Babylonian Twins - An Amiga game?!

[viddi]

Have you guys heard of Babylonian Twins?

I found these vids on YouTube:

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=3dft1KbC3pw

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=TZIQBAIgcBk

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=qqyQ8BcPJA8

and so on...


It sounds and looks like an Amiga game and seems to be AWESOME! :shocked

[viddi]

Okay, I read the info. ;)

It is an Amiga game!

[TheCyberDruid]

Hmm, have a lookie here : http://www.pcmuseum.ca/details.asp?id=139&type=Poster
Other sources that it was a game developed in Iraq. I will search for more info now...

[Belgarath]

Indeed and it looks very good.

The guy who posted the vids still seems to be active on there, hopefully he can be contacted and convinced to share if it can't be found otherwise.

[TheCyberDruid]

Here is one of the developers : http://members.tripod.com/murtadha_t/games_design.htm

[Graham Humphrey]

It runs on a 512K Amiga? Very impressive indeed.

Here's hoping this can be released...

[CodyJarrett]

I'm looking into it now!

[Galahad/FLT]

Looks pretty ace actually.

[Retro-Nerd]

Here is one of the developers : http://members.tripod.com/murtadha_t/games_design.htm

The site is outdated, but i found another one. I've sent a mail to him, hopefully he answer. ;)

http://murtadha.info/

[Heavy Stylus]

Fingers crossed this gets a release!

[gklinger]

That looks brilliant. I wonder how close to completion it was when the project was shelved?

[CodyJarrett]

The site is outdated, but i found another one. I've sent a mail to him, hopefully he answer. ;)

http://murtadha.info/

I've already sent one too!

[Belgarath]

From the description and videos on youtube it seems it was 100% completed, just never released.

[Retro-Nerd]

Just got a mail from Murtadha. He was very pleased, but he doesn't have the game. So Murtadha gave me the address of his old friend Rabah, he could still have the disk images.

[keropi]

WOW!
looks awesome!

[TheCyberDruid]

Just got a mail from Murtadha. He was very pleased, but he doesn't have the game. So Murtadha gave me the address of his old friend Rabah, he could still have the disk images.

:great Thanks for taking the lead Retro :bowdown
I really hope you can manage to convince Rabah to share his disks if he still has the game.

[viddi]

Yep, thanks a lot. :)

[Old Fool]

Hmmm... Very interesting game idea indeed! To clear a level you have to play with two characters. It reminds somewhat Lost Vikings except there was three characters to play.

I think there is lack of games that two players would have to play together like we see in the video. For example to get a floating thingie you must jump to reach it on the top of other player. Sweet!

Also when palying with girlfriend it's fun to know that a pleasure could be your reward when you put your body on the top of the other! ;)

[Reynolds]

Hail for the whole team behind that game. Extreme circumstances, and still they are creating somewhat special. Respect.

[Shoonay]

wow, looks&sounds great indeed!

[Anubis]

The game looks really good.

Let's hope we will be able to get disk images. ;)

[nujack]

Awesome!!! Hopefully the game is not lost.

[vroom6sri]

Holy wow!

[Retroplay]

That game looks friggin awesome, especially concidering that it's only 512kb.
And an Amiga game made in Iraq. :shocked :great
I'll keep my fingers crossed that this baby will turn up sooner or later.

[Solid Snake]

Well spotted on youtube! I hope that the disk images turn up and then maybe AGTW http://agtw.abime.net/ will finally be updated?

[ungi]

Wow! Perfect looking game!!

[laser]

Viddi, great found but ....too late I think

that videos were uploaded to youtube 18 months ago and the author of this videos never answered any question made by the other youtube' fans

I suspect that the game on youtube is a game from another platform
that's fake.....it can't be an amiga game
smooth scroll + music + very good sound effects.......only 512k memory? ...it can't be



mmmmm....that's fake for me...it can be a non realesed PC game, SNES game or something like that

[Retro-Nerd]

Of course it's an Amiga game. Murtadha T. Salman already confirmed that he made this game, together with his friend Rabah Shibab and Mahir Hisham.

I'm still waiting for a respone from Rabah.

[Reynolds]

@laser: do you know the min. requirements af the Beast trilogy? It can be done.

[laser]

[Removed by Cody]

hey Cody...why you have removed my funny post ?

[Retro-Nerd]

Typical laser post, eh? ;)

[gklinger]

That wasn't very nice, laser. :(

Who cares what their names are or what religion they are or where they're from? For creating a game like that the deserve major :bowdown

I sure hope Babylonian Twins gets released.

[laser]

sincerally I really like this game and I want to play it and Im very impressed
but...this is strange

[demoniac]

Looks pretty ace actually.

Indeed.

[laser]

also I have discovery something strange

http://es.youtube.com/watch?v=3dft1KbC3pw

MIN 2:25

the year of the game...it says 1999 but the info on youtube says that was made on 1994...if anybody can check this please because Im old and blind



http://s2.subirimagenes.com/otros/previo/thump_1012421btwins1.jpg (http://www.subirimagenes.com/otros-btwins1-1012421.html)

so...an amiga game of this quality realized on 1999 ? playlable on the A500 without expansion?....looks fake

anyways I confide on Retro-Nerd' transactions...maybe he will convince the arabs and the game emerge

[Belgarath]

Looks to me like it says 1995.

[ppill]

It reminds me of Arabian Nights which I loved back in my A500 days. Sure would be nice to give this one a try.

[pcGTW_Webmaster]

Looks to me like it says 1995.
Exactly. It reads 1995, not 1999. No idea how someone can call that a fake. It's clearly an Amiga game, and something like this on an unexpanded A500 isn't that unique either.

[Sydric]

I'd like to introduce myself--my name is Syd Bolton and I run the Personal Computer Museum in Brantford, ON Canada (http://www.pcmuseum.ca).

I am also the president of LEGENDARY DESIGN TECHNOLOGIES, the company that actually owns the rights to this game.

First of all, let me assure you -- the game is REAL. We never released it because the environment of the Amiga had deteriorated so badly that the game would have never made it commercially.

I do have the disk images--in fact, I remember not that long ago I definitely created an Amiga of the demo.

I am torn about releasing the full game - but the demo I most definitely would not have an issue with.

I can also assure you that this is one awesome game. Right now, the only place you can play it is at the Personal Computer Museum, which is part of the charm of coming here and trying out new things. Kids that are comfortable with Mario seem to have little difficulty, although there are some advanced tricks in this game that take time to figure out.

Anyways, sounds like there is a lot of interest---if you have any other questions, let me know.

[laser]

I'd like to introduce myself--my name is Syd Bolton and I run the Personal Computer Museum in Brantford, ON Canada (http://www.pcmuseum.ca).

I am also the president of LEGENDARY DESIGN TECHNOLOGIES, the company that actually owns the rights to this game.

First of all, let me assure you -- the game is REAL. We never released it because the environment of the Amiga had deteriorated so badly that the game would have never made it commercially.

I do have the disk images--in fact, I remember not that long ago I definitely created an Amiga of the demo.

I am torn about releasing the full game - but the demo I most definitely would not have an issue with.

I can also assure you that this is one awesome game. Right now, the only place you can play it is at the Personal Computer Museum, which is part of the charm of coming here and trying out new things. Kids that are comfortable with Mario seem to have little difficulty, although there are some advanced tricks in this game that take time to figure out.

Anyways, sounds like there is a lot of interest---if you have any other questions, let me know.

Good NEWS !! ( I hope this is not a joke)


can you upload the demo please to aminet or any other site

we can't wait for the release...we 're desperate

btw, where you get the game? The game was made in Irak?

[cane]

It looks awesome :bowdown
I'd definitely like to play it...

[Graham Humphrey]

Hello Sydric and welcome to EAB :)

If you could release the demo that would be fantastic.

Can I ask why you're torn over releasing the full game?

[pcGTW_Webmaster]

I do have the disk images--in fact, I remember not that long ago I definitely created an Amiga of the demo.


You may want to contact the SPS guys (http://softpres.org) to preserve the game before the disks get unreadable. If it isn't too late already.

[Ironclaw]

It's would really be sad if such a great game, which is even COMPLETED, wouldn't be released to the public, even after so many years.

[Retro-Nerd]

I agree with Ironclaw. This game could be part of the Amiga history. Is there anything we can do to ease your decision to release the full game? :)

[pcGTW_Webmaster]

Guys, let him upload the demo before starting to annoy him with requests for releasing the full version. Otherwise, we may not see him here again. If he holds the rights to the game, it is up to him what to do with the full version.

[Sydric]

No, this is NOT a joke. I own the rights because my company, Legendary Design Technologies, was the publisher. Yes, the game is from Iraq. However, they had no way of publishing and no American publisher would touch them (I'm from Canada). I got an email recently from the lead developer who is now working at Peoplesoft in Vancouver, so he made it out.

I'll see what I can do about posting the demo---it may take me a week or so just so you know but I will do it.

As was mentioned in an earlier post, you can see the Poster art for the box (which no boxes were ever produced) but the artwork was done at the PC Museum website.

[Sydric]

OK just read page 2 :) It's NOT too late on the disk images. I run a MUSEUM - we know about preserving disk images and history -- in fact, that's WHY I have not as of yet released the full game--it's a unique thing to find in our museum (not to mention the disk is HEAVILY protected --- so we'll have to see if making an image of that one is easily possible at all anyways).

Play the demo when I post it and give me your feedback and we'll go from there.

[pcGTW_Webmaster]

(not to mention the disk is HEAVILY protected --- so we'll have to see if making an image of that one is easily possible at all anyways).

That's why I mentioned SPS. They can cope with almost every protection and create perfect images from the disks.

[viddi]

Play the demo when I post it and give me your feedback and we'll go from there.

Sounds good to me. Thanks for your efforts. :great

[Sydric]

Someone asked why I'm "torn" -- I thought I explained myself but there are many reasons. This is a gem I agree--but it's also one I have control over and once I release it, the uniqueness of that goes away. I also feel badly we never did get it released (just was not possible the way the Amiga was) and so Rabah and his team at Mesopotamia never got properly compensated for it. I know you guys are all anxious to play it, you just need to give me time to think about it.

When I created the ADF of the demo a while back I thought about releasing the whole thing, I just wasn't ready.

As for SPS - I'm not really comfortable sending the disk to anyone at this point. I have a Catweasal and we'll see what it does with it.

[pcGTW_Webmaster]

As for SPS - I'm not really comfortable sending the disk to anyone at this point. I have a Catweasal and we'll see what it does with it.
You wouldn't send them the disks. They would send you their dumping tool so you can dump the disks yourself. Keep in mind, if the disk is heavy protected and you own the only copy, then SPS is probably the only chance to preserve the game in unaltered form.

[Sydric]

OK -- I just sent them an email requesting the tool.

[Murtadha]

I'd like to introduce myself ... My Nam is Murtadha , I am the guy who did the graphics of ( Babylonian Twins), I am very impressed to see all this interest of the game after all these years , it’s just like bringing back the amazing feeling of the old days of Amiga.

I got an email yesterday from (cody) regarding the game , and I was so surprised to know the there is some people in this world still interested in the amiga games ...I went through the comments of the people here and I’ve noticed that some people have doubts about developing Amiga game in Iraq , I just want to assure you that we developed this game in 1993-1994 in Baghdad and we were preparing to develop another one , and we started already , I did all the graphics of that one , but the programming never finished .
and you know what happened to the Amiga market that time .

And yes , most of the team members left Iraq , I left in 1997 and I am in Australia now , the main programmed and the support programmer in Canada now ...the only guy I don’t know about is the musician ( Dr. Mahir ) ...I hope he made it out somehow

I wrote to RABAH ( the programmer ) yesterday regarding this issue but I didn’t get any response from him , maybe he is away in a vacation or something.

Any ways , just want to say thanks for the interest of the game , and wish you good luck of geting a copy of it soon

[Rabbit80]

I'd like to introduce myself ... My Nam is Murtadha , I am the guy who did the graphics of ( Babylonian Twins), I am very impressed to see all this interest of the game after all these years , it’s just like bringing back the amazing feeling of the old days of Amiga.

I got an email yesterday from (cody) regarding the game , and I was so surprised to know the there is some people in this world still interested in the amiga games ...I went through the comments of the people here and I’ve noticed that some people have doubts about developing Amiga game in Iraq , I just want to assure you that we developed this game in 1993-1994 in Baghdad and we were preparing to develop another one , and we started already , I did all the graphics of that one , but the programming never finished .
and you know what happened to the Amiga market that time .

And yes , most of the team members left Iraq , I left in 1997 and I am in Australia now , the main programmed and the support programmer in Canada now ...the only guy I don’t know about is the musician ( Dr. Mahir ) ...I hope he made it out somehow

I wrote to RABAH ( the programmer ) yesterday regarding this issue but I didn’t get any response from him , maybe he is away in a vacation or something.

Any ways , just want to say thanks for the interest of the game , and wish you good luck of geting a copy of it soon

Its amazing to hear from you guys (including Sydric)

Welcome both to EAB!

I hope that you keep checking in on EAB and if you feel like programming for the Amiga again - I am sure that the community would support you however they could!

If you still have copies of the graphics for the incomplete game, please post them here - there are many members of EAB that would appreciate it!

[blade002]

And yes , most of the team members left Iraq , I left in 1997 and I am in Australia now , the main programmed and the support programmer in Canada now ...the only guy I don’t know about is the musician ( Dr. Mahir ) ...I hope he made it out somehow



Well after watching the videos on YouTube Murtadha, i am astounded that this came never saw the light of day because it truly is a Class A job!! And i can certainly speak for all other Amiga gamers here when i say that! :)

BTW, you say that you are now living in Australia!, which city do you live in?? I myself am in Melbourne and there is an Amiga Users Group that another user on here goes too but i myself have not yet gone, plus there is also a yearly retro gaming event ( that started last year ) that covers many systems such as the C64 and Amiga, so YES interest in Amiga gaming is "still" very much alive!! :great

Maybe you should pop by the Retro Event in November this year to relive some glory Amiga times with a few of us Australian EAB members :)

Again though, GREAT job on the game, we would all love to see it! ;)

[DDNI]

I would pay $5US for a copy (either ADF or Real disk) so long as the creators and rights holder got a fair share...

[Murtadha]

Thanks for the complement guys ....I live in Melbourne in the Southbank , I arrived here 8 months ago , I was living in Dubai the last ten years . and yes I would love to visit the Retro Event in Melbourne this year.

I have to mention this , I don’t have anything to do with programming , I am architect and when I did the graphics of the game I was student in the university , I used the (Deluxe Paint ) , I don’t remember which version it was at that time.

Regarding the graphics of the other game , I don’t have copy with me but the programmer most probably still have a copy with him , I will contact him, he is living in Canada and he worked for (electronic arts ) for a while , I don’t think he will mined to give a copy of the work .

[Rabbit80]

I would pay $5US for a copy (either ADF or Real disk) so long as the creators and rights holder got a fair share...

I agree - it would be good to see the guys who made this get something back for it!

[blade002]

I agree - it would be good to see the guys who made this get something back for it!

I am more than happy to pay an amount for the game also :), although i do respect Sydric's reservations in releasing the full game.

@Murtadha: I will get back to you tomorrow mate, my head is slumping.. tired :sleep

[gklinger]

Coming to World of Commodore again, Syd? I'm hoping there will be more Amiga content this year even if I have to provide it myself. :)

[TheCyberDruid]

Hi Sydric & Murtadha,

welcome to the EAB. It's great to hear that the game still exsists and is playable :) Awesome work on the graphics Murtadha :great
Take your time to consider releasing it Sydric. It'll be cool to see the demo of that fine game :agree

[viddi]

I´d pay for it, too!



Glad to see this thread going so well. :great

[rabahs]

I'd like to introduce myself--my name is Syd Bolton and I run the Personal Computer Museum in Brantford, ON Canada (http://www.pcmuseum.ca).

I am also the president of LEGENDARY DESIGN TECHNOLOGIES, the company that actually owns the rights to this game.

First of all, let me assure you -- the game is REAL. We never released it because the environment of the Amiga had deteriorated so badly that the game would have never made it commercially.

I do have the disk images--in fact, I remember not that long ago I definitely created an Amiga of the demo.

I am torn about releasing the full game - but the demo I most definitely would not have an issue with.

I can also assure you that this is one awesome game. Right now, the only place you can play it is at the Personal Computer Museum, which is part of the charm of coming here and trying out new things. Kids that are comfortable with Mario seem to have little difficulty, although there are some advanced tricks in this game that take time to figure out.

Anyways, sounds like there is a lot of interest---if you have any other questions, let me know.


Hi Guys

Thanks all for the positive feedback about Babylonian Twins, it is great to see such a strong Amiga community around till this day. My name is Rabah Shihab, I am the author, lead developer and copyright owner (Registered at the Library of Congress: TXu000756385) for Babylonian Twins.

I developed the game with my friends Murtadha and Mahir in Baghdad between 1993 and 1994. I contacted many Amiga publishers at that time but all refused to deal with us because there was an economic sanctions on Iraq. The only positive response I received was from Syd Bolton of Legendary Design Technologies at that time. We eventually signed an agreement with Legendary to publish the game but they never published the game, and the more dad part is that we never got a response (positive or negative) from Syd since that time despite our many attempts to reach him. We considered our agreement void since that time. Syd has no control over this game. Syd, please contact me at rabahshihab at yahoo dot ca to discuss this.

I currently live in Vancouver, BC and I still have the source code (MC68000 assembly), graphics, music, sounds, and binaries (CD32 Amiga DOS format) for the game. The game is complete and my brother posted videos of the 5 stages on YouTube last year. I have considered many times to port the game to the PC but never got the time. I am recently considering porting the game to the iPhone amd I am trying to find a financial sponsor for this project.

If you have other ideas on now get this game out to the rest of the world, please contact me. There are stories behind the development of this game, from the limited hardware resources (no HD, only 512km of memory, using TV instead of a monitor...etc), to the frequent power interruptions, to the very hot weather (over 50 degree in the summer), to the sad responses we received from publishers because we were in Baghdad, to the lack for technical resources (books, internet, bulletin boards, developers community...etc) to build such game in the first place.

I will see if I can publish a demo of the game for the loyal Amiga community to the enjoy. I will keep you posted.


Regards,
Rabah Shihab
rabahshihab at yahoo dot ca

[Steve]

The plot thickens...

Its better than TV this! :D

[viddi]

Hi rabahs and welcome to the EAB!


I still have the source code (MC68000 assembly), graphics, music, sounds, and binaries (CD32 Amiga DOS format) for the game.

I have considered many times to port the game to the PC but never got the time. I am recently considering porting the game to the iPhone amd I am trying to find a financial sponsor for this project.


Good news! So this gem isn´t lost at all. :spin

You want to port this game to the iPhone and need a financial sponsor? Why not sell the Amiga version at a reasonable price?

I´d like to see a CD version with printed booklet and inlay. ;)

[whitegiant89]

Waiting with baited breath for the demo to be released ;-)

[Retro-Nerd]

Welcome on EAB Rabbah. Good to see that you could clarify some things about the game. :great

Just like viddi i would like to see a commercial Amiga version with manual & box, but i assume this isn't profitable enough these days. :)

[blade002]

Thanks for the complement guys ....I live in Melbourne in the Southbank , I arrived here 8 months ago , I was living in Dubai the last ten years . and yes I would love to visit the Retro Event in Melbourne this year.

Excellent Murtadha! Great to have you here in Melbourne, its an absolute honour, they should probably build a monument dedicated to you.. lol :bowdown

Anyway, go to these websites to get some info on the Retro Event and introduce yourself !!.. The organiser of the event was actually thinking about canceling it for this year, but i think i have swayed his decision, which was mainly due to lack of numbers.. Last year only about 12 guys turned up to it ( it was the 1st one ), so this year we are trying to make it bigger and better.

Where its being held-:
http://retrobrad.com/expo/

Where you can make contact and introduce yourself-:
http://retrobrad.com/phpBB2/index.php

I will most likely be bringing to the event my A1200 with WHDLoad installed :) ( as i did last year )

There were 3 Amiga's there last year.. x2 A1200's and x1 MiniMig.

Hi GuysI will see if I can publish a demo of the game for the loyal Amiga community to the enjoy. I will keep you posted.


A very interesting read rabahs, and i like i have already said as have others, we are more than happy to pay for the full version of this game and of course the price is entirely up to you, but i think you can rest assured that no matter how much you ask we are all up for paying whatever it is you put forward :)

Its about time you guys got some financial return for all the hard work under extreme conditions you subjected yourselves to, to produce a phenomenal piece of software :great

[Steve]

A very interesting read rabahs, and i like i have already said as have others, we are more than happy to pay for the full version of this game and of course the price is entirely up to you, but i think you can rest assured that no matter how much you ask we are all up for paying whatever it is you put forward.
Hahahahah! What a ridiculous thing to say! I'm sure there is some amount you wouldn't pay for a 13 year old game no matter how good it is. The developers have nothing to lose from releasing the game to the community. Otherwise it will be consigned to history and forgotten. How about setting up a sort of Paypal donation thing once its released like WinUAE has. If you like the game then make a donation. But that begs the question who does the money go to, the developer or the publisher or both?? Probably just simpler to release it for free or not to release it at all.

[blade002]

Hahahahah! What a ridiculous thing to say! I'm sure there is some amount you wouldn't pay for a 13 year old game no matter how good it is. The developers have nothing to lose from releasing the game to the community. Otherwise it will be consigned to history and forgotten. How about setting up a sort of Paypal donation thing once its released like WinUAE has. If you like the game then make a donation. But that begs the question who does the money go to, the developer or the publisher or both?? Probably just simpler to release it for free or not to release it at all.

Hey mate, all i am trying to do is do the right thing by the developers, because as you can already read they pretty much slogged their guts out to make the damn thing and no matter how time passes the hard work still happened. Its like when someones dies, in 100 years no one is going to give a shit that you ever lived because no-one is going to be around to remember or know you ever lived but you did live and your own life was anything but trivial and was important to you just as this game was important to the developers.

Sure its only a game, but its very hard work that should be rewarded! Yeah, sure i know it would be more complicated to compensate all in involved, but you shouldn't just say .. hey "give me the game" because its 14 years old!! .. you do the "right" thing first and whatever that person decides they decide.

The PayPal idea is a good one, but it is up for them to decide rather than try to decide for them, and i am quite sure they will be reasonable in what they ask ( if they were to ask ) given the great responses we have had from them thus far. Just showing appreciation.

[Sydric]

Rabah and I have made contact---and despite what he says, my company does own the publishing rights to the Amiga version---I have the legal contract to prove it. It is true - as I MENTIONED -- the game never made it to market. I have no issue with him receiving money for the work he and his team did--so if people want to pay for it -- pay him, not me .... I'm not an unreasonable person. Just setting the record straight. He has possible future plans for the game, I have no claim or right to those --- so he may do whatever he wishes.

[DDNI]

As stated previously, I am willing to pay $5US for this 14year old NON MERCENARY game ;)

It is ironic that 14 years after the game could have been launched we are willing to pay for the developers hard work...
Had it come out in 1995 I wager that 90% of us here would have sourced a cracked version, played it once and added it to the IMMENSE pile of other floppies that we hadn't paid the developers for....

[blade002]

It is ironic that 14 years after the game could have been launched we are willing to pay for the developers hard work...
Had it come out in 1995 I wager that 90% of us here would have sourced a cracked version, played it once and added it to the IMMENSE pile of other floppies that we hadn't paid the developers for....

Come to think of it, yes thats very very true, which kind of makes me a hypocrite :(

[viddi]

Just like viddi i would like to see a commercial Amiga version with manual & box, but i assume this isn't profitable enough these days. :)

I´d prefer a normal CD case. A CD-R could be used to cut down on costs.
But a professional printed inlay and booklet isn´t expensive anymore.

I´d love to help out with the design. ;)

[eLowar]

But a professional printed inlay and booklet isn´t expensive anymore.

Nicely printed CD-Rs aren't hard either in the age of printable CD-Rs (supported by many fairly standard printers) and Lightscribe (although the latter is still too slow to be practical).

[gklinger]

I also feel badly we never did get it released (just was not possible the way the Amiga was) and so Rabah and his team at Mesopotamia never got properly compensated for it.
Could you elaborate on why you never released it and why you never compensated the developers?

My name is Rabah Shihab
السلام عليكم

There are stories behind the development of this game, from the limited hardware resources (no HD, only 512km of memory, using TV instead of a monitor...etc), to the frequent power interruptions, to the very hot weather (over 50 degree in the summer), to the sad responses we received from publishers because we were in Baghdad, to the lack for technical resources (books, internet, bulletin boards, developers community...etc) to build such game in the first place.At this point in time I'm actually more interested in hearing the stories behind the game than I am in actually playing it (playing it would be nice too). If you've got the time and are willing to talk about it, please do.

P.S. I'm sorry that you had to leave your homeland but I am glad that you ended up in Canada. That's +1 cool Amiga guys for us! :)

[cosmicfrog]

yipees the plot thickens and thickens
next time I`m in canada I might just vist that museum......

we might even get 2 demos, 1 from the publisher and 1 from the programmer

anyhow I`m glad we`ve got some new members and with special talents as well

[Auday]

Re: Babylonian Twins
Syd, I'm not a lawyer and I don’t even remember the details of the contract, all I know is that I was there and saw Rabah and Murtadha working day and night because they had only one Amiga, I saw them struggling with all hard life in crazy Baghdad under sanction and being creative and motivated despite all troubles that faced them dailly.
Money is not the issue here, all members of Mesopotamia are very well established now beyond shareware, it's more a morality issue especially from a fellow Canadian.
At the time when this game was done, we had hardly any contact with the outside world and we trusted you to take our efforts and creation that we are proud of to the outside world, instead, you took the game and didn’t even bother let us know why you didn’t publish it or offer any suggestions or alternatives, which was a big disappointment and a big hit for our moral. Imagine being boycotted by the whole world and under pressure inside your own country and you put all your efforts and hopes in one thing then feel betrayed and taken advantage of.
And now you are claiming that you have the full rights for the game? may I ask you what you did to earn those rights other than giving promises to the rightful owners who trusted you almost blindly? Very disappointing Syd very disappointing.

Re: Against the Kingdom of Death
Another game in the level of Shadow of the Beast was being developed by Mesopotamia Software, two huge stages were completed each is a full Amiga disk. The game was inspired by the epic of Gilgamesh. I was the designer and programmer and the graphics was done by 3 artists (Ali was the main artist and concept artist of the game and Murtadha and Nasr did the 2nd level). I still have the source code and the data but the running binary disk is not working anymore, I need to fix them with XCopy or something but I dont have the tools or the time for that.

Re: Mesopotamia Software today.
We are working on PS3 now as a contracting company and developers for PS3 and 360. You could find details about Mesopotamia here www.mesopotamia.ca (http://www.mesopotamia.ca/) , Amiga is mentioned more than once on our website, we will never forget! :)

[TheCyberDruid]

Hi Auday,

welcome to the EAB :) It's nice to see the developers of this fine game here on the board.
Reading your post about about Babylonian Twins is a bit sad, because you worked so hard under that circumstances and never was given the proper credit (not to speak about salary) for your work :( I hope the reponse here shows that your work was not completely wasted and that we really appreciate what you did :agree
Let's hope the game becomes available (either to buy or for free) so more people can enjoy playing it :great

[gklinger]

And now you are claiming that you have the full rights for the game?
From what I've read so far, a claim he may be legally unable to substantiate should it come to that point. I'm reminded of a quote from Orlando A. Battista who said, "An error doesn't become a mistake until you refuse to correct it." Hopefully this situation will come to a conclusion that is fair and equitable for all involved.

And to you Auday, another warm welcome to EAB!

P.S. +2 cool Amiga guys for Canada! :)

[ungi]

... the disk is HEAVILY protected --- so we'll have to see if making an image of that one is easily possible at all anyways). .

This cries for a whdload fix for the game to make it playable and preserve it for the future.

If the source coulde is still available - maybe an unprotected version is possible as well.

[Rabbit80]

OK just read page 2 :) It's NOT too late on the disk images. I run a MUSEUM - we know about preserving disk images and history -- in fact, that's WHY I have not as of yet released the full game--it's a unique thing to find in our museum (not to mention the disk is HEAVILY protected --- so we'll have to see if making an image of that one is easily possible at all anyways).

Play the demo when I post it and give me your feedback and we'll go from there.

This game was not designed to stay in a museum - it was designed to be played by the masses!

Museums are about history - about the things which have defined us as a race and which have made the earth what it is today. This game has not had the opportunity for people to have even seen it - keeping it in a museum where it cannot be seen except on select days is the wrong thing to do!

Since the source code is available, surely it would not be too difficult to make a WHDLoad version - perhaps with a keyfile so that to play the full version you have to register the game and pay a nominal fee?

[Codetapper]

BTW, I don't trust anyone but the original programmers or fellow crackers to tell me that a game is heavily protected! Just because a disk can't be copied with X-Copy doesn't mean it is a fortress of protection! :)

[blade002]

BTW, I don't trust anyone but the original programmers or fellow crackers to tell me that a game is heavily protected! Just because a disk can't be copied with X-Copy doesn't mean it is a fortress of protection! :)

And ain't that the truth! I remember seeing a game on the Amiga ( i think Robocop 3 ) that required a hardware dongle to work when you bought the original but that was no problem for the crackers as was everything else pretty much.

Copy protection.. me don't think so. :D

[laser]

sincerely I won't get involved on this....(because I'm serious) but for me the subject about the rights of the game is a comedy

If the game exists...it's time to upload the demo anywhere and give up the comedy for the young women

[Ironclaw]

Only game I had problem with copying as a kid was Hook... it only gave me broken sectors/cylinders or whatever they are called, 79 of them anyway........ then I got a new copy program, maybe it was Bamcopy or something.. it didn't show any bad sectors/cylinders then when copying, I was thrilled ! :D.. but all that happen when running the disks was I saw the loading screen, nothing else....

[Galahad/FLT]

Only game I had problem with copying as a kid was Hook... it only gave me broken sectors/cylinders or whatever they are called, 79 of them anyway........ then I got a new copy program, maybe it was Bamcopy or something.. it didn't show any bad sectors/cylinders then when copying, I was thrilled ! :D.. but all that happen when running the disks was I saw the loading screen, nothing else....

Ahem... Hook was Copylock protected, I would suggest either broken disks or a broken disk drive! :agree

[Galahad/FLT]

I second Codetappers criticism of 'Heavy protection'. It is nothing more than a publishers sound bite to an eager magazine reviewer in the vain hope it will buy some time when the game gets released.

A game like this should NOT be allowed to fester in a museum, whatever the problems for the original developers, it would be criminal to see their efforts wasted like this, triumph over adversity and all that :)

[StingRay]

Ahem... Hook was Copylock protected, I would suggest either broken disks or a broken disk drive! :agree

You forgot the 3rd possibility: broken disks AND a broken disk drive :D

[Codetapper]

A game like this should NOT be allowed to fester in a museum, whatever the problems for the original developers, it would be criminal to see their efforts wasted like this, triumph over adversity and all that :)

Especially when the museum is located in a single physical location that practically none of the Amiga community can realistically get to! And the only ones that can play it are some snotty nosed kids used to their PSX3, Wii's or XBox 360's that will not appreciate a classic platformer from the Amiga heyday anyway!

I mean, you could probably load up some piece of crap like Huckleberry Hound in Hollywood Capers for those kids and they would still play it.

This game deserves a decent release like Liquid Kids, Snow Bros et al!

[Rabbit80]

Especially when the museum is located in a single physical location that practically none of the Amiga community can realistically get to!

Not to mention that the museum is only open at limited days and times - its practically impossible to just pop in if you happen to be in the area!

http://www.pcmuseum.ca/open.asp

Only open once a month!

[TheCyberDruid]

Not to mention that the museum is only open at limited days and times - its practically impossible to just pop in if you happen to be in the area!

http://www.pcmuseum.ca/open.asp

Only open once a month!

6 hours open each month? Well that's nearly nothing :sad
Why are there not more open days and hours Sydric? I thought you were talking about a museum that is open to the public for far more hours.

[mihcael]

Auday, rabahs, Murtadha :great:great:great

What a great job they have all done, that game looks very nice indeed! I hope you can release the game and possibly make a little cash, it would be great to see the other game finished too!!! Any screenshot on that one??

:)

[DDNI]

I don't know Sydric. However I am always uncomfortable when threads begin to turn into flame wars, particularly when we are not in possession of all of the facts.

With regards to the museum, let's not be too hard on Sydric...
He is in essence sharing access to his own collection of retro machines.
He probably makes no money from the endeavour. It is more than likely that, given power costs, public insurance and building maintenance Sydric is out of pocket everytime he opens the museum.

[TheCyberDruid]

Lets not be too hard on Sydric...
He is in essence sharing access to his own collection of retro machines.
He probably makes no money from the endeavour. It is more than likely that, given power costs, public insurance and building maintenance Sydric is out of pocket everytime he opens the museum.

Well than he should charge a small fee (like 2 CDN) and open more often :agree

[viddi]

I don't know Sydric. However I am always uncomfortable when threads begin to turn into flame wars, particularly when we are not in possession of all of the facts.

I agree.

No flame wars, please. This could endanger the whole project.

[DDNI]

Well than he should charge a small fee (like 2 CDN) and open more often :agree

@TCD that is a valid point. However he may have a full time job which restricts the time he can devote to opening the museum.
My point is that unless we have all the facts, criticising someone publicly is offensive and wrong.





(unless it is Doomy ;) )

[Rabbit80]

I don't know Sydric. However I am always uncomfortable when threads begin to turn into flame wars, particularly when we are not in possession of all of the facts.

I apologise if I have said anything which may upset anyone - however it is my firm belief that the best thing for this game is not to be sat unused in an obscure and part time museum. We all know that floppy disks can become damaged and unreliable over time - not to mention the worst eventualities i.e. fire / flood etc...

This seems like a sure fire way to lose the game forever! Thank goodness that this is not the only way of getting this game back (Rabah has source code etc!)

[TheCyberDruid]

@TCD that is a valid point. However he may have a full time job which restricts the time he can devote to opening the museum.
My point is that unless we have all the facts, criticising someone publicly is offensive and wrong.

You are right, this should of course not become a flame war of any kind. I just asked Sydric why the museum is not open more often. I think you are right about that having a full time job limits the time you can spend on such a hobby. Just let's see what Sydric has to tell and hopefully we can get the demo soon :)

(unless it is Doomy ;) )

We call him 'he-who-should-not-be-told-of' ;) :cheese

[viddi]

...however it is my firm belief that the best thing for this game is not to be sat unused in an obscure and part time museum.

Thank goodness that this is not the only way of getting this game back (Rabah has source code etc!)


I second that. :agree

[Joe Maroni]

Nice game. I hope to see a copy of it soon.

[spoUP]

Indeed! This game deserves to be released. I don't think an Amiga release would hurt the sales of a NDS/PSP/IPhone/WiiWare/PSN version of the game...

The game looks great!

[Sydric]

The Museum is completely run by volunteers--I can't burn them out by being open all the time. However, this may change next year. Things are in the works.

However---if you had actually READ our website you would note that I am completely open to having people visit the museum almost ANY TIME as long as you pre-arrange it with me and or the volunteers. If someone is in the area, they can always see the museum. I especially make efforts for people from out of town.

I will check with Rabah if he is ok with the demo going out -- it should not be an issue because we had shown it previously at a Toronto show and I think we may have even given the demo to Amazing Computing.

As for the full game, I am stepping back from all of this and letting Rabah do with it as he wishes. I do not wish to step on his toes for any future efforts.

I still think it's funny that many of you thought this whole game was a prank or a joke lol!

[TheCyberDruid]

As for the full game, I am stepping back from all of this and letting Rabah do with it as he wishes. I do not wish to step on his toes for any future efforts.

I still think it's funny that many of you thought this whole game was a prank or a joke lol!

Sorry that I haven't checked your site more closely Sydric. When I had read that you can pre-arrange visits I wuld have never asked about why it's only open 6 hours a month.

I think it is a good decision to let Rabah decide what should be done with the game :) All of us hope that this game becomes available to all the Amiga fans :agree

[blade002]

Well it looks as though all this is taking a positive step, and its good to see :) Its such an amazing and exciting prospect that we could once again be enjoying a professionally produced commercial quality AMIGA game 14 years after the demise of the Amiga :spin

[Rabbit80]

However---if you had actually READ our website you would note that I am completely open to having people visit the museum almost ANY TIME as long as you pre-arrange it with me and or the volunteers. If someone is in the area, they can always see the museum. I especially make efforts for people from out of town.

Many apologies - I missed that!

I'm glad that you are leaving this up to Rabah - I'm pretty sure you won't lose any exclusivity since you will probably be the only person to have the packaging (if it was done) and the original disks.

If I happen to be in the area I will be sure to come and visit your museum!

[Galahad/FLT]

I still think it's funny that many of you thought this whole game was a prank or a joke lol!

Simple enough explanation, a game that looks as good and as well produced as that should never have not been released, hence why ONE person thought it a fake.

But then that one person was Laser! :rolleyes

[Anubis]

As stated previously, I am willing to pay $5US for this 14year old NON MERCENARY game ;)

It is ironic that 14 years after the game could have been launched we are willing to pay for the developers hard work...
Had it come out in 1995 I wager that 90% of us here would have sourced a cracked version, played it once and added it to the IMMENSE pile of other floppies that we hadn't paid the developers for....

Isn't that clear sign of age. :blased


We are not kids willing to get every game just to have complete tosec/SPS. :cheese (NOT!)

Welcome to all new members!

I hope you guys will decide what you like to do with Amiga version of the game. In either way I will support you. :great The game looks interesting and well playable.

Games for some old formats still get released, but depending on the audience and price to publish them, price vary.

Also idea about WHDLoad (that would be the best way to go) with some key encription sounds good.

@CoddyJerrret and rest of APoV team - can we have interviews with Mesopotamia Software and preview of the game?? (it's been long time since last preview of an amiga game) :cheese Also it would be nice to read about design complications and what solutions they had.

[viddi]

The vids aren´t available anymore. (Level 1 is still up, though) :confused

I hope this is a good sign...:nervous

[TheCyberDruid]

The vids aren´t available anymore. (Level 1 is still up, though) :confused

I hope this is a good sign...:nervous

:confused Hmm, I really don't know what that means...

[Leffmann]

I'm glad to see this thread going, even though there's a lot of fuss in it. Let's hope it doesn't deter the Mesopotamians from revisiting here and releasing the game.

I remember seeing this game for the first time about a year ago on YouTube and was amazed at how they could've completed it under those conditions. At least my understanding was that this hardware was hard to come by in that part of the world even in 1994, let alone any technical documents and a community with which to exchange and build ideas.

It would be interesting to hear some development stories, and of how you got hold of the Amiga, floppy disks, tools and documentation in the first place!

And shame on you, Laser, for underestimating the Amiga like that. Head on over to the HoL and the ADA and take a look at what it can do :)

[pcGTW_Webmaster]

And shame on you, Laser, for underestimating the Amiga like that. Head on over to the HoL and the ADA and take a look at what it can do :)
Not to mention that you can clearly see a couple of limitations due to the game only using 512K, like a great lack of variation in the tile-set and no parallax scrolling at all. It still looks great, but it's not something that pushes the Amiga to its limits.

[Anubis]

The playability reminds me of one of my favorite amiga games - Superfrog. :)

[pcGTW_Webmaster]

More like Sonic. It even has the tubes and the spin attack. ;)

[vroom6sri]

If only we could see the arrival of Putty Squad and other great prospective Amiga games...

[Joe Maroni]

i would die for a copy of that game..:lol

[T_hairy_bootson]

i would die for a copy of that game..:lol

But then how would you play it? :nervous

[plasmatron]

The playability reminds me of one of my favorite amiga games - Superfrog. :)



It has also a lot of Ruffian and charly J cool feel-

[ungi]

The playability reminds me of one of my favorite amiga games - Superfrog. :)

It looked like one of my old favs - Arabian Nights.

[ungi]

A game like this should NOT be allowed to fester in a museum, whatever the problems for the original developers, it would be criminal to see their efforts wasted like this, triumph over adversity and all that :)


Can you PLAY it in the museum??? I assumed you just can take a look at the floppies and read the text "unreleased Amiga game from 1994..."

What a shame when the original heavy-protected and only-in-the-world floppies would get damaged by some kid or moron playing the game and so destroying it for all the future :-)

[Rabbit80]

Can you PLAY it in the museum??? I assumed you just can take a look at the floppies and read the text "unreleased Amiga game from 1994..."

To answer your question...

Right now, the only place you can play it is at the Personal Computer Museum, which is part of the charm of coming here and trying out new things.

So I guess - yes you can play it there!

[rabahs]

Hi Guys

Just an update on this. I am working on a Amiga demo for this game. I just need to setup an Amiga emulator with all required tools. I already have an Amiga DOS version of the demo, I just need to produce and ADF version. I will update you on this.

Also, after all the positive responses I received on this forum and on youtube, I am taking the porting efforts more seriously. I have re-registered the domain Babyloniantwins.com and I will update it with my future plans.

Also, I am answering some interview questions I received about the story behind the game, I will update that too.

For all future communication about the game, please contact me directly, I have resolved the pending issues with Syd regarding the publishing rights for the game.

Thanks
Rabah
rabahshihab at yahoo dot ca

[killergorilla]

I sincerely hope you release the full version into the community and don't hold the amiga version ransom because you want to publish a different version.

Just my 2 cents.

[Reynolds]

Well, well...
Paying for a game which is 14 years old isn't an issue. Many of us buying sw from ebay recently, the only difference between those and this game is the release date, but nothing else.
Second thing, if anything new comes out to the Amiga makes no sense for me if it is only for the A500 or any other targeted model instead of the whole Amiga range. If so, then all of us have to purchase the latest Amiga models and expansions and sell all "old", "obsolete" wares immediately, what is nonsense. Think if all the stores immediately removes all PS2 titles, just because PS2 is too old if compare with PS3 for example....

Also, paying full price for a complete game these days also doesn't matters. Wish to live again in the early nineties, with the same financial environment. I was a kid, with no money at all, and in my region was practically impossible to buy all of those games which I wanted. Shame that now I can buy any of them, but it will not reach the developers, as only can be purchased from a second hand stock, but that's an other story.
I also would like to help in any way, but I afraid the only thing I can do is to buy the game, so if it will be released, then that will be done by myself.
And having a native OS4 version later, just would be the top of the cake.
No offence, just thoughts. :)

[blade002]

Also, paying full price for a complete game these days also doesn't matters. Wish to live again in the early nineties, with the same financial environment. I was a kid, with no money at all, and in my region was practically impossible to buy all of those games which I wanted.

This is a very good point, for me it was the same story... My mum was working 3 jobs to raise 3 kids, i used to go without lunch and use the money from lunch to save up and buy a game but that would take me something like 4 months for 1 game, then when i left school the country was in recession and there was no work...etc..

So what is a kid/teenager in this circumstance going to do!??.. Shit, even my 1st C64 in the 80's was second hand!! and hardly any of the key worked properly!!... and i had to save REAL hard for an Amiga 500... So with games being $70 a pop back then... to afford that would have meant robbing the local bank!!... hehe...

I am sure many of us were in similar circumstances!.... but i will concede that once i started working and could finally afford games for my A500 and subsequently my A1200, i would "still" do the wrong thing, but on the other hand, if the game really something i thought was worth buying, i would buy it!.. i bought at least 40 original games for the Amiga over the course of time :)

[Joe Maroni]

if the owners like to have some money i like to give them 20 eur for it.

[ungi]

This is a very good point, for me it was the same story... My mum was working 3 jobs to raise 3 kids, i used to go without lunch

ah, now I have got to work with one job and pay 50% to my ex-wife and my 3 kids which all live in luxury. seems you had the wrong father. well, guess you weren´t asked when your mother chose him :-).

[Rabbit80]

Any word on the demo yet?

[laser]

Any word on the demo yet?

not yet
I think this was a nice joke like the natami scam project

[Galahad/FLT]

not yet
I think this was a nice joke like the natami scam project

I bet $20 you're wrong about this game.

[laser]

I bet $20 you're wrong about this game.

I pass....let's hope everything turns out all right

[Thalion]

Hm can't believe i missed this thread until today. But its not too late to send out the my greetings to the Coders. Very nice work.
So after readings this whole thread i'm really curious to play the demo and maybe the full version. As some mentioned before it even would pay some money for the game. Such promising work deserves it. So i'm curious to see what happens now.

[gklinger]

EAB needs a bookie. :lol

[Reynolds]

Still waiting eagerly the first public demo. Maybe a CD32 (CDTV? :cool) full version later...

[CodyJarrett]

laser - stop trolling.

all - please ignore any further idiotic laser posts. I will remove any spam.

[Mahir Hisham]

Hello All
Let me introduce myself, I'm 'Mahir Hisham', the music and sound effects guy :)
I was contacted by my old friend Rabah today when he found me accidentally on facebook after all these years, I'm happy for seeing all these posts about the game, happy to see the appreciation of effort, but on the same time, sad cause I think that this appreciation came out too late.
It is interesting to have the game on the market -someway- at last, not for money, not for pride, but to get as many people to know how our poor Iraq under sanction was having such creative minds that were also under sanction
we were a small group of collage kids having simple daily afternoon meetings at rabah's house, using simple equipments of Amiga 500 with no HD, hooked up to a TV using a TV modulator, and for me using a very rare piece of hardware that I was possessing those days which was an "Audio-In interface" so I could include all these traditional Iraqi music instruments some of which were sampled from real instruments, and some were from old recordings that were on LPs.... and for the records, I was allowed to use only 64Kb for each music piece..!!
Anyway, composing and playing music was a hobby for me rather than a career as I was in the medical school back then.
and my dear Murtadha, I'm now in 'Ann Arbor, Michigan/ USA' and my email is mahirhisham@yahoo.com (mahirhisham@yahoo.com) ,I'll be happy if we can get contact again
and Audai my friend... I wonder why you didn't mention the music of your -not finished- game 'Gilgamish'... as I remember, it took me a considerable time and effort to develop, and I consider it was the best of my work

[viddi]

Hi Mahir and welcome to the EAB.

Your mods are simply awesome and I noticed the traditional instruments.
Fantastic work. :great

I hope we´ll see a final public version soon...

[TheCyberDruid]

Hi Mahir,

welcome to the EAB :)
It's good to see that everybody of the original team now had shown up here. Your music sounds really good and I hope we can enjoy it in the game someday :agree

[gklinger]

The actual game aside, it's heartwarming that a group of old Amiga friends have been reunited after so many years. I think that's pretty cool.

[Graham Humphrey]

I have to agree, it's fantastic. Funny how these things happen.

[Thalion]

Yeah welcome Mahir. :)
I wonder about this project mentioned: "Gilgamish". Maybe there are some more deatils somewhere?

[pcGTW_Webmaster]

I wonder about this project mentioned: "Gilgamish". Maybe there are some more deatils somewhere?

Yes, on page 2. ;)

[Thalion]

:laughing:laughing Okay will have a look there then.:rolleyes

[Mahir Hisham]

thanks viddi.... thank you all

:)

[Anubis]

Mahir, welcome to EAB!

Are you working for UoM?? :) (Grand Rapids here :))

[Mahir Hisham]

Mahir, welcome to EAB!

Are you working for UoM?? :) (Grand Rapids here :))


well, yeah... how did u know??

[AdamW]

Hi everyone. I'm new to the forum. I stumbled across this topic while searching for something else. I wanted to add my part to the story.

I worked for Sydric at his company Legendary Design Technologies in the mid 1990's. I can verify that Babylonian Twins is very real. I remember playing both the demo and the full game. I even spoke to Rabah briefly on the phone. He called our office in Canada from the middle east and needed to talk to Sydric.

We took the demo version of the game with us to at least one trade show and allowed the general public to play it. Feedback was always very positive. :great

I believe that there were two reasons why the game was never sold. The first reason was the demise of the Amiga market. New games were being released, but many people were starting to switch to PCs and consoles for gaming. The North American market was especially slow. Legendary Design didn't have strong connections into the European market where the Amiga was still thriving.

Legendary Design was also going through some very difficult times. The problems broke the long friendship that I had with Sydric. As a result I left the company and haven't spoken to him in 10 years. I'm not surprised that the developers were not contacted and that the game was not published.

I was able to get in touch with Rabah in late 2005. He informed me then that the game was never published and was not available to the public. He also stated he was thinking of porting the game to a more modern platform.

I am crossing my fingers that we will see a release of the demo version. I also wish the developers luck in bringing the game to market on a modern platform.

[kriz]

Hope you will do a retro release.. Dont let this sit ununsed..

pleeeease

[Anubis]

@Mahir - just wild guess :D

@AdamW - not sure how many of us would get other then amiga versions. (cell phone version for example)

[andreas]

Hi everyone. I'm new to the forum. I stumbled across this topic while searching for something else. I wanted to add my part to the story.

I worked for Sydric at his company Legendary Design Technologies in the mid 1990's. I can verify that Babylonian Twins is very real. I remember playing both the demo and the full game.

Ahh...the full game too? :o

On the Amiga, then?

So this must exist somewhere, mustn't it?

[Anubis]

Ahh...the full game too? :o

On the Amiga, then?

So this must exist somewhere, mustn't it?

@ Museum, as Sydric has already told us. :cheese

[Cammy]

Please make an ADF version of the Museum copy and sell it online from your website. You can set up PayPal so the file is sent to the person once payment is made. For you, it's all profit! You just need to set up the web page for it. Have a demo available for free, of course, to whet our appetites, and offer the full game to download for a price. There's no need to spend any money on publishing, printing or disk duplication, we can all just Un-ADF the game to floppy disks at home and play the game on our real Amigas, or just stick to UAE.

I would buy it! I love games like this, I'm even making a platform game of my own.

Now to send this same message to Mark Cale at System3, who has the only copy of the full version of Putty Squad, and try and talk some sense into him...

[plasmatron]

I have a strange feeling, that this one is going down.

[Rabbit80]

DEMO IS AVAILABLE!!!!!!!

http://babyloniantwins.com/

Edit: Also placed in the Zone

[TheCyberDruid]

Yay :spin Thanks for the info Rabbit80 :great Must play it tonight :agree
Does anyone know how long the site is up?

[Rabbit80]

I don't think its been up long - though i hadn't looked for a couple of weeks

Edit: There is a date on the site - Yesterday!!!

[TheCyberDruid]

Would be nice if the one who made the site posted it here ;) and interesting that both the announcement and the release are dated yesterday. Fast reaction I would say :D

[Rabbit80]

It was plasmatrons post made me look :D

[rabahs]

Hi All

I am finally done with the demo, it is available now on http://www.babyloniantwins.com . It took me some time to refresh my memory about the code, MC68000 assembly programming and other Amiga stuff.

Anyway, enjoy the play and execuse the poor English inside the game. You can leave your feedback at www.babyloniantwins.com (http://www.babyloniantwins.com) or here I will try check this forum often. Leave any kind of feedback whether about the demo or suggestions for the future.

As for my future plans for the game, I will try to find a way to get it out to the mass. I still think the mobile platform is best option considering the hardware specs, I am still researching which mobile platform specifically to choose.

As for the full Amiga version, I can not release it now because doing so could affect my future deals with potential publishers. I think it is different when you approach them with a non-released game vs. a port.

Unfortunately, this game was never published on the Amiga but we have invested good (and hard) time developing it. Although we don't need (or expect) money now for our past efforts, we all want to see the game played by as many people as possible so they can appreciate the efforts done at the place and time.

The good thing is that I am still in the software business, Murtadha is an architect and Mahir is a brain surgeon :) I will do my best to work on this project beside my full time job.

Thanks again for all the positive responses.
Regards,
Rabah

[Rabbit80]

Many thanks for the demo - and the additional info!!!! I am looking forward to playing it!

[TheCyberDruid]

Hi rabahs,

good to see you've released the demo :) I hope you can get the thing with the publishers sorted soon, so you can let us know if and how the full Amiga will be available. All the best with the future of the Babylonian Twins :agree

[Graham Humphrey]

Great effort in getting this out, thanks!

[viddi]

Thanks a lot, rabahs. :bowdown

[laser]

nice game...!!! just tested it

works perfect on winuae and on my real A1200
also it works on the A500 but expanded
if the A500 is not expanded ...it doesn't run...needs 1mb+

btw,

How I can kill the enemies?
I can't kill them or hit them....

any tips?

[Retro-Nerd]

Many thanks for giving us the demo in the end, Rabah. :great

Looks like the game runs in 25 FPS, but it plays very nice. I wish you good luck with the release on a portable platform. :)

[Retroplay]

WOW just wow, what an excellent game this is.
Plays just beautifully.
Thanks alot for the demo rabahs. :great

[turrican3]

yes rabahs, an amazing amiga game can't wait for the full version :great.
Do you think really that if 1000 amigans (perhaps even less ) who play with your game can disturb or change your deal with a publisher ?

[dlfrsilver]

The scrolling is the fastest i have seen on amiga. Even sonic is not that fast !

Wow !!!

Let's hope you get a publisher for your mobile phone port, and then let us have the full amiga game (even if you want to make money with it, i'm ok to push 15 euros for it :))

[pcGTW_Webmaster]

As for the full Amiga version, I can not release it now because doing so could affect my future deals with potential publishers.

One word: Pay-per-download (ok, three words, but with dashes ;)). That would be a good way to make the full Amiga version available and finally earn some money with it. I think most Amiga fans wouldn't have any problems paying say 5 or 10€ for the full game.

[Reynolds]

One word: Pay-per-download (ok, three words, but with dashes ;)). That would be a good way to make the full Amiga version available and finally earn some money with it. I think most Amiga fans wouldn't have any problems paying say 5 or 10€ for the full game.

I can tell if it's really as smooth and addictive, 10 euros will be no money for it. And buying this gem is a must for any collectors :)

[Old Fool]

I tried this game on emulator with 512KB + 512KB settings so this will work on my expanded Amiga!! I couldn't believe that some day I would be playing platform game with the same quality than Superfrog on my A500!!!

It seems that this game has some nice effects, playability, game design, graphics, music and what suprises me most this game is from IRAQ!! Wow!!

Shame on U.S.A. - you know how to bomb this country but can't make better platform game for Amy!! :)

[laser]

One word: Pay-per-download (ok, three words, but with dashes ;)). That would be a good way to make the full Amiga version available and finally earn some money with it. I think most Amiga fans wouldn't have any problems paying say 5 or 10€ for the full game.

I agree..pay per download is the point of win for amiga users
I purchased via this mode some PC games which I consider gems like Warblade & Professor fizzwizzle

[DDNI]

@Old Fool, so far we have managed to keep politics out of this thread.... Lets try and keep it that way.

[Joe Maroni]

thanks for the demo...:great

great stuff and i hope to see the full version in the next years...:)

i´ve created the gamemap for the Demolevel and uploaded it to HOL...have fun with it..

http://hol.abime.net/5014/gamemap

[Predseda]

I still have no idea how to complete the level - where can I found the stoned palm? I am stuck just in the highest room of the level, there is that fast caped guard at the bottom and on the right there is the stair / platform which I can't reach. The twin is in the room just above me, unable to leave it. What to do now?

[Graham Humphrey]

@Old Fool, so far we have managed to keep politics out of this thread.... Lets try and keep it that way.

Especially as it's forbidden to talk about political stuff on EAB...

@Old Fool

Could you remove the offending line from your post please, don't want any unnecessary trouble to start.

On topic... haven't had the time to try this yet sadly, can anyone tell me if it will run on an '040?

[ungi]

As for the full Amiga version, I can not release it now because doing so could affect my future deals with potential publishers. I think it is different when you approach them with a non-released game vs. a port.



Thanks for releasing the demo!

Good luck for porting it to a mobile device.

Do you really think that a released amiga version (for a few amiga nuts) would affect the sales of the mobile port??? Not really, if anything it would make the game more popular. What do you think why names like R-Type or Turrican are so valuable? Because ppl remember the good games behind the names:-).

Anyway, it is of course your decision. So I hope you will release the Amiga version some time after you have published the new mobile version. It would be a pity if I have to travel to Canada just to "borrow" the only remaining original floppies of the Amiga version :-)).

[Biscuit]

Wow. I clearly don't browse here as often as is in my best interests. Thanks to Retroplay for informing LemonAmiga layabouts like myself.

The demo plays real nice - keeping me happy this evening. An all round impressive game, and I'm seriously digging that music. Enjoyed reading this thread immensely, and such a shame it never got released. I'm sure it would have had it's fans even in the turbulent days of Amiga. So a huge thank you to the developers for all your work, and good luck with a handheld port. Someone do it, then they can release the full adfs on the sly. :)

I'm also very interested in seeing any screenshots and hearing music from the second game mentioned. All those mod lovers must be interested.

[TheCyberDruid]

I'm also very interested in seeing any screenshots and hearing music from the second game mentioned. All those mod lovers must be interested.

Second that :great Indeed having some mods not featured in any game of that quality would be awesome :agree I guess Biscuit and I aren't the only two that are interested in these files :)

[Predseda]

The story sounds really incredible! And I hope it will finally have the happy end and the game will make it to the public.

If only there would be the way how to release it boxed.... :)

[lopos2000]

Thanks Rabahs.

[T_hairy_bootson]

I played this for a bit last night and was really impressed with it, scrolling, colours audio and playability all seemed top notch to me. It is a shame we won't see the full version on the amiga but I wish the developers the best of luck turning a buck on the mobile phone platform.

[Graham Humphrey]

I would hope we do see the full Amiga version at some point - like plenty of others I'd happily pay to download a copy :)

[Chain]

Same here, demo looks really promissing, catchy music.
Other prisoners with some infos are good idea, it reminds me beast2.
Hope it will be released for amy in some way :cool

[TheCyberDruid]

Maybe we should make a kind of list who will be willing to pay let's say 10€ for the game, so Rabah can see it's not pointless to release the version for us Amigans :)

[viddi]

Maybe we should make a kind of list who will be willing to pay let's say 10€ for the game, so Rabah can see it's not pointless to release the version for us Amigans :)


Great idea. :agree

Just start a poll thread, Cyber. ;)

[Chain]

How about just simple poll ?

edit: we have lighting fast mods here :D

[viddi]

How about just simple poll ?

edit: we have lighting fast mods here :D


LOL and CyberDruid already started it. So, let´s see....

[TheCyberDruid]

Yep, Poll is there, so go and vote :D

[plasmatron]

it`s out. It`s really out :spin:spin:spin

[Calgor]

Wow, can't believe I missed this thread! What a story. Great how the team is now reunited on the internet!! This game certainly does look and sound quite polished.

Welcome to EAB!

@Murtadha

There are actually quite a few board members residing in Melbourne, myself included. You are so lucky to be living in southbank, nice place to stay right in the city. Maybe you could go to one of the amiga club meetings sometime: http://eab.abime.net/showthread.php?t=39449

[Codetapper]

WHDLoad version now in the zone...

[Retro-Nerd]

WHDLoad version now in the zone...

:great

[Graham Humphrey]

WHDLoad version already? Fantastic :D

[viddi]

Wow! Thanks Codetapper. :great

[Retro-Nerd]

WHDLoad version already? Fantastic :D

Only the first version to tinker with, as tapper wrote in the readme. There are some graphics glitches when you jump. And the game freezes sometime, if you jump through the tube systems too often.

But hey, it's works and the game is really in 50 FPS. After a quick test in WinUAE (100Hz) i thought it's maybe in 25 FPS, because the scrolling is sooo fast. :great

[Retroplay]

After completing the demo several times I just want more.
We really need some way of buying this wonderful game. :)

[coze]

WHDLoad version now in the zone...

I'm having problems on 040 with whdload version :sad (A3000/040)

it freezes during the first intro screen (BC 658 babylon, something) nocache tooltype didn't help.

[Graham Humphrey]

On my A1200 it worked fine with Nocache, just press fire to skip the intro.

[coze]

doh, it seems my joystick was unplugged :) what a noob

[TheCyberDruid]

doh, it seems my joystick was unplugged :) what a noob

:lol Maybe you should have written that the sound still plays... ;)

[Reynolds]

Yesterday evening. A game made in 1994-95 was loaded into a machine made in 1994 gave extraordinary entertainment for me. (made in 1977 :cool)
This game for me deserved it's place with the released classics of the era, Mr. Nutz, mr. Superfrog, mr. Brian (the lion) and the three lost mr Vikings ;P

Today my Amiga 2000 (made in 1987, ser no 00000136 :cool )will be powered on for this gem.

Mesopotamia Team: :bowdown

Ps.: me also haven't found the plam yet. :)

[Retroplay]

Ps.: me also haven't found the plam yet. :)

Me neither, I don't think it's in the demo.
I freed the other guy, placed him where I have to stand on his head and jump to reach the ledge.
Go all the way to the right over the two pits of fire and then the demo ends.
I'm just itching to play the full game. :spin

[Reynolds]

Yeah, I have the same feeling, probably this is how the script was cut...?

No prob, if the full game will come :)

[rkauer]

Sorry to come late on this thread! Mesopotamian guys: :bowdown:bowdown:bowdown:bowdown:bowdown:bowdown:bowdown

@KG: I think it's time for a ready-made WHD pack. ;)

[Sydric]

Hey guys - nice to see that Rabah made the demo available so you can all see what a great game this is!

For those interested (and that have not seen) we had commissioned an artist to create the artwork that was to be used for the game.

You can see it at this link:

http://pcmuseum.ca/images.asp?images=btwins-750.jpg

This poster is actually at the museum (although not always on display, and currently not on display). It's a standard poster size--not sure of the exact dimensions but you know what I mean. The artist used the opening screens for inspiration obviously for what was finally airbrushed.

Here's to hoping the game makes it on other platforms!

And AdamW - you really should call or email me, it's been way too long!

[Cammy]

Here's to still hoping it makes it on the Amiga platform, too!

[Daff]

The interview with Rabah is on Obligement's website : http://obligement.free.fr/articles_traduction/itwshihab_en.php

[TheCyberDruid]

Any news about the full version? I still would love to see it one day :)

[redblade]

Hello All
Let me introduce myself, I'm 'Mahir Hisham', the music and sound effects guy :)
I was contacted by my old friend Rabah today when he found me accidentally on facebook after all these years, I'm happy for seeing all these posts about the game, happy to see the appreciation of effort, but on the same time, sad cause I think that this appreciation came out too late.
It is interesting to have the game on the market -someway- at last, not for money, not for pride, but to get as many people to know how our poor Iraq under sanction was having such creative minds that were also under sanction
we were a small group of collage kids having simple daily afternoon meetings at rabah's house, using simple equipments of Amiga 500 with no HD, hooked up to a TV using a TV modulator, and for me using a very rare piece of hardware that I was possessing those days which was an "Audio-In interface" so I could include all these traditional Iraqi music instruments some of which were sampled from real instruments, and some were from old recordings that were on LPs.... and for the records, I was allowed to use only 64Kb for each music piece..!!


I hate using the TV Screen to read hi res txt it gives you sore eyes, that's why I like the SVID on the CD32, the HI Res is still easy to read on a amiga screen.

Why couldn't the Amiga have a hi quality video output for the TV.

[Akira]

I hate using the TV Screen to read hi res txt it gives you sore eyes, that's why I like the SVID on the CD32, the HI Res is still easy to read on a amiga screen.

Why couldn't the Amiga have a hi quality video output for the TV.

Because the TV is not a high resolution screen? :P

[Retroplay]

Got this info from the Facebook (http://www.facebook.com/home.php#/pages/Babylonian-Twins/85161297853?ref=nf) group.

Babylonian Twins was selected for the Canada New Media Fund. That means if everything goes as planned, it should be be available on the iPhone, Xbox, PC and (as promised) on the Amiga by January 2010.

How sweet is that. :D

[Retro-Nerd]

Wow, this is indeed great. A belated X-mas 2009 present. :great

[Shoonay]

Can't wait... *droolz* :D

[TheCyberDruid]

Yeah! :spin Wow, I almost lost hope for the full version...
Big up to Rabah, Mahir and all the others involved in this game :bowdown
*Drools a bit too* ;)

[Graham Humphrey]

Superb news - happy endings do happen sometimes it seems.

[blade002]

I still haven't tried this game out yet :( .. silly me.

[kriz]

very cool !!

[nujack]

Great news!!! :great

[Predseda]

Calm down - it is still only a hope. We got a lot of similar promissing messages in the past. I will not believe until it is really released.

Then I will buy it immediatelly :D

[viddi]

Calm down - it is still only a hope. We got a lot of similar promissing messages in the past. I will not believe until it is really released.


I´m pretty sure Rabah won´t fool us.

[Retro-Nerd]

And i'm pretty sure that he release the Amiga version for free. :)

[prowler]

And i'm pretty sure that he release the Amiga version for free. :)

He doesn't actually say that in the interview. But neither does he deny it when the question is put to him! :)

[Retroplay]

No matter what, I'm still more than willing to pay for the Amiga version.
I just have to have it. :)

[Graham Humphrey]

Yes, I wouldn't begrudge paying money for the Amiga version at all.

[Predseda]

If there would be BOXED version, at least in jewelcase or so... I would be SO MUCH happy!

I know I am naive, so I would be glad if the game is available in any form 8)

[TheCyberDruid]

If there would be BOXED version, at least in jewelcase or so... I would be SO MUCH happy!

Interesting question. Would be nice to have it with a manual and maybe some other goodies. Anyway, wether it's free, just the download, boxed or even original disks I would buy it :D

[Retro-Nerd]

If there would be BOXED version, at least in jewelcase or so... I would be SO MUCH happy!

I know I am naive, so I would be glad if the game is available in any form 8)

Pytronik/Binaryzone could be the solution. They still release old/new games for retro machines, boxed or as an digital download. ;)


http://www.psytronik.com/main/

[kriz]

I hope they sell it, a new amiga game for sale would be sweet!

[Bamiga2002]

Another one idle & waiting for JAN 2010 (along with Natami ;))

[Pyromania]

Great game! Glad to buy it on Amiga, iPhone & PS3! If they need an Amiga developer to distribute and sell the Amiga version for them DiscreetFX would love to help. We would even take out Ads and promote it.

[laffer]

I just recently found out about this game and I'm very impressed. Must have been hell to develop a game under those conditions... and it seemingly turned out pretty damn good, too!

Too bad it's not out yet, crossing my fingers nothing will happen and it actually will be released.

[Bamiga2002]

Tried the demo and was impressed. Nicely scrolling and seems very playable. Still waiting for the January release :D

[El_Patas]

Wow, wonderful history, great threat, i readed all the pages here,
and thanks to all the people have made posible the knowledge
of this game.

I played the demo, and is gorgeous, fast, colourful, well designed,
really nice, i like the full game!!!

I'm waiting for the full release in January.

Regards.

[Pyromania]

I can't wait till this cool game comes out. Looks like 2010 is going to rock.

[Joe Maroni]

i wonder if the release happens this month...:)

[Cammy]

I hope they consider fixing a few small things up with the game before releasing it, like adding the option for a jump button. Small changes could seriously improve the game and make it a lot more popular.

[Chain]

did anyone notice that xbox release was cancelled?

[blade002]

I hope they consider fixing a few small things up with the game before releasing it, like adding the option for a jump button. Small changes could seriously improve the game and make it a lot more popular.

I have always a push up to jump kind of guy so i guess i am safe :D

But i STILL haven't even tried the game :sad

[Cammy]

Good Amiga games have the option for both (up to jump or button 2 to jump), to make everyone happy! I certainly would always give the user the option to choose in any game I make.

[Retro-Nerd]

For the Amiga Fans

We thank you for your countless emails and support. Many of you have expressed interest in purchasing the Amiga version when its available. Since there is no self-publishing platform for the Amiga, we are planning to self-publish the game in a nice collectable packaging and make it available for purchase online. We hope we can finance this project through iPhone sales, so please help us spread the word about this game and the legendary Amiga.


Sounds great. The site is updated now. :)

http://babyloniantwins.com/

[Predseda]

I already sent them the email with the question:

"Did you do any investigation how much the Amigans would like to spend for boxed Babylonian Twins?"

Me personally, would give for it 20-30 USD, if the box would be nice and consist the manual. What do you think about that price? Too much? Too less?

[Retro-Nerd]

I think 20 US$ would be fair enough for a boxed version.

[Predseda]

BTW: I wonder what type of media would they use for distribution. CD probably?

[prowler]

I think 20 US$ would be fair enough for a boxed version.

Those guys deserve to make money from this game when you consider the risks that were taken when it was being developed. :agree

So yes, I too would pay US$20 for a boxed version of Babylonian Twins, so long as the box is designed not to get crushed in transit.

My boxed copy of AmigaOS 4.0 was crushed flat when I received it! :mad

I wonder what type of media would they use for distribution. CD probably?

Yes, I would think so. :agree

[nujack]

Price is o.k. from my point of view

[TheCyberDruid]

It's good to see the updated site :) Will surely buy my copy once it's released and I hope the price will be around 20$.

[Predseda]

I am afraid for 20 bucks there wouldnt be even an empty box :(

[Jason]

I commend these guys for what they have achieved. I don't recall if the demo played well or not (it's been way too long to remember), but doing what they did is something special. I also commend them for trying to make money from the game. They've put in the time, so why not be rewarded for it? With that said, I won't be buying the game.

My point of view, which I have no doubt will make me a few enemies, is that I can't see myself spending money on it. Yes, it's a "new" game, and I'm sure it's going to be packaged and presented well, but buying Amiga games is something I don't do anymore. I'm not saying I pirate new titles, nor do I condone the practice, but I won't buy a new Amiga game. If that means I'll never get to play it, so be it.

I truly hope that in addition to the game that you can buy, a full version will also be made downloadable for free. The likelihood is that even if it was free, I'll play it for 1 hour and put it away never to be played again. Real life prevents me from spending too much time playing games nowadays, but it doesn't mean I wouldn't like the option of booting it up on occasion.

My memory is hazy, so I'm sure I'm leaving out a few details, but I seem to recall the Metal Warrior games on the C64 (or at least, the later ones), have both a pay and a free version. I seem to recall it did well enough in sales that they even had a "limited edition" version of one of them.

Those of us that are going to buy a game will buy it regardless of whether or not there's a free version, while those of us that never had any intention of buying will probably never buy it.

Anyway, best of luck.