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Old 11 October 2017, 18:59   #403
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Join Date: May 2001
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Originally Posted by Brick Nash View Post
Akira, I think people are misunderstanding me and assuming I'm wanting to avoid learning the more technical side of things.
Not at all. At least not from me. I am giving general advice for anyone interested in making Amiga games. I am on the same boat and I cannot really grasp ASM on the Amiga fully, or how the machine works. So I am sharing my approach.

Additionally, I think that statements like "Someone who cannot realize the transferable skills present in a tutorial based on the creation of demos, maybe should reconsider making games for Amiga". That sounds very much like "If you're not smart enough then tough" and maybe that's partly why the homebrew scene isn't as strong as it could be?
I resent that you quoted half of what I said. The second part says: "start training in programming in general and also try to understand game design first". A lot of people never programmed a thing and the first thing they want to do is an Amiga game. That's only for special people who could figure it out, most of us would come out damaged from the experience.

I didn't say "if you are not smart enough fuck you", it says "start with something more manageable at first and then get into the Amiga".

But I did imply that making stuff for Amiga isn't a walk in the park. There's a lot of effort involved and one must be willing to do so.

Just somehow link what's happening on screen to game making, even if it's highly simplified.
But here's the thing: there's nothing to "show for" when you are initializing the Amiga, shutting down the OS or things like that. All things you can learn from any other tutorial, Photon's included. This is why I recommended anyone to look at stuff like that too.

There's a lot of boring shit you have to learn and do before you can even plonk a funny sprite and move it on screen much like this demonstration on the C64:
[ Show youtube player ]
See how easy that is? And would be almost as simple in 6502 asm. Almost.

You want a recipe? Here's mine:

- Learn a simple machine first, let's say C64. Program it in BASIC
- Move onto 6502 ASM for the C64. You will be able to directly and quickly make the connection between what you did in BASIC and what you have to do in ASM.
- Get into Blitz Basic, which will let you start with BASIC and learn the Amiga platform, while it will also allow you to add in-line assembler as you need and learn it
- Finally have a go at full assembler after having made a bunch of stuff in Blitz

This is not as simple as "recipe for making soup". Unfortunately you have to learn a lot of spanner-head shit that is in the way for you to get to the fun stuff, and if you plonk yourself directly into 68k asm and Amiga, you might end up discouraged. Even with Blitz if you don't use assembler, you end to understand how the chipset works, how a blitter is used, etc. On a C64, you poke a value to an address and it will do a funny thing immediately.

I get this is why a bunch of people use Backbone, but that ends up in a shitty result. A middle ground has to be met, and it won't be quick or easy, but you can ease in to it rather than become a martyr and go head first into it and get demotivated at how annoying it is to understand.
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