Thread: Bloat
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Old 05 October 2001, 23:55   #11
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Join Date: Jul 2001
Location: Denmark
Posts: 2,284
Originally posted by Shadowfire
[B]Yes, the Amiga is an older, simpler computer. It was much easier to make an OS stable when it only took up 256k of space. Of course, Windows does much more than AmigaDOS ever did, so of course it's bigger.
I agree that Windows has it size from somewhere. And that Workbench haven't been completely unstable for me always either. Still Workbench has been far more stable than my Win9x. That's because of non-standard products.

When people start whining about Windows being bugged, that 95% of the time it's "pilot error" [thats a nice way of saying the user screwed up] and 5% of the time it's "hardware error". <1% of the time is it "Windows error".
Dang I've been blessed with a computer within the last 5% it seems. My whole system is a bleeding hardware conflict. Hurray for standards which define something about how things should work.

By pilot error I mean: screwing around with things you shouldn't be touching (registry/.ini settings, or **installing beta software**)
By pilot error you obviously also mean installing drivers for your software, the newest even. Or is that considered Beta too? I installed DX 8. It crashed my system completely, the only way to prevent it from sending everything crashing is to make sure not to install any drivers other than windows Standard drivers before touching that. Then there are still things which crash frequently. Of course I'd need drivers to use my hardware otherwise it wouldn't be right right? Ok so my system is now running with the newest NON-beta drivers. It still crashes a lot. Why? Other 3rd party products? I've managed to get a blue screen and complete crashes by installing windows, DX, and new drivers and then updating IE. That's all it takes to get me a blue screen. Again it seems random when it decides to do it. And now answer me honestly. If no 3rd party software whatsoever was to be installed, would that mean nothing but windows? HEY I CAN LOOK AT MY DESKTOP *Desktop blue screens for some reason*

A lot of people complain "windows SUCKZ it crashes all the time". What these people don't realize (or choose to ignore) is that Windows is only a part of what's running on your system: applications and 3rd party device drivers all have the run of your system (ESPECIALLY on Win9X).
Standards again are a thing of the past. Drivers are needed to use the hardware, otherwise it won't work right.

you don't ever need to use 8.3 filenames inside Windows programs. It's there for the DOS box.
So you're saying that unless you use DOS specific programs you won't have a problem with 8.3 filenames? Please do tell that to all my burner programs. When trying to put together a CD from files scattered around the harddisk which have the same 9 first characters and the same 3 last characters it will do it right. Unless of course you intend to put the files in the same subdir at which point it will tell you there's a filename conflict even though maybe windows hides it from you normally. If you move the file to the same dir windows will be so nice as to change the filename and update it's table or whatever it stores the long filenames in for you.

As for Memory. Well Windows is a big memory hog, and with good reason too. Problem is as you said software which doesn't give back your memory. Workbench had this problem as well with some kinds of software.

Finally, if they were to release a Workbench today for the PC that was competitive with Windows, it would BE Windows.
Correct me if I'm wrong. But didn't workbench use direct browsing of your filesystem, and icons you could activate for more than minimized programs on the desktop long before Windows started using that? As for other OSes I don't know how they work.

And if you crave stability, stop running all those beta programs & device drivers-
- in fact. Stop running other drivers at all. Just use the windows standard drivers which will allow you stunning 256 color graphics in 640x480 mode if you're lucky.

* Don't get a bleeding edge ATI video card. Get something like a Geforce instead which has had 2 or 3 years of bugfixing in its drivers.
And if someone want this piece of sh*t GeForce I've got here I could have a good reason to get me a properly working graphics card. I just bought Megaman X4 for the PC today because it happened to be a good platform game from before the 3D nonsense era, only to find to my (not really) surprise that it wasn't able to pull the game at the full speed because of the GeForce's crippling 2D capabilities.

* Don't get a "noname" soundcard. Actually, as far as soundcards go, at this point in time if you're willing to do without fancy 3D audio, and have an ISA slot, a Soundblaster 16 or AWE32 is the ideal card, Windows drivers have had about 6 years to mature, does stereo 16-bit audio, great DOS compatibility for those old games, etc. The SBLive! still can have issues under Windows 2000.
I have a SBlive now. It works a lot better for me (i think, maybe it's also conflicting with my hardware, it seems to be what's keeping my Emulation speed down) than my AWE32 which sent my old computer crashing every 5 minutes in spite of the latest RELEASED-CREATIVE-NON-BETA drivers. Here I go again with the standards. There ought to be some. I know the Amiga isn't without issues, but as far as I know there are clearly defined standards which ensure better compatibility.

* TRY to AVOID USB devices if you can. USB is *still* experiencing unpleasant growing pains. The only thing I seriously recommend using USB for is game controllers.
BTW. USB has been given up. Thank god for that. My USB still doesn't work one bit. Well maybe a bit if you consider spitting out random AscII characters on the printer.

* DO go to Windowsupdate frequently and download the critical updates!
-definition of update : Take out old Bugs. Put in new bugs.
The amount of new bugs can easily be calculated with this formula

NB = RB * 2
where NB is new bugs and RB is the amount of old bugs

I'm not going to say the Amiga is completely problem free, and that it would be much better than the PC if it was updated as regularly. That would be impossible. What I'm saying is that the Amiga hard/software from what I know (very little) seems loads more stable and compatible than the PC (at least from where I'm standing). It would of course have it's disadvantages too. No system can be without it, but saying Micro$oft is the only way to go is wrong. The only reason that might be right is because of M$'s aggressive marketing which have kicked most of the competition out of the way. They have the power to do virtually what they want because there are so many users.

Internal Memos which have been leaked seem to indicate M$ is seeing Linux as a threat. You should rest assure M$ will find a way to try and kick out Linux from the Market.

Take IE. Why is that so much better at working with all pages than the other browsers? Because M$ conveniently changed the standard HTML conventions to fit them. There are clearly defined outlines as to how HTML tags should be made. M$ changed their browser's specifications so what would be 100% compliant with the HTML standard would not work right with IE and because so many people use IE by default (standard browser in newer Windows) those people trying to make alternatives are having a very hard time because they can't just make it like the standard if it has to be good. It also has to be MS-standard.

As for the DOS Windows 9x is built on (I know you say it isn't, but it's still running on top of DOS, you can actually prevent the "it's now safe to turn off your computer" from coming up and just dump you back in dos instead) I quite like that since many of the good games on the PC doesn't really work with Windows. Another reason M$ is so powerful. Many games were developed for the M$ system. Jumping ship to more stable solutions would mean leaving a lot (and I mean a LOT) behind. I wouldn't cry too much over the ability to play such games as UT, Aliens vs. predator or hot-dang-here's-a-new-3D-game. But I'd miss the DOS games and the early windows games which were actually good some of them. I bought my Amiga mostly because of those games which I had played a lot of on the PC (and because I remembered some games which never made it). The PC was not working with them anymore, and the games didn't really look all that good either.

Well I think this is more than enough to write, I've made a lot of mistakes in this post and made a real idiot of myself. No need to take it further I think.

I think the bottom line is. In spite of it's crashing nature I still like my PC, though there are fewer and fewer games which work (I want to play Simon but my Creative shitboard won't let me) properly it's still what I use most. There are still games developed which I think are good, in spite of the 3D graphics which some people diss. Just remember. Because it's 3D it isn't nescesarily better. Take Oddworld : Abe's oddysee and Abe's exoddus. 2D games, albeit a bit old now they're still examples of good PC games (Probably because they originated on the PSX). I had hoped to see the next game on the PC, but it seems M$ slipped some money under the table and now the game seems to become X-box only. I don't play much any longer anyway, it's just not really fun any more. When I do play there's greater chance that I'll fire up my Amiga and use that than me using a PC game.

Just please don't go kicking the things about like this. Everything isn't black and white. The PC isn't nescesarily the bad guy.

And don't go praising the Amiga too much either. It would probably be coping with many of the same problems did it get as many different manufacturers.

Last edited by Drake1009; 06 October 2001 at 00:06.
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