 19:12

here is some more legal blurb for us to chew over..

So how long does UK copyright last?

Copyright in a literary, dramatic, musical or artistic work (including a photograph) lasts until 70 years after the death of the author. The duration of copyright in a film is 70 years after the death of the last to survive of the principal director, the authors of the screenplay and dialogue, and the composer of any music specially created for the film. Sound recordings are generally protected for 50 years from the year of publication. Broadcasts are protected for 50 years and published editions are protected for 25 years.

For copyright works created outside the UK or another country of the European Economic Area, the term of protection may be shorter. There may also be differences for works created before 1 January 1996. Kickstart 1.3 = 1987 and Kickstart 3.1 = 1993 wasn't it?

Publication Right

This is worth including as it applies to work that copyright has expired. If a literary, dramatic, musical or artistic work or film for which the copyright has expired has never been made available to the public, it may be protected by publication right. This is granted automatically to the first person to make a relevant work or film available to the public within the European Economic Area, lasts for 25 years from the time of making available, and gives rights broadly similar to those given by copyright.

US International Protection

The United States has copyright treaties with most countries throughout the world, and as a result of these agreements, each country respects the copyrights of the others. Currently, a U.S. copyright is honoured in 190 countries around the world.

(however its worth noting that although copyright is honoured, the duration of the protection will be different.)

Fair Use - US

Under U.S. Copyright law, “fair use” of a copyrighted work is allowed for the limited purposes of non-commercial comment, criticism, news reporting, scholarship, classroom use, or research and is not an infringement of copyright.

Specific UK information regarding software copyright

Software code is considered literary work as such it would be bound by the literary, dramtic, musical or artists works

For literary, dramatic, musical or artistic works
70 years from the end of the calendar year in which the last remaining author of the work dies.

If the author is unknown, copyright will last for 70 years from end of the calendar year in which the work was created, although if it is made available to the public during that time, (by publication, authorised performance, broadcast, exhibition, etc.), then the duration will be 70 years from the end of the year that the work was first made available.

Exceptions to Copyright - UK

There are some limited exceptions to copyright - these do not give rights to use copyright material, they simply state certain activities do not infringe. These include limited use for non-commercial research and private study. Copyright is infringed where either the whole or a "substantial part" of a work is used without permission, unless it falls within one of the exceptions. A substantial part can mean a "qualitive" significant part. This means that even a small portion of the whole work can still be a "substantial part".

Fair Dealing
Fair dealing is a term used to describe acts which are permitted to a certain degree without infringing the work, these acts are:

Private and research study purposes.
Performance, copies or lending for educational purposes.
Criticism and news reporting.
Incidental inclusion.
Copies and lending by librarians.
Acts for the purposes of royal commissions, statutory enquiries, judicial proceedings and parliamentary purposes.
Recording of broadcasts for the purposes of listening to or viewing at a more convenient time, this is known as "time shifting".
Producing a back up copy for personal use of a computer program.
Playing sound recording for a non profit making organisation, club or society.(Profit making organisations and individuals should obtain a license from PRS for Music.)

______________________________

Still here?!?

So if that lot hasn't melted your brain or contemplating swallowing your own tounge ? (you may need professional help =D)

Tell you what - lets establish that the root to this argument here is the Amiga Kickstart (software on IC medium) that is really the only thing Amiga inc owns (other than some flagging useless trademarks)

So the AmigaKick Start

1. It is covered in the US by copyright law, as such has atleast 70 years copyright protection under a literary work.
2. The US copyright may not completely apply in some countries and terratories and its duration of protection will differ.
3. In the UK foriegn copyrights outside the EU have a lesser protection duration (I am researching this bit)
4. Question: is Kickstart 3.1 a published edition of 3.0, if so would that mean its copyright is limmited to 25 years?

lots of food for thought me thinks, we need a fully versed Copyright/IP lawer =)

Eclipse · 15 June 2010, 03:15

Quote:

Originally Posted by Zetr0

The problem here is not the fact of copyright, but the fact no-one knows who ownes it.

The thing here is that say I wanted to have a license to distribute say KickRoms and Workbench...

whom do I approach to get that ?

Personally I believe that, in a small box, packed away in an office, long forgotten, in the depths and realms of either Gateway or Tulip there is the proof that Amiga.inc... owns less than nothing.

I agree, and to be honest I could never find anything actually linking ROM 3.0 to any company after the original Amiga. Remember as well a transfer of copyright and or trademark has to be recorded in some way otherwise the original author will still have it.

AmigaWorld · 21 June 2010, 05:28

http://amigakit.leamancomputing.com/

It seems to be working fine on this link.

By the way, back 2 roots seem to be down again to. Whats up with that?

Graham Humphrey · 21 June 2010, 09:56

What's Amigakit got to do with anything

gilgamesh · 29 July 2010, 20:03

It's back!!!

tero · 29 July 2010, 20:08

Kind of, only a blank page....
one of the most informative sites out there

Jope · 29 July 2010, 22:05

Seems someone paid it.

Domain Name: AMIGA.COM
Registrar: GODADDY.COM, INC.
Whois Server: whois.godaddy.com
Referral URL: http://registrar.godaddy.com
Name Server: NS1.HARDHATHOSTING.NET
Name Server: NS2.HARDHATHOSTING.NET
Status: clientDeleteProhibited
Status: clientRenewProhibited
Status: clientTransferProhibited
Status: clientUpdateProhibited
Updated Date: 08-jul-2010
Creation Date: 25-jun-1994
Expiration Date: 24-jun-2011

>>> Last update of whois database: Thu, 29 Jul 2010 20:03:59 UTC <<<

Registrant:
Amiga, Inc.
15846 NE 67th Pl
Redmond, Washington 98052
United States

Registered through: GoDaddy.com, Inc. (http://www.godaddy.com)
Domain Name: AMIGA.COM
Created on: 25-Jun-94
Expires on: 23-Jun-11
Last Updated on: 16-Jun-09

Administrative Contact:
Pfeifer, Vince vince@vincepfeifer.com
Amiga, Inc.
15846 NE 67th Pl
Redmond, Washington 98052
United States
+1.4258852284 Fax --

Technical Contact:
Pfeifer, Vince vince@vincepfeifer.com
Amiga, Inc.
15846 NE 67th Pl
Redmond, Washington 98052
United States
+1.4258852284 Fax --

Domain servers in listed order:
NS1.HARDHATHOSTING.NET
NS2.HARDHATHOSTING.NET

Skope · 30 July 2010, 09:42

Quote:

Originally Posted by townparkradio

Copyright exists to protect people who create things, and ensure they get fair market value for their creation. You may not LIKE it that these protections are in place, but they MUST be in place or the motivation to create vanishes.

I think it's just sad that you don't feel motivated to create unless copyright laws are enforced.

nnever2000 · 13 August 2010, 13:38

What about the AROS "free" Kickstart version? There are any change that will be completed?

gilgamesh · 13 August 2010, 20:20

Why not? The code is relatively complete. All you need is someone who reactivates the m68k branch and brings the result into a ROMable format. The result will be far from perfect, but I believe that somebody will do it sooner or later.

gilgamesh · 03 November 2010, 09:43

http://amiga.com/ is very much alive again.

Eclipse · 14 November 2010, 22:18

Quote:

Originally Posted by gilgamesh

http://amiga.com/ is very much alive again.

Where's anonymous when you need them.

gilgamesh · 25 January 2012, 21:45

The site has been updated. It is hosted on GoDaddy with Vince Pfeifer as contact.
From Mr Pfeifer's Google+ profile

Quote:

AMIGA
Vice President Product Dee;opment,

And Mr Mc Ewen's profile

Quote:

AMIGA
President/CEO

Or was it Amino Development Corporation? I'm confused.

imigger · 26 January 2012, 01:09

best thing to do is nobody buy there products and make damn sure they die, this way somebody good might get hold of it all like commodore again , be nice.

ancalimon · 26 January 2012, 10:49

I'm sure Amiga.inc won't stop until they finally start selling an Amiga branded toilet seat.

lilalurl · 26 January 2012, 11:29

Quote:

Originally Posted by ancalimon

I'm sure Amiga.inc won't stop until they finally start selling an Amiga branded toilet seat.

Hush. They have probably not heard of Sega's Toylet (yet...) so you'd better hope they don't start copying/licensing the concept

Bamiga2002 · 26 January 2012, 11:56

I wish they'd stayed down, they're nothing but a joke and annoyment for the Amigans. Their "doing business" page should include warning of shenadigan. At least the "shop" -link doesn't work hehee

keitha1200 · 14 February 2012, 18:20

Very interesting question, in regards to ownership. After reading this thread (and my confusion about the Commodore brand) I thought I would have a wee look.

Here's my understanding and time-line of who owns what:

1) Commodore and Amiga are spilt into two different divisions within Escom

Escom goes bankrupt
Tulip buys the Commodore Division (for PC brand)
Gateway buys the Amiga Inc Division (47 Amiga patents)

2) Gateway closes down Amiga Inc (1999-ish) but retains ownership of patents etc.

Allows/sells Bill and Ted lifetime exclusive Amiga license.
Bill and Ted call their new company 'Amiga Inc'.
Bill and co sell licenses to other firms (Commodore USA, etc)

It appears to me that any company or person claiming to be Amiga are NOT Amiga, but merely licensee of the brand and intellectual rights (same idea as the local Mcdonald's actually claiming to be Mcdonalds or a fuel station buying a license from Rolls Royce, then claiming their selling Rolls Royce fuel). It is possible the Bill and Co could sell an Amiga license for making toilet seats, as the Gateway deal allowed them to do so.

Gateway was taken over by Acer so I would speculate: they are now the owners of the Amiga patents, brands etc. However they can't actually use the brands/patents without legal problems because of the license deal Gateway made with Bill and Co (I believe).

In conclusion; It's a complete mess and i have to strongly agree with general opinion within this thread. It's a pretty sad state of affairs, where small-time companies, are trying to milk every last drop out of the Amiga brand name.

I spent a few hours researching this (google and old AF mags) If I'm wrong? please point-out my mistakes

PS: Commodore branding is done by licences also, via the holding company

Commodore International B.V.

gilgamesh · 14 February 2012, 20:14

That's about it.
Of course you didn't properly distinguish between the three differente AIncs (a lesser sin). The last Amiga patent expired in 2010 afaik. Almost all trademarks have expired.
It is unclear who really owns AmigaOS and Kickstart right now. ESCOM did not own them in the first place.

For an in-depth discussion see http://sites.google.com/site/freeamiga

Amiga1992 · 14 February 2012, 21:05

Oh man, isn't that a fuck-ugly, ass backwards website??

25 May 2010, 19:12	#81
Zetr0 Ya' like it Retr0? Join Date: Jul 2005 Location: United Kingdom Age: 49 Posts: 9,768	here is some more legal blurb for us to chew over.. So how long does UK copyright last? Copyright in a literary, dramatic, musical or artistic work (including a photograph) lasts until 70 years after the death of the author. The duration of copyright in a film is 70 years after the death of the last to survive of the principal director, the authors of the screenplay and dialogue, and the composer of any music specially created for the film. Sound recordings are generally protected for 50 years from the year of publication. Broadcasts are protected for 50 years and published editions are protected for 25 years. For copyright works created outside the UK or another country of the European Economic Area, the term of protection may be shorter. There may also be differences for works created before 1 January 1996. Kickstart 1.3 = 1987 and Kickstart 3.1 = 1993 wasn't it? Publication Right This is worth including as it applies to work that copyright has expired. If a literary, dramatic, musical or artistic work or film for which the copyright has expired has never been made available to the public, it may be protected by publication right. This is granted automatically to the first person to make a relevant work or film available to the public within the European Economic Area, lasts for 25 years from the time of making available, and gives rights broadly similar to those given by copyright. US International Protection The United States has copyright treaties with most countries throughout the world, and as a result of these agreements, each country respects the copyrights of the others. Currently, a U.S. copyright is honoured in 190 countries around the world. (however its worth noting that although copyright is honoured, the duration of the protection will be different.) Fair Use - US Under U.S. Copyright law, “fair use” of a copyrighted work is allowed for the limited purposes of non-commercial comment, criticism, news reporting, scholarship, classroom use, or research and is not an infringement of copyright. Specific UK information regarding software copyright Software code is considered literary work as such it would be bound by the literary, dramtic, musical or artists works For literary, dramatic, musical or artistic works 70 years from the end of the calendar year in which the last remaining author of the work dies. If the author is unknown, copyright will last for 70 years from end of the calendar year in which the work was created, although if it is made available to the public during that time, (by publication, authorised performance, broadcast, exhibition, etc.), then the duration will be 70 years from the end of the year that the work was first made available. Exceptions to Copyright - UK There are some limited exceptions to copyright - these do not give rights to use copyright material, they simply state certain activities do not infringe. These include limited use for non-commercial research and private study. Copyright is infringed where either the whole or a "substantial part" of a work is used without permission, unless it falls within one of the exceptions. A substantial part can mean a "qualitive" significant part. This means that even a small portion of the whole work can still be a "substantial part". Fair Dealing Fair dealing is a term used to describe acts which are permitted to a certain degree without infringing the work, these acts are: Private and research study purposes. Performance, copies or lending for educational purposes. Criticism and news reporting. Incidental inclusion. Copies and lending by librarians. Acts for the purposes of royal commissions, statutory enquiries, judicial proceedings and parliamentary purposes. Recording of broadcasts for the purposes of listening to or viewing at a more convenient time, this is known as "time shifting". Producing a back up copy for personal use of a computer program. Playing sound recording for a non profit making organisation, club or society.(Profit making organisations and individuals should obtain a license from PRS for Music.) ______________________________ Still here?!? So if that lot hasn't melted your brain or contemplating swallowing your own tounge ? (you may need professional help =D) Tell you what - lets establish that the root to this argument here is the Amiga Kickstart (software on IC medium) that is really the only thing Amiga inc owns (other than some flagging useless trademarks) So the AmigaKick Start 1. It is covered in the US by copyright law, as such has atleast 70 years copyright protection under a literary work. 2. The US copyright may not completely apply in some countries and terratories and its duration of protection will differ. 3. In the UK foriegn copyrights outside the EU have a lesser protection duration (I am researching this bit) 4. Question: is Kickstart 3.1 a published edition of 3.0, if so would that mean its copyright is limmited to 25 years? lots of food for thought me thinks, we need a fully versed Copyright/IP lawer =)

14 February 2012, 18:20	#98
keitha1200 Registered User Join Date: Feb 2012 Location: Tayside Posts: 181	Very interesting question, in regards to ownership. After reading this thread (and my confusion about the Commodore brand) I thought I would have a wee look. Here's my understanding and time-line of who owns what: 1) Commodore and Amiga are spilt into two different divisions within Escom Escom goes bankrupt Tulip buys the Commodore Division (for PC brand) Gateway buys the Amiga Inc Division (47 Amiga patents) 2) Gateway closes down Amiga Inc (1999-ish) but retains ownership of patents etc. Allows/sells Bill and Ted lifetime exclusive Amiga license. Bill and Ted call their new company 'Amiga Inc'. Bill and co sell licenses to other firms (Commodore USA, etc) It appears to me that any company or person claiming to be Amiga are NOT Amiga, but merely licensee of the brand and intellectual rights (same idea as the local Mcdonald's actually claiming to be Mcdonalds or a fuel station buying a license from Rolls Royce, then claiming their selling Rolls Royce fuel). It is possible the Bill and Co could sell an Amiga license for making toilet seats, as the Gateway deal allowed them to do so. Gateway was taken over by Acer so I would speculate: they are now the owners of the Amiga patents, brands etc. However they can't actually use the brands/patents without legal problems because of the license deal Gateway made with Bill and Co (I believe). In conclusion; It's a complete mess and i have to strongly agree with general opinion within this thread. It's a pretty sad state of affairs, where small-time companies, are trying to milk every last drop out of the Amiga brand name. I spent a few hours researching this (google and old AF mags) If I'm wrong? please point-out my mistakes PS: Commodore branding is done by licences also, via the holding company Commodore International B.V. Last edited by keitha1200; 14 February 2012 at 18:42. Reason: typos

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21 June 2010, 05:28	#83
AmigaWorld Registered User Join Date: Sep 2005 Location: U.S.A Age: 57 Posts: 106	http://amigakit.leamancomputing.com/ It seems to be working fine on this link. By the way, back 2 roots seem to be down again to. Whats up with that?

21 June 2010, 09:56	#84
Graham Humphrey Moderator Join Date: Jul 2004 Location: Norwich, Norfolk, UK Age: 37 Posts: 11,167	What's Amigakit got to do with anything

29 July 2010, 20:03	#85
gilgamesh Linux snob Join Date: Sep 2008 Location: Monkey Island Posts: 997	It's back!!!

29 July 2010, 20:08	#86
tero Registered User Join Date: Jan 2009 Location: M'Gladbach Age: 46 Posts: 621	Kind of, only a blank page.... one of the most informative sites out there

29 July 2010, 22:05	#87
Jope - Join Date: Jul 2003 Location: Helsinki / Finland Age: 43 Posts: 9,880	Seems someone paid it. Domain Name: AMIGA.COM Registrar: GODADDY.COM, INC. Whois Server: whois.godaddy.com Referral URL: http://registrar.godaddy.com Name Server: NS1.HARDHATHOSTING.NET Name Server: NS2.HARDHATHOSTING.NET Status: clientDeleteProhibited Status: clientRenewProhibited Status: clientTransferProhibited Status: clientUpdateProhibited Updated Date: 08-jul-2010 Creation Date: 25-jun-1994 Expiration Date: 24-jun-2011 >>> Last update of whois database: Thu, 29 Jul 2010 20:03:59 UTC <<< Registrant: Amiga, Inc. 15846 NE 67th Pl Redmond, Washington 98052 United States Registered through: GoDaddy.com, Inc. (http://www.godaddy.com) Domain Name: AMIGA.COM Created on: 25-Jun-94 Expires on: 23-Jun-11 Last Updated on: 16-Jun-09 Administrative Contact: Pfeifer, Vince vince@vincepfeifer.com Amiga, Inc. 15846 NE 67th Pl Redmond, Washington 98052 United States +1.4258852284 Fax -- Technical Contact: Pfeifer, Vince vince@vincepfeifer.com Amiga, Inc. 15846 NE 67th Pl Redmond, Washington 98052 United States +1.4258852284 Fax -- Domain servers in listed order: NS1.HARDHATHOSTING.NET NS2.HARDHATHOSTING.NET

13 August 2010, 13:38	#89
nnever2000 Registered User Join Date: May 2002 Location: italy Posts: 138	What about the AROS "free" Kickstart version? There are any change that will be completed?

13 August 2010, 20:20	#90
gilgamesh Linux snob Join Date: Sep 2008 Location: Monkey Island Posts: 997	Why not? The code is relatively complete. All you need is someone who reactivates the m68k branch and brings the result into a ROMable format. The result will be far from perfect, but I believe that somebody will do it sooner or later.

03 November 2010, 09:43	#91
gilgamesh Linux snob Join Date: Sep 2008 Location: Monkey Island Posts: 997	http://amiga.com/ is very much alive again.

26 January 2012, 01:09	#94
imigger Banned Join Date: Apr 2011 Location: england Posts: 135	best thing to do is nobody buy there products and make damn sure they die, this way somebody good might get hold of it all like commodore again , be nice.

26 January 2012, 10:49	#95
ancalimon Supernormal Join Date: Jul 2007 Location: Istanbul / Turkey Age: 43 Posts: 1,414	I'm sure Amiga.inc won't stop until they finally start selling an Amiga branded toilet seat.

26 January 2012, 11:56	#97
Bamiga2002 BlizzardPPC'less Join Date: May 2004 Location: Finland Age: 46 Posts: 3,210	I wish they'd stayed down, they're nothing but a joke and annoyment for the Amigans. Their "doing business" page should include warning of shenadigan. At least the "shop" -link doesn't work hehee

14 February 2012, 20:14	#99
gilgamesh Linux snob Join Date: Sep 2008 Location: Monkey Island Posts: 997	That's about it. Of course you didn't properly distinguish between the three differente AIncs (a lesser sin). The last Amiga patent expired in 2010 afaik. Almost all trademarks have expired. It is unclear who really owns AmigaOS and Kickstart right now. ESCOM did not own them in the first place. For an in-depth discussion see http://sites.google.com/site/freeamiga

14 February 2012, 21:05	#100
Amiga1992 Registered User Join Date: May 2001 Location: ? Posts: 19,646	Oh man, isn't that a fuck-ugly, ass backwards website??

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