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Old 07 November 2009, 03:16   #162
Dan Locke
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Join Date: Oct 2009
Location: USA
Posts: 111
Quote:
Originally Posted by Galahad/FLT View Post
No you don't, you seem to have a hangup about more channels automatically means better sound
Because it does, in the same way that the Amiga's graphics are better than the ST's because they have more colors and faster scrolling.

Quote:
Originally Posted by Galahad/FLT View Post
Amiga music on the whole didn't rely on sound from the processor, PAULA was used to play samples, i.e. not limited to what the hardware could produce.
You're confusing me. I can't make head or tail of that sentence. Paula was used to play samples because Paula was a sample-based chip rather than a waveform-based chip. It's not like the 8-bit computers that used the CPU to help the PSG.

Quote:
Originally Posted by Galahad/FLT View Post
Megabit or Megabyte? Console owners love to get that one confused!
MegaBYTE. Converted from 48 megaBITS. I frankly don't know why "megabit" even exists as a term, but that's what I found.

Quote:
Originally Posted by Galahad/FLT View Post
You gave the example not me, I simply countered it, quite effectively it would seem!
What did you counter, and with what? Which "example" did I give of what?

Quote:
Originally Posted by Galahad/FLT View Post
Did consoles REALLY run EVERYTHING from ROM on the cartridges? I politely suggest you get yourself informed, whats the point of VRAM if it'll just run it from ROM??
You know, I'm glad that you asked. I just did some research, and apparently the SNES uses DMA to transfer data from the cartridge ROM to the onboard VRAM. So, while it may not run things directly from ROM, the transition is so fast and seamless that it makes no difference! And that is why the SNES's 128 KB of onboard RAM is not comparable to the Amiga's 1 MB!

Quote:
Originally Posted by Galahad/FLT View Post
And yet the Amiga is blessed with thousands upon thousands of modules and TFMX tunes that precisely demonstrate just how much skill Amiga musicians had, because they sure as hell sound better than most of the stuff on the SNES..
Which has nothing to do with the fact that the SNES was a console, right? Right?

Oh, wait, it does.

Quote:
Originally Posted by Galahad/FLT View Post
You seem adroitly capable of forgetting that the Amiga was a machine ANYONE could get involved and create something, hence the plethora of BETTER sounding music on Amiga. Damn that machine and its lousy 8bit 4 channel sound!
Well, of course the machine with people who do nothing on it BUT music is going to have better music from an AESTHETIC point of view than the machine with BETTER HARDWARE but far less emphasis on the music MADE WITH IT. I said that it had better sound hardware, not better music. I hardly ever listen to SNES music because music was much less of a priority on the SNES, and it was consequently inferior to the Amiga's, which had the demoscene behind it.

Quote:
Originally Posted by Galahad/FLT View Post
You'll have to do better than that i'm afraid, that book is a little too generic in its figures. Fact is, the Amiga 500 outsold the Atari 520 STfm by quite a margin before the their time was up, not even bothering to lump in the A500+ and the A600. Your book (hardcover or otherwise!) puts in ST, STF, STFM, STE, 520, 1040, Mega, and i'm pretty sure it even lumps in TT sales as being 'ST' as well.
I bet that it doesn't lump in TT sales, and it wouldn't make much of a difference if it did, seeing as it was so unpopular. But I wasn't comparing the sales of the 500 and 520STFM; I was comparing the sales of the Amiga RANGE to the ST RANGE. I suppose that you could make the case that Macs outsell PCs because the MacBook outsells the HP Blackhawk.

Quote:
Originally Posted by Galahad/FLT View Post
I didn't say it was, I was merely explaining that the turnaround on Amiga games was quicker, which goes back to the point you made a while ago about why Amiga games had such a short lifespan. Feel free to go re-read it, i'm of the mind I can't be arsed to repeat myself for your convenience.
But I wasn't making a point about their lifespans. I was talking about how developers INTERPRETED those lifespans.

Quote:
Originally Posted by Galahad/FLT View Post
I'm not interested in defending anyone else
Then don't mention anyone else!

Quote:
Originally Posted by Galahad/FLT View Post
i'm directly responding to you, no-one else. Do try and keep up now!
I have been.

Quote:
Originally Posted by Galahad/FLT View Post
Jesus wept, did you just goto pre-school to dig up that response?!?!?! What kind of childish bullshit was that?
Only the kind that pertains to the topic at hand. You said that the consoles' platforming library was no better than the Amiga's, I said that it is, you said that you didn't care because 40 good platformers is enough, and then I said that it doesn't change the fact that the consoles have more high-quality platformers than the Amiga does. Got it?

Quote:
Originally Posted by Galahad/FLT View Post
Quite clearly, yet more platformers in a market oversaturated with platformers is not welcome, I would have thought that was abundantly obvious, but if your want is to subsist on a diet of only platformers and shoot-em-ups with the odd RPG, be my guest, thats my idea of a lack of originality, and an audience that is as banal as it is easily pleased.... or so they think!
I actually like adventure games (of both point-and-click and text-based varieties), flight simulators, and puzzle games (real puzzle games, not this match-3 garbage that's clogging the casual market these days). I can't stand RPGs at all.

Quote:
Originally Posted by Galahad/FLT View Post
But it wasn't just sofware companies, development teams disbanded, joined others, did they delete all their old code, or did they bring it along? What do you reckon to Aladdin, Lion King, Cool Spot, Global Gladiators? Its all the same bloody code, you think this was a rare occurence? Broaden your mind mate for gods sake!
My mind is quite "broad" enough, thank you very much. I know that game engines were recycled (look at Earthworm Jim and Doom Troopers for a prime example), but you're acting like every console game uses the same engine as every other console game.

Quote:
Originally Posted by Galahad/FLT View Post
Not really the point is it? That makes the suggestion that there were no bad developers on Genesis and SNES, and thats clearly not the case.
No, it "makes the suggestion" that, while the console developers were sometimes terrible, they still were better on average than the Amiga's developers - which, considering that the Amiga was a far more accessible platform, is just what you'd expect. I'm not knocking the Amiga (it's my favorite system of all time), just some of its developers. There are plenty of Amiga games that I absolutely love (Flashback especially), but not as many as there are on the consoles. Conversely, the consoles have fewer absolutely horrible games than the Amiga does (though Awesome Possum proves that they still have them).

Quote:
Originally Posted by Galahad/FLT View Post
Because its deceitful.
Believe me; if I wanted to twist your words, I could do a far better job of it.

Quote:
Originally Posted by Galahad/FLT View Post
You selectively picking out sentences in a paragraph to question me on something that is only inferred by you snipping what I wrote. If you can't see a problem with that, I would suggest you read up on how to debate properly.
If I'm going to quote something to set up my response, I'm only going to quote the part that sets up my response. I didn't mention your assertion that the consoles also had poor developers because, frankly, it had nothing to do with the part that I was responding to. I would have quoted the rest of your post a line down if I had anything meaningful to say about it, but I didn't. Either your following statement was in agreement with the part that I quoted (it was) or it was contradictory (it wasn't). Either way, what difference does it make? Here, I'll make a Venn diagram to illustrate the point that I made:



Home computers are much more accessible platforms than consoles, as a result, they attract more bad developers than consoles do. Conversely, the consoles attract more good developers, because they know that console owners have higher expectations for a machine that's designed do do nothing but play games.

Quote:
Originally Posted by Retro-Nerd View Post
Sorry, no comment this time. It speaks for itself. This generalized phrase is ridiculous, and "Fanboys" is the first word i usually hear if somebody lacks good arguments.
Hey, I'm a huge Amiga fan, and I happen to like more console games than I do Amiga games, even though I don't care a whit about the consoles themselves. Capisce?

Last edited by Dan Locke; 07 November 2009 at 03:29.
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