English Amiga Board


Go Back   English Amiga Board > Support > support.Hardware

 
 
Thread Tools
Old 17 January 2018, 19:51   #1
ChefDeadpool
Registered User
ChefDeadpool's Avatar
 
Join Date: Nov 2017
Location: Spring, TX, USA
Posts: 45
ChefDeadpool's MKL IDE+8MB in CDTV Install Guide

Hi Everyone,

As promised in MKL's thread on Amibay, I'm doing an installation guide for adding his IDE + 8MB board to a CDTV. This is a great accessory for WHDLoad setups when paired with a 3.1 Kickstart. Mine shipped without Autoconfig enabled, and adding memory with AddMem was easy in Workbench 3.1. It makes a great Amiga console.

Installation Guide:

Tools required:
1 large 5x2 foot work surface with ground strap
1 large philips screwdriver ~3mm tip
1 small philips screwdriver ~2mm tip
1 small flat blade screwdriver - ~2mm tip
1 magnetic screw tray, multiple is better
1 spudger, such as the kind used to open cell phones.
1 soldering iron
1 hook-and-loop (velcro) strap for temporarily holding cabling out of the way.
1 tool for gripping/pulling small mainboard cables. A small plyers will do, but I find this to be too much brute force.
1 source of rosin flux (I use a flux pen)
1 spool of leaded rosin-core solder suitable for electronics, the smaller the better.
1 IC prying tool.
1 large book at least 20mm thick. This is necessary for installation of the IDE + 8MB board.
1 Silver or white marker for marking the pins to be soldered on the two chips.

VERY IMPORTANT
1 low-profile IDE ribbon cable. The supplied cable did not work. I recommend a low-profile, round ribbon cable run under the mainboard into the flash card area. This is a great spot for mounting a hard disk or SD card reader.

Be sure your workspace is properly grounded, and wear a ground strap. In low-humidity environments (like where I live in the middle of winter), a spray bottle for misting the air helps (but don't do it over your open CDTV )

CDTV GENERAL DISASSEMBLY

1. With the CDTV on a flat work surface facing awy from you, remove the two screws near the top edge on the rear of the case.

2. Remove the two screws that secure the video output board. They are located near the bottom of the case below the composite output, and keep them in the screw tray, separated if you can.

3. (Optional) remove the two screws directly to the left of the video board that may be securing an expansion in the DMA slot. Even if your board does not have a rear panel (such as Matthias Heinrichs' SCSI card) you will need to remove it, as the card interferes with the removal of the CDTV mainboard.

4. Remove the video output board and any expansion board you may have installed by inserting the spudger in the top and bottom (alternating) gently working them loose until they come free. Place the expansion(s) in a safe, static-free area.

5. Remove the four screws securing the lid on the left and right sides of the case.

6. Remove the CDTV lid by very carefully prying the lower left and right edges of the cover outward about 4mm, and lifting the lid upward from the rear, keeping the forward of the case pointed down until it comes free. There are 3 protrusions from the front edge of the casing that work as a guide for reinstalling the lid.

7. Rotate the CDTV so that the front panel is facing toward you.

8. Using the small flat-blade screwdriver, insert the tip about 3mm into the retainer of one of the first two power connectors in the center of the board, and pull left about 2mm. Remove the cable by lifting straight up. Repeat the process for the other connector, and for the black and the 2-wire black and yellow connector on the right hand side of the board near the power supply.

9. Disconnect the two cables for the fan (red/blue) and secondary power (red/black) near the right hand side of the board, next to the power supply. Always pull on the connector and never the wires. If the connector will not come free easily, insert the spudger in between the socket and the connector, gently rocking the spudger until the cable comes free. Repeat this process for the CD Audio connector (orange/yellow/black) on the left hand side of the board.

10. Disconnect the two 40-pin cables (CD-ROM Data/left, and flash memory slot/right) by lifting straight up. These can be carefully rocked from side to side if they don't immediately come loose.

11. Retain all of the colored cabling on the right hand side of the board away from the mainboard, and bundle it with the hook and loop strap, so that it rests on top of the power supply. Bend the two 40-pin cables away from the mainboard.

12. Remove the following screws in the CDTV mainboard with a large screwdriver:
a. Top right, rear of case, near the fan.
b. Top left, rear of case, between back panel and 40-pin connector.
c. center-left, near C106.
d. center-bottom, near the leftmost of the large, flat black cables running to the CDTV front panel.
e. The screw directly to the left of U34, in the center of the mainboard. This will require a much smaller screwdriver.

13. Remove the self-tapping screw in the left side of the CDTV front fascia.

14. Remove two screws on the top of the front fascia.

15. The CDTV mainboard is now ready to be removed. Supporting the front fascia which is still connected to the mainboard, tilt the fascia and mainboard upward, as the rear ports will anchor it. Once the mainboard is at a 45 degree angle, lift away from the CDTV and the board and fascia will come free. Try not to bend the black cabling connecting the front fascia to the mainboard, as it is somewhat fragile. Place the mainboard on top of the book with the book under the forward half of the mainboard. Be wary of the DMA and video connectors on the underside of the board, as these should hang free. This serves to support the board, and is necessary to support the downward force while installing the MKL device.

MKL 8MB + IDE SPECIFIC INSTRUCTIONS

1. Noting its orientation, remove the 68000 CPU (U51) by prying each end gently with the IC prying tool, or a small, flat blade screwdriver. You may have to work each end for a while before it comes loose.

2. Bend The capacitor at C163 away from U51 about 2mm, as the edge of the MKL IDE board requires the clearance.

3. Inspect the pins on the MKL IDE + 8MB board.Use the 68000 CPU as comparison, and correct any bent pins.

4. Insert the MKL board into the 68000 socket with the IDE connector facing capacitor C163.

5. With the IDE connector on the MKL 8MB+IDE oriented near the front of the board, align the pins with U51. Apply even pressure on the board until it seats.

6. Insert the 68000 CPU in the top of the MKL board, in its original orientation.

7. Heat up your soldering iron.

8. Strip the supplied 2-wire cable about 2mm. Mine was black and yellow, but I am not sure if these vary by what MKL has available. Slide the connector on to the leftmost two pins with the completely smooth side face up. The leftmost wire will now be wire 1. Place a mark with your silver or white marker on each side of the connector - one on the MKL board and one on the connector, to mark pin 1.

9. Tin the wires, and apply flux to pin 29 of U12 (CSG 5719 / Gary). Solder wire 1 to this pin.

10. Apply flux to pin 21 of U9 (CSG 8520A-1, CIA-A). Solder wire 2 to this pin.

11. Reverse the disassembly instructions to reassemble.

NOTE: Be sure that the mainboard is completely seated.
NOTE: If you forgot to mark it, CN21 is the 4-wire connector, and CN22 is the two-wire.

If anyone finds anything amiss here, please let me know.

Install photos:
Click image for larger version

Name:	IMG_0026.jpg
Views:	278
Size:	489.2 KB
ID:	56267
Click image for larger version

Name:	IMG_0027.jpg
Views:	285
Size:	515.1 KB
ID:	56268
Click image for larger version

Name:	IMG_0028.jpg
Views:	286
Size:	502.3 KB
ID:	56269
Click image for larger version

Name:	IMG_0029.jpg
Views:	221
Size:	483.9 KB
ID:	56270
Click image for larger version

Name:	IMG_0030.jpg
Views:	395
Size:	552.1 KB
ID:	56271

Last edited by ChefDeadpool; 17 January 2018 at 20:00.
ChefDeadpool is offline  
Old 06 March 2018, 14:45   #2
ChadsArcade
Registered User

 
Join Date: Jan 2018
Location: Chorley
Posts: 25
Thank you for this very detailed guide, it will prove invaluable once I receive my 8Mb+IDE
ChadsArcade is offline  
Old 10 April 2018, 19:24   #3
scrappysphinx
Registered User

scrappysphinx's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jan 2008
Location: Nottingham
Age: 36
Posts: 469
Hi, i am having some trouble with mkl's ide+8mb board and my CDTV. I have installed the 8mb & ide into the 68000 slot and replaced the 68000. I then soldered the two wires as in your above post but when i power on the CDTV i get a coloured screen (it varies in colour from orange/blue/pink). If i unplug the connector from the IDE board then the CDTV board as normal to its main menu. Its probably something simple but i cannot get it to work.

Also, do you know if its possible to attach an led for hdd activity?
finally is there a way to disable to the board so i can still boot it as a cdtv if wanted?

Thanks for any info you can provide
scrappysphinx is offline  
Old 11 April 2018, 00:21   #4
ChefDeadpool
Registered User
ChefDeadpool's Avatar
 
Join Date: Nov 2017
Location: Spring, TX, USA
Posts: 45
Quote:
Originally Posted by scrappysphinx View Post
Hi, i am having some trouble with mkl's ide+8mb board and my CDTV. I have installed the 8mb & ide into the 68000 slot and replaced the 68000. I then soldered the two wires as in your above post but when i power on the CDTV i get a coloured screen (it varies in colour from orange/blue/pink). If i unplug the connector from the IDE board then the CDTV board as normal to its main menu. Its probably something simple but i cannot get it to work.

Also, do you know if its possible to attach an led for hdd activity?
finally is there a way to disable to the board so i can still boot it as a cdtv if wanted?

Thanks for any info you can provide

1) check all pins to make sure they are properly seated.
2) Try the cable with the CDTV ROMs disabled. (white jumper) J15. If you didn’t tell MKL that you were putting this in a CDTV, it may have Autoboot enabled, and I’m not sure if that does anything funny with the CDTV ROMs enabled. I ran mine with 1.3 and a softkick program for awhile until I could burn custom kickstart ROMs for it.

Also, do you have a SCSI card or any other extras installed?


Sent from my iPad using Tapatalk
ChefDeadpool is offline  
Old 11 April 2018, 00:21   #5
scrappysphinx
Registered User

scrappysphinx's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jan 2008
Location: Nottingham
Age: 36
Posts: 469
Just a quick update to this, i soldered wires to the alternative OVR & INT signals on the IDE board (next to the ide header) and now the CDTV boots to a black screen (i am using a 3.1 rom and also tried a 2.05 rom).

I have burned the diagrom and when booting the diagrom with both signals connected again i get a black screen, if i disconnect the OVR signal from Gary then i can access the early boot menu which shows one expansion board and says its status is working but i still cannot boot from the hdd.

With OVR disconnected and booting the diagrom it boots and finds one zorro 2 board but no ram is detected

*just saw your reply*

I did tell MKL it was for the CDTV and it was him who pointed me to this post

I have tried with the cdtv roms jumpered and open same result.

No other expansions in the CDTV
scrappysphinx is offline  
Old 11 April 2018, 02:06   #6
alexh
Thalion Webshrine
alexh's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jan 2004
Location: Oxford
Posts: 12,590
The issue with autoconfig and the CDTV on boards like this was described on this forum by the legendary Yaqube and included a fix. I kept saying to kipper2k it would be easy to change the CPLD to implement the fix but I don't think it was ever done due to the small number of CDTV users
alexh is online now  
Old 11 April 2018, 02:11   #7
ChefDeadpool
Registered User
ChefDeadpool's Avatar
 
Join Date: Nov 2017
Location: Spring, TX, USA
Posts: 45
The MKL board is not autoconfig. You need to run AddRam to add the board into the OS. Yes, it’s a pain for some WHDLoad games, and TinyLauncher is basically useless, but that’s the way things are.


Sent from my iPad using Tapatalk
ChefDeadpool is offline  
Old 11 April 2018, 02:50   #8
scrappysphinx
Registered User

scrappysphinx's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jan 2008
Location: Nottingham
Age: 36
Posts: 469
Ok so the ram is not autoconfig but the board is autoboot correct?

I know my HDD is good as it came from an a1200 tower.
I'm planning to try it on an a500+ tomorrow to try and make sure the board is working as it should
scrappysphinx is offline  
Old 11 April 2018, 11:15   #9
scrappysphinx
Registered User

scrappysphinx's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jan 2008
Location: Nottingham
Age: 36
Posts: 469
So i have installed the board into my 500+ machine and i'm presented with the same issue.

When the OVR & INT signals are connected i am greeted with a black screen, cannot access the early boot menu, hdd doesn't boot, cannot access the early boot menu.... Basically the amiga doesn't boot.

Disconnect the signals and amiga displays the kickstart screen as normal.

Last edited by scrappysphinx; 11 April 2018 at 11:21.
scrappysphinx is offline  
Old 11 April 2018, 11:34   #10
alexh
Thalion Webshrine
alexh's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jan 2004
Location: Oxford
Posts: 12,590
Quote:
Originally Posted by ChefDeadpool View Post
The MKL board is not autoconfig.
The MKL board is based on an A600 RAM card design by LordV and does have autoconfig but it doesn't work in the CDTV.

The 68000 socket lacks CFGIN/CFGOUT expansion bus signals so without CFGIN/CFGOUT the CPLD cheats. It monitors the CPU bus for signs of the auto-configuration process.

But the CDTV has a different autoconfig process due to the presence of the DMAC. So the cheat doesn't work.

A tiny change to the cheat logic in the CPLD and it will work in a CDTV.

Last edited by alexh; 11 April 2018 at 12:00.
alexh is online now  
Old 11 April 2018, 13:26   #11
scrappysphinx
Registered User

scrappysphinx's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jan 2008
Location: Nottingham
Age: 36
Posts: 469
Quick update, after pm'ing mkl on amibay he informed me my board has six pins on the edge connector and the first pin is ground, after moving the connector over one pin i now see the kickstart screen and when booting from floppy 8mb ram is available.

I cannot however get a hdd to boot, no dh0 listed in early boot menu and amiga immediately goes to kickstart screen. I hear the hdd spin up but not accessed. I have verified both INT and OVR signals with multimeter. Signals are taken from the edge connector on the 500+.

Thought it best to try and make sure its working in a system its intended for before moving it to the CDTV.
scrappysphinx is offline  
Old 11 April 2018, 15:22   #12
alexh
Thalion Webshrine
alexh's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jan 2004
Location: Oxford
Posts: 12,590
Which Kickstart? Can you try a CF->IDE adaptor instead of a HDD?
alexh is online now  
Old 11 April 2018, 15:53   #13
scrappysphinx
Registered User

scrappysphinx's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jan 2008
Location: Nottingham
Age: 36
Posts: 469
I have tried both KS 2.05 (37.300) and 3.1 standard and custom with updated scsi.device

I don't have a CF IDE thing as i use proper hdd's

Tried two working drives from 1200 tower, one 8gb one 40gb, both are already partitioned and setup with classicwb and boot fine in UAE and on the 1200.

Tried a new blank drive and booted from 3.1 install floppy, hdtoolbox finds no drives.

Tried 40 and 80 pin ide cables

Tried powering the hdd from the floppy header, using an external hdd psu and finally a converted atx psu to power the amiga and one of the molex for the hdd so i don't think power is an issue.

I have been talking to MKL via pm on Amibay and is offering help and has suggested sending a replacement board. I was hoping we can get this one working before it came to that though
scrappysphinx is offline  
Old 11 April 2018, 18:17   #14
scrappysphinx
Registered User

scrappysphinx's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jan 2008
Location: Nottingham
Age: 36
Posts: 469
Ok things have got weird, i put an official 2.05 rom back in and the hdd booted...

Put a 3.1 rom back (ok its a burned rom but nothing changed, completely stock) and hdd doesn't boot.

Put the same 3.1 rom in an a600 and it boots from the 2.5" header!!

Put in a 3.1 with updated scsi.device and again no boot, same updated rom in the 600 again boots fine....

Not sure where i'm going wrong lol
scrappysphinx is offline  
Old 11 April 2018, 19:25   #15
scrappysphinx
Registered User

scrappysphinx's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jan 2008
Location: Nottingham
Age: 36
Posts: 469
Ok, so i've burned a new rom. Standard 3.1 to a brand new 27c400 chip.

HDD now boots into classicwb but about 10-15 seconds after opening any program the screen corrupts as in the attached picture
Attached Thumbnails
Click image for larger version

Name:	IMG_20180411_171621.jpg
Views:	124
Size:	161.8 KB
ID:	57786  
scrappysphinx is offline  
Old 14 April 2018, 15:37   #16
scrappysphinx
Registered User

scrappysphinx's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jan 2008
Location: Nottingham
Age: 36
Posts: 469
Hi again, so i now have the board in my CDTV and i can see the HDD LED flashing before it reboots and comes back with a software failure message. I believe its running out of ram while trying to boot ClassicWB.

I understand the ram is not autoconfig and needs to be added. This is where i'm getting stuck now.

Can anyone break down for me what i need to do to get the ram working?
I have downloaded Addram301 from Aminet but i don't know what to add to the startup sequence or wherever to use it

Thanks
scrappysphinx is offline  
Old 14 April 2018, 17:33   #17
scrappysphinx
Registered User

scrappysphinx's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jan 2008
Location: Nottingham
Age: 36
Posts: 469
All sorted. Had to find the memory address start and end. All working on a basic 3.1 install. Now to try and get Classicwb working
scrappysphinx is offline  
Old 15 April 2018, 15:00   #18
ChadsArcade
Registered User

 
Join Date: Jan 2018
Location: Chorley
Posts: 25
I'd be interested to hear how much chip mem you have left after ClassicWB loads. 2/3 or so of mine is consumed after booting to a fairly vanilla WB install. I really wish these boards did auto configure...
ChadsArcade is offline  
Old 17 April 2018, 01:33   #19
scrappysphinx
Registered User

scrappysphinx's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jan 2008
Location: Nottingham
Age: 36
Posts: 469
After booting into classicwb I have about 100kb chip ram left but if I do an immediate soft reboot I boot with approx 800kb chip ram available because the addmem is resident and it uses the 8mb fast ram as part of the boot up.
scrappysphinx is offline  
Old 17 April 2018, 01:42   #20
scrappysphinx
Registered User

scrappysphinx's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jan 2008
Location: Nottingham
Age: 36
Posts: 469
Here is the current state of my cdtv.

I have a 1.3/3.1 dual kickstart ROM fitted, when booting as ks1.3 it boots as a stock cdtv, when set to 3.1 it boots into classicwb. The switch will be mounted into the expansion plate with the two DB9 ports.

I have soldered wires to the underside of the motherboard for the two DB9 mouse and joystick ports which will be mounted to the expansion back plate.

A couple of the front panel wires broke and those white clips were rediculously difficult to open so I desoldered them and soldered the front panel wires directly to the motherboard.

Classicwb is running from a 10gb Seagate HDD (old Xbox HDD) partition. With PFS3 as a 500mb workbench and the rest as one large partition dh1
(Using loadmodule to softkick a new scsi.device to access the large partition)

Space in the bottom of the cdtv is limited so I will be replacing the HDD with an ide SD adapter

The front card reader has been removed and I purchased a 3d printed front panel for the gotek drive which will be internalised once the front panel arrives.

Today I cut the slot in the motherboard tray and soldered the floppy ribbon to the bottom of the motherboard.

Cd drive works in classicwb too.

Left to do:

Purchase a megachip kit from amibay to expand the chipram to 2mb

Buy a new gotek (the one in the picture doesn't work properly and disk changes don't work)

Buy the SD IDE adapter and mount it internally



















Sent from my ONEPLUS A3003 using Tapatalk
scrappysphinx is offline  
 


Currently Active Users Viewing This Thread: 1 (0 members and 1 guests)
 
Thread Tools

Similar Threads
Thread Thread Starter Forum Replies Last Post
How to build custom kickstart for mkl ide + RAM? ChefDeadpool support.Hardware 5 19 April 2018 11:22
CDTV and MKL's ide utri007 Hardware mods 2 24 September 2015 08:19
Kipper2k 8MB+IDE Installation Guide Photon support.Hardware 24 08 July 2014 19:51
A2000 8mb fastmem with IDE install kipper2k Hardware mods 4 20 November 2013 22:10
Please help: CF/IDE workbench install guide required for NOOB :) kakashi_hatake support.WinUAE 19 17 May 2011 15:54

Posting Rules
You may not post new threads
You may not post replies
You may not post attachments
You may not edit your posts

BB code is On
Smilies are On
[IMG] code is On
HTML code is Off

Forum Jump


All times are GMT +2. The time now is 17:33.


Powered by vBulletin® Version 3.8.11
Copyright ©2000 - 2021, vBulletin Solutions Inc.
Page generated in 0.13592 seconds with 15 queries