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-   -   Normal 34-pin floppy drive on external 26-pin roctec (http://eab.abime.net/showthread.php?t=66905)

SilverZguru 06 December 2012 13:38

Normal 34-pin floppy drive on external 26-pin roctec
 
Hi all!
This is my first post here, so sorry if this is on wrong thread or something...
but yeah, I have tried few pinouts now to install normal (modified to support READY signal and jumper set to DS0) 34pin pc drive to my slimline external fdd, which has 26pin connector, but without any kind of success.

I use normal PC power supply to give the +12v for fdd and resoldered 26pin connector to 34pin with this pinout: http://www.king27.freeserve.co.uk/3....es/citizen.htm

All I get is "DF1:BAD, DF2:BAD and DF3:BAD" on workbench. The drive does click few times when loading Workbench, but everything else is wrong.

I have really no idea anymore what to do, and because the original 26-pin Citizen drive from my external drive is faulty (not broken belt, because drive is running well, just giving some READ/WRITE errors all the time), I don't have any external drive for now.

Thanks all!

prowler 06 December 2012 21:40

Quote:

Originally Posted by SilverZguru (Post 854614)
I have tried few pinouts now to install normal (modified to support READY signal and jumper set to DS0) 34pin pc drive to my slimline external fdd, which has 26pin connector, but without any kind of success.

I use normal PC power supply to give the +12v for fdd and resoldered 26pin connector to 34pin with this pinout: http://www.king27.freeserve.co.uk/3....es/citizen.htm

Note that most 3½-inch 34-pin PC floppy drives don't have an internal connection to the the +12V PSU line, so your provision of a separate +12V line is probably not required.

First, please provide exact details of the make and model of the 3½-inch PC floppy drive and your modifications to support the READY signal and DS0 jumper setting.

Incidentally, have you checked that the modified drive works correctly when connected to the internal floppy drive port of your Amiga?

Second, please provide exact details of the pin-to-pin connections you have made between the Roctec's 26-way floppy ribbon cable and the new 34-pin floppy connector.

Without this information, no-one here will be able to help you.

cpiac64 06 December 2012 22:22

i have changed the citizen with a slim floppy from notebook and work fine but is very small for case of rocteck

the electronic card on rocteck have one chip for adapter signal from floppy standard 26 pin, you need solder 34 pin before this chip and modify the floppy standard 34 pin for compatibilty with amiga

if you need more info, i am here

SilverZguru 07 December 2012 15:28

Quote:

Originally Posted by prowler (Post 854688)
Note that most 3½-inch 34-pin PC floppy drives don't have an internal connection to the the +12V PSU line, so your provision of a separate +12V line is probably not required.

First, please provide exact details of the make and model of the 3½-inch PC floppy drive and your modifications to support the READY signal and DS0 jumper setting.

Incidentally, have you checked that the modified drive works correctly when connected to the internal floppy drive port of your Amiga?

Second, please provide exact details of the pin-to-pin connections you have made between the Roctec's 26-way floppy ribbon cable and the new 34-pin floppy connector.

Without this information, no-one here will be able to help you.

Sorry, I meant +5v... my mistake.
Okay, so my floppy drive I modified is Panasonic JU-257A605P. I used Jope's tutorial how to mod it: http://eab.abime.net/showthread.php?t=30944
This model was easier to mod than Jope's, coz this has DS0-DS1 switch.

And, I have tested this fdd in my Amiga's internal port (DF0) and it worked perfect (including the ready signal).

About the pinouts, I used this table for 26pin: http://www.king27.freeserve.co.uk/3....es/citizen.htm

and this for 34pin:
http://www.martinruss.com/sy99adapter.html (I have tried the 26pin one on this site too, but it didn't work.)

So all I did was that I connected every wire that upper 26pin pinout link says and then compared to the 34pin table. I'm pretty sure that the table for 26pin is completely wrong coz its for Amstrad. But I just can't find one for external Amiga floppy drive.


And for cpiac64:

How did you add support for READY signal on that drive? I have 2 laptop 26pin drives lying on my desk, but can't know how to put them support READY.

prowler 07 December 2012 21:20

Thanks for completing the picture, SilverZguru. :)

Quote:

Originally Posted by SilverZguru (Post 854808)
Sorry, I meant +5v... my mistake.
Okay, so my floppy drive I modified is Panasonic JU-257A605P. I used Jope's tutorial how to mod it: http://eab.abime.net/showthread.php?t=30944
This model was easier to mod than Jope's, coz this has DS0-DS1 switch.

And, I have tested this fdd in my Amiga's internal port (DF0) and it worked perfect (including the ready signal).

Okay, so far, so good. :great

This confirms that the drive is perfectly compatible, and so the solution to the problem must be found by looking again at the interface between the 26-way ribbon cable and the 34-pin connector.

Quote:

Originally Posted by SilverZguru (Post 854808)
About the pinouts, I used this table for 26pin: http://www.king27.freeserve.co.uk/3....es/citizen.htm

and this for 34pin:
http://www.martinruss.com/sy99adapter.html (I have tried the 26pin one on this site too, but it didn't work.)

So all I did was that I connected every wire that upper 26pin pinout link says and then compared to the 34pin table. I'm pretty sure that the table for 26pin is completely wrong coz its for Amstrad. But I just can't find one for external Amiga floppy drive.

I'll study that information and then we'll see if my wiring diagram matches yours. ;)

cpiac64 07 December 2012 23:52

@silver, test with drive for pc original not modded, make only conversion from 34 to 26 pin

my small drive is an mitsubishi mf355h-343mw

SilverZguru 08 December 2012 10:16

1 Attachment(s)
Thanks alot! People are much more kinder here when nobody doesn't manage to answer anything helpful at Amiga.org.

ps. I attached a pdf which I did to show what I exactly soldered.

prowler 08 December 2012 20:55

Quote:

Originally Posted by SilverZguru (Post 854923)
Thanks alot! People are much more kinder here when nobody doesn't manage to answer anything helpful at Amiga.org.

We try our best. :)

Quote:

Originally Posted by SilverZguru (Post 854923)
ps. I attached a pdf which I did to show what I exactly soldered.

I appreciate that, Silver. Thanks! :great

I will be very busy over the next few days, but I won't forget about this. I'll try to have a look tomorrow.

prowler 09 December 2012 20:22

Hi Silver,

Here is my suggestion for the wiring, based on information at these web addresses:
http://pinouts.ru/Storage/InternalDisk_pinout.shtml
http://www.l8r.net/technical/t-diskdrive.shtml

Code:

26-pin  Conne      34-pin              Signal
cable  cted?    interface    Name            Description
1        No                      VCC                +5V
2        Yes          8        /INDEX              Index
3        No                      VCC                +5V
4        Yes        10        /DS0          Drive Select 0
5        No                      VCC                +5V
6        No                                    Not Connected
7        Yes        12        /DS1          Drive Select 1
8        Yes        34        /RDY      Drive Ready/Disk Changed
9        No                                    Not Connected
10      Yes        16        /MTRON          Motor Enable
11      No                                    Not Connected
12      Yes        18        /DIR            Direction
13      Yes        13          GND              Ground
14      Yes        20        /STEP              Step
15      Yes        15          GND              Ground
16      Yes        22        /WDATA            Write Data
17      Yes        17          GND              Ground
18      Yes        24        /WGATE  Write Gate/Floppy Write Enable
19      Yes        19          GND              Ground
20      Yes        26        /TRK0            Track 0
21      Yes        21          GND              Ground
22      Yes        28        /WPT            Write Protect
23      Yes        23          GND              Ground
24      Yes        30        /RDATA            Read Data
25      Yes  25,27,29,31,33    GND              Ground
26      Yes        32        /SIDE1            Head Select

The differences between this schematic and yours is due to the differences between the 34-pin tables for the Amiga floppy drive connections on the links above and on the link you referenced:
http://www.martinruss.com/sy99adapter.html

SilverZguru 11 December 2012 18:20

Thanks so much Prowler! :)

But when tested, it gave me exactly same results as my first pinout :(
And now my test-Amiga shows "DF1:BAD, DF2:BAD and DF3:BAD" even if the external floppy drive isn't connected :sad
Maybe it's impossible to get it working... and I don't want to break my other fully working Amiga.

prowler 11 December 2012 19:35

Quote:

Originally Posted by SilverZguru (Post 855454)
Thanks so much Prowler! :)

But when tested, it gave me exactly same results as my first pinout :(
And now my test-Amiga shows "DF1:BAD, DF2:BAD and DF3:BAD" even if the external floppy drive isn't connected :sad

Hmm... If the Amiga is showing "DF1:BAD, DF2:BAD and DF3:BAD" - even with no external floppy drive connected, then it sounds like the external drive port may be faulty.

Quote:

Originally Posted by SilverZguru (Post 855454)
Maybe it's impossible to get it working... and I don't want to break my other fully working Amiga.

I'm sure I have a Rotec external Amiga floppy drive myself somewhere - with a broken drive mechanism IIRC (the drive belts usually snap). If I can find it - and it has a 26-pin interface - I'll try some experiments with it and a 34-pin drive. :)

SilverZguru 12 December 2012 17:44

That would be awesome Prowler! :)
I'm so stuck now that I really need some advices...

But thanks again!

Mrs Beanbag 13 December 2012 13:06

I am also interested in this, I'm thinking it would be cool to get a slimline floppy working as internal DF0 and have room for a slimline CD ROM on the right-hand side as well, with a few case mods.

SilverZguru 15 December 2012 09:01

I tried to connect 26pin micro floppy drive from laptop. Now its better, I only get "DF1:BAD" (using my other amiga which doesnt have the faulty port), but the drive doesnt click or do anything...

cpiac64, didnt you get a normal laptop drive working? Can you tell me exactly what you did? Thanks!

cpiac64 15 December 2012 20:23

i add a photo soon

prowler 15 December 2012 21:05

Quote:

Originally Posted by SilverZguru (Post 856218)
I tried to connect 26pin micro floppy drive from laptop. Now its better, I only get "DF1:BAD" (using my other amiga which doesnt have the faulty port), but the drive doesnt click or do anything...

What happens if you use my schematic for the 34-pin wiring, but leave the /DS1 signal disconnected (26-pin cable pin 7, 34-pin interface pin 12)?

I'm not familiar at all with the 26-pin floppy interface, and I haven't had a chance to look for my Roctec external drive yet, but I'm just wondering if the Roctec's internal electronics are converting the Amiga's /DS1, /DS2 and /DS3 signals into binary coded /DS0 and /DS1 signals at the Roctec's floppy disk drive unit end.

If this were the case, only /DS0 would need connecting to your 34-pin replacement drive, if the Roctec is the first external drive in the chain.

cpiac64 16 December 2012 16:39

1 Attachment(s)
Attachment 33469

pin one is red wire at sx

prowler 16 December 2012 23:13

I found my Roctec Amiga external floppy drive earlier this evening. :)

It's a slimline drive with an internal case height of 19mm. It has a belt-driven Citizen UODC-68A 5V, 420mA drive mechanism. Power and data connections are made via a 26-pin ribbon cable from a pcb interface with ON/OFF switch and 23-pin D-Type passthrough connector accessible from the rear panel.

The pcb interface has the identifying legend RF382C-A, which is the Roctec drive model number. The board carries two ICs - HD7404P TTL hex buffer and 18CV8PC-25 CMOS programmable electrically erasable logic device.

I had thought this drive didn't work when I tried it. I got it cheap from an eBay seller, so I wouldn't be surprised. However, the drive belt is intact, so I'm not so sure now.

Anyway, I can have a good play with it now. :spin

prowler 17 December 2012 00:38

Hey, I've just found these :):
http://www.king27.freeserve.co.uk/3.....5_general.htm
http://www.king27.freeserve.co.uk/3..../cable8256.htm

The difficulties of interfacing 34-pin drives with the 26-pin interface may be pinpointed in the ready signal and solutions paragraphs on those pages. We shall see...

SilverZguru 17 December 2012 16:12

1 Attachment(s)
Thanks a lot Prowler! That's something interesting to read. :) And yes, I knew that there will be some compatibility problems with 26pin and 34pin interfaces.

And Cpiac64, thanks for the picture! Do you have exact pinout or something how you did that. It really looks nice ;) As I told, I put those wires, but the drive is silent when I try to use it with amiga :(

EDIT:
I took picture from my connection of Roctec 26-pin to 26-pin pc micro floppy drive.
And those wires are not in short circuit even if it looks like that ;)


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