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Old 13 July 2015, 14:16   #222
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Originally Posted by Daedalus View Post
I just picked that number from the air. Yes, parts would be cheap but development not. Think of the cost of the existing custom USB solutions - you'd need similar levels of development with a similar raw materials cost so it's not too far a stretch to think that adding USB to the board would add a cost not far off that of the stand-alone card.
Don't get me wrong but HW is not problem - XMOS 4 - 6 core (tiles) CPU cost in single quantities around 4 - 5$ , PCB, some buffer logic i would estimate for 5$ additionally with assembly.
Based on XMOS you can emulate MC68000 bus in real time (so no need to use CPLD/FPGA) and as such any I/O connected to it. So cost are realistic - rest is code - and i agree programmer (especially good one) work is costly (but i assume also that people doing things for Amiga are more like hobbyist - this however can be different from Jens perspective).
I think 50E (and not less even for small board) is simple price of such things - you spent more on cinema ticket for two or lunch in restaurant (i mean real restaurant not McDonald or KFC) so... so why bother?
Every hobby is expensive (except collecting bier canes maybe ).
Jens doing this as main business so i don't blame him - fact that he is one of the last dedicated to small/classic computer make his work even more impressive.

Originally Posted by Daedalus View Post
As for the cost of the Raspberry Pi, there are a couple of reasons for this: First is the volume of Raspberry Pis produced which is already around 50,000 times higher than the number of boards Jens will sell. That's a different galaxy when it comes to economies of scale, buying parts etc. Second, the RPi is a not-for-profit venture so no profit is included in the price. This also means the RPi Foundation can avoid taxes and so on which reduces the cost even further. And third, it's using a SoC design that already includes pretty much all the interfacing electronics that are needed "for free", which is certainly not the case for the Amiga motherboard.

Don't get me wrong, I'd love to see USB etc. on this new board too, but it doesn't make sense to include all the things that anyone wants when it will increase the price for everyone. I'd much rather pay €350 for a board and modules that does what I want it to do than €450 for an all-in-one board that does a lot of stuff that I don't want.
Well and this is my point or Jens focus on people willing to pay for something worth maybe 10$ for example 350$ or on hobbyists for 25$.
Not sure what Jens planning but on one side he may prefer to sell 50 boards for 350$ instead 350 board for 25$ - less work, better money...
What You will do on his side?

To conclude - i believe such board should not happen but if it happen this new board should offer improvements (for example CPLD/FPGA UMA bridge to overcome CHIP<>CPU limitations [and looks like this was addressed by Jens - so UMA and AGA cycles are no longer limiation] - not some strange DSP connectors etc).
I have more than few of old Amiga units - some of them intended to be source for parts (how many working A500 you can have/may need ? 2? 3?).

Originally Posted by dJOS View Post
And that's why I suggested integrating a cheap soc as a co pro to run the extra hw. In theory you could use the soc to offload all the tcp IP, usb, auto config management etc.

Anyway, unfortunately I'm not a developer so I've no idea how hard this would be.
Well i have this idea from a long time and i expressed this multiple times - you can even imagine to feed video data in digital way from Denise to MIPI port in RPi and as such overlay Amiga video over normal RPi video so in theory RPi can be fancy flicker fixer with 3D, GPGPU etc - yes, board with such capabilities will be more costly than RPi itself but with RPi you should be able to fit inside 100$(E).
You can even go further and try to emulate MC68000 on RPi so no real CPU need to be used (some FPGA based glue logic required to interface classic Amiga chips with RPi is necessary for more complex task but it can be part UMA bridge and MIPI port).

Last edited by pandy71; 13 July 2015 at 14:26.
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