AmigaOS 3.1.4 withdrawn from market after Amiga

[IanS]

Originally Posted by malko

3.1.4 (released 09.2018) has been updated -> 3.1.4.1 (available since 07.2019)
3.1.4.1 is being updated -> 3.2 (available when ready)

According to at least one developer, 3.1.4 is now deprecated and 3.2 will be a separate purchase, even for those who have bought 3.1.4. Therefore you can consider it to be a 'new' product. And as mentioned previously, 3.2 is in it's early stages, having only just had its feature list finalised.

[IanS]

Originally Posted by Minuous

3.2 is the continuation of 3.1.4(.1), which is a continuation of 3.1.



I think pulling the rug from under those developers by transferring the rights to some other company and then probably to Cloanto would be likely to cause further animosity.

I think you ought to actually read what I wrote, then you might understand what I said. I really don't want to repeat it. But just for you.

Create a separate company. Cloanto and Hyperion transfer the rights of OS 3.x to it. Then the NEW company controls OS3.x and can create new licenses for those that want it. That way, neither Hyperion nor Cloanto control the OS. New ownership and licenses will clear up any existing ambiguities.

Nobody has to "pull the rug" on OS 3.2, on the contrary, 3.2 can continue exactly as planned. It just won't be dubiously 'owned' by Hyperion or Cloanto.

Again, Cloanto will not own the OS, neither will Hyperion. Is this so hard to understand?

[Jope]

Originally Posted by IanS

According to at least one developer, 3.1.4 is now deprecated and 3.2 will be a separate purchase, even for those who have bought 3.1.4. Therefore you can consider it to be a 'new' product.

An interesting way to spin it like it's a negative thing. Every version of AmigaOS has been a separate purchase, even though they have been based on the same source tree.

[VladR]

Originally Posted by gulliver

In any real Amiga, even good old Commodore AmigaOS 3.1 clearly outperforms AROS, which struggles to even boot with less 3 or was it 4 MB?. And performance-wise, it is only tolerable on a high speed 68060 or WinUAE-like enviroment.

OK, I only use AROS on my Vampire V4 and have never seen it anywhere else (being Atari guy and all).

I don't doubt that an OS from 3 decades ago, written in ASM (I presume it was?) would run well even on 7 MHz A500.

But just how slow is AROS on something like -say- 33 MHz 040 ? Does somebody have some links to YT so we can make informed opinion?

[nogginthenog]

Originally Posted by VladR

I don't doubt that an OS from 3 decades ago, written in ASM (I presume it was?) would run well even on 7 MHz A500.

AmigaOS was written (mostly) in C.

[IanS]

Originally Posted by Jope

An interesting way to spin it like it's a negative thing. Every version of AmigaOS has been a separate purchase, even though they have been based on the same source tree.

I'm not quite why you think there were any negative connotations in my post. I clearly stated that 3.2 is a new product and you will have to pay for it. But it is essentially only going to be a selection of but fixes and small tweaks. Hyperion do seem intent on charging for small, incremental updates. I wonder how many 'free' updates 3.2 will get before you have to pay for 3.3

[gulliver]

Originally Posted by IanS

But it is essentially only going to be a selection of but fixes and small tweaks.

Where do you get this nonsense? Stop lying!

There has not been a feature list out and you have the nerve to say you know?

Stop spreading FUD.

[dschallock]

Originally Posted by IanS

I'm not quite why you think there were any negative connotations in my post. I clearly stated that 3.2 is a new product and you will have to pay for it. But it is essentially only going to be a selection of but fixes and small tweaks. Hyperion do seem intent on charging for small, incremental updates. I wonder how many 'free' updates 3.2 will get before you have to pay for 3.3

I don't know the ins and outs of all the politics involved the keys players here but....
It seems totally logical to me that development costs time which costs money.
In 2020 the fact that we are getting Amiga development is a blessing and certainly something we should be happy to pay for if it is a priority to us and we have the means to do so. It is to me, and I do.
So I for one would be more than happy to pay for a 3.2 upgrade today regardless of the feature set... it will be better than before.
I'm just so eager for it, its hard for me to wait. I wish we could have incremental little updates every week!!

[SpeedGeek]

Originally Posted by dschallock

I don't know the ins and outs of all the politics involved the keys players here but....
It seems totally logical to me that development costs time which costs money.
In 2020 the fact that we are getting Amiga development is a blessing and certainly something we should be happy to pay for if it is a priority to us and we have the means to do so. It is to me, and I do.
So I for one would be more than happy to pay for a 3.2 upgrade today regardless of the feature set... it will be better than before.
I'm just so eager for it, its hard for me to wait. I wish we could have incremental little updates every week!!

LOL!

Apparently, you have not read very much about this topic. The Hyperion 3.1 "Fork" developers work absolutely for FREE! Otherwise, there would be no 3.1.4 or 3.2 Forks available - period.

Do you really think Hyperion would be willing/able to pay normal developers fees and lawyer fees just to make them available for you?

[Rotzloeffel]

Originally Posted by SpeedGeek

LOL!

The Hyperion 3.1 "Fork" developers work absolutely for FREE!

We work for fun….. that´s all About fun. And it does´nt absolutely not matter, if the Company is Hyperion, cloanto or Pepsi-Cola

[malko]

@IanS & @SpeedGeek : All of this was already debated and Thomas position was/is : https://eab.abime.net/showpost.php?p...1&postcount=84
& https://eab.abime.net/showpost.php?p...9&postcount=80

[IanS]

Originally Posted by malko

@IanS & @SpeedGeek : All of this was already debated and Thomas position was/is : https://eab.abime.net/showpost.php?p...1&postcount=84
& https://eab.abime.net/showpost.php?p...9&postcount=80

I agree, this is a storm in a teacup situation, and it really shouldn't be an issue after all these years. But there's a *slight* flaw to his logic. It matters not if he isn't sure who can do what, or indeed if he 'believes' he is in the right. What matters is the actual result of the court cases. Ignoring the known legal arguments and associated problems, and yet carrying on regardless I, is at best, unwise. Much like people who build houses or extensions without *first getting planning permission*. Except they probably only get their house knocked down, whereas the Amiga parties might be tempted to make huge compensation claims.

If the development team are happy they are safe from any possible furure legal proceedings, that's their choice, but broadly speaking, claiming ignorance is no defence in either civil or criminal cases.

[malko]

T.R.'s position has the merit of being clear: Hyperion has proof of legitimacy concerning the further development of the OS based on material they own the copyright.
If Cloanto disagrees, it is up to Cloanto to prove their rights or to settle with Hyperion and it's not to the development team to judge Cloanto's affirmations.

As far as you are concerned I don't see you bringing any evidence with your posts. But, if I understand you correctly, you continue to claim that Hyperion and the development team is in the wrong side of the law ...

[IanS]

Originally Posted by gulliver

Where do you get this nonsense? Stop lying!

There has not been a feature list out and you have the nerve to say you know?

Stop spreading FUD.

And yet, in the discussions on this very forum, requests have been made, developers have responded and statements made regarding what is or is not likely to make it in to version 3.2 . If what has been said is true, then how can what I say be nonsense? Before you accuse me of "lying", perhaps you ought to consider the ramifications of your statement. Lying is a *deliberate* act of making incorrect or misleading statements designed to deceive. At no point has anyone said 3.2 is going involve *major* changes to the functionality of Amiga OS 3.1x. Quite the opposite in fact, they say they haven't the resources to do that. In which case, as I said, it is likely to be a further series of bug fixes and tweaks.

I don't like being called a liar, So, please, either show me where I lied, or recant your statement.

[Minuous]

Certain selected new features have been previewed, but those make up only a small proportion of the changes. It is indeed a major upgrade from 3.1x.

[IanS]

Originally Posted by malko

T.R.'s position has the merit of being clear: Hyperion has proof of legitimacy concerning the further development of the OS based on material they own the copyright.
If Cloanto disagrees, it is up to Cloanto to prove their rights or to settle with Hyperion and it's not to the development team to judge Cloanto's affirmations.

As far as you are concerned I don't see you bringing any evidence with your posts. But, if I understand you correctly, you continue to claim that Hyperion and the development team is in the wrong side of the law ...

You certainly don't understand me correctly. Firstly, my opinion (or yours for that matter) of who is in the right or wrong is irrelevant, the simple point is, nobody is sure of who has what rights to do what. It has not yet been legally decided. If it were as clear cut as you seem to think, there would be no need for prolonged legal battles. I thought I had made that quite clear, but if not, you've just read it again... so it should be quite clear by now.

My personal opinion is that *anybody* making changes to the OS 3.x source code at this time, never mind selling such a product, is treading on very shaky ground. As I said before, ignorance of the law is no defence, neither is ignoring one side of the (very public) arguments over who has what rights to it, when clearly it isn't obvious.

And please explain, from a purely legal point of view, why the development team are not responsible for their choice, when they know full well that the matter is in dispute, and has been for a long time?

Why would you think I should provide any new evidence? Evidence to support what claim? The claim of there's an ongoing legal battle where the parties disagree over the rights to Amiga OS ownership and licencing? That's a matter of public record, and therefore requires no new evidence. Clearly you aren't keeping up with events.

I am however as entitled as you are to an opinion. And if you hadn't noticed, the matter is already in dispute... so what exactly was your point?

[malko]

Originally Posted by IanS

[...] so what exactly was your point?

To let you know that the point you think you are raising has already been discussed.


But my mistake. I go back to the silent waiting of the result of the court case...

[Minuous]

If someone decided to begin a years-long legal battle with Microsoft, for example, it would not mean that Microsoft would have to stop updating Windows for years until it was resolved. So I don't see any reason why AmigaOS should be any different in this regard.

[bubbob42]

@IanS: 3.2 will be a major update to 3.1.4. Depending on individuals‘ perception, it may be regarded a bigger step than 3.1.4 compared to 3.1.

Please also study the release notes of 3.1.4; it may remedy your impression that 3.1.4 has been a collection of patches and fixes either.

[gulliver]

Originally Posted by IanS

And yet, in the discussions on this very forum, requests have been made, developers have responded and statements made regarding what is or is not likely to make it in to version 3.2 . If what has been said is true, then how can what I say be nonsense? Before you accuse me of "lying", perhaps you ought to consider the ramifications of your statement. Lying is a *deliberate* act of making incorrect or misleading statements designed to deceive. At no point has anyone said 3.2 is going involve *major* changes to the functionality of Amiga OS 3.1x. Quite the opposite in fact, they say they haven't the resources to do that. In which case, as I said, it is likely to be a further series of bug fixes and tweaks.

I don't like being called a liar, So, please, either show me where I lied, or recant your statement.

Then stop lying.
Do I need to repeat the post you made and I quoted?

You don't know about AmigaOS 3.2, yet you made assumptions and portrayed them as truth: that is your lie.